How good are England?

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Post by Gil Thu Feb 27, 2014 4:42 pm

Goalkeepers: Fraser Forster (Celtic), Ben Foster (West Bromwich Albion), Joe Hart (Manchester City), John Ruddy (Norwich City).

Defenders: Leighton Baines (Everton), Gary Cahill (Chelsea), Steven Caulker (Cardiff City), Ashley Cole (Chelsea), Glen Johnson (Liverpool), Luke Shaw (Southampton), Chris Smalling (Manchester United), Kyle Walker (Tottenham Hotspur).

Midfielders: Ross Barkley (Everton), Michael Carrick (Manchester United), Tom Cleverley (Manchester United), Steven Gerrard (Liverpool), Jordan Henderson (Liverpool), Adam Lallana (Southampton), Frank Lampard (Chelsea), James Milner (Manchester City), Alex Oxlade-Chamberlain (Arsenal), Raheem Sterling (Liverpool), Andros Townsend (Tottenham Hotspur), Jack Wilshere (Arsenal).

Forwards: Jermain Defoe (Toronto FC), Rickie Lambert (Southampton), Jay Rodriguez (Southampton), Wayne Rooney (Manchester United), Daniel Sturridge (Liverpool), Daniel Welbeck (Manchester United).


*bleep* me. A whole lot of talent there. Reincarnation of the Euro 04 squad.


Last edited by Gil on Sat May 03, 2014 6:39 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Post by Zealous Thu Feb 27, 2014 4:55 pm

Unpopular opinion but some of those names are actually a lot better than they are given credit for.

Baines, Cahill, Shaw, Barkley, Lallana, Oxlade-Chamberlain, Jay Rodriguez, Henderson and Rooney are proper footballers imo

Lampard and Gerrard are past it but they have pedigree and can still offer you a lot by way of leadership.

Walker, Wilshere, Sterling and Sturridge obviously have a lot of talent but their approach to the game needs improving. They are still young though so making that next step is still possible for them.

I fancy England for a deep run in Brazil if they play their cards right. The quality is definitely there, just need to put the jig saw puzzle together.
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Post by Great Leader Sprucenuce Thu Feb 27, 2014 4:58 pm

Agreed Zeal.

Short answer to this would be.... Average? No.

Good enough to anything to get excited about? No

Lol.
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Post by izzy Thu Feb 27, 2014 4:59 pm

It's sad what has become of England.

It really is.
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Post by Zealous Thu Feb 27, 2014 5:03 pm

izzy wrote:It's sad what has become of England.

It really is.

This is something you would say in 1974, when England fell from being a truly elite national team not in 2014 lol
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Post by izzy Thu Feb 27, 2014 5:07 pm

Zealous wrote:This is something you would say in 1974, when England fell from being a truly elite national team not in 2014 lol

I'm not talking about the quality of the team, the whole NT set-up.

Since WC 2006, they don't seem to actually have a guideline they want to follow.

They seem lost and it's sad because we're in 2014 and it really doesn't look like changing.
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Post by sportsczy Thu Feb 27, 2014 5:08 pm

England's best possible outcome for the WC is getting out of the group stage...  after that, the quality isn't good enough.

There are some decent players there...  but nobody world class or even close to it other than Rooney.  That's not enough.  I also feel that the manager isn't very good; so there's a tactical handicap too.

The fact that the competition is not on European soil is always a recipe for disaster for European NTs.., which is unfortunate...
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Post by DeletedUser#1 Thu Feb 27, 2014 5:16 pm

Zealous wrote:Unpopular opinion but some of those names are actually a lot better than they are given credit for.

Baines, Cahill, Shaw, Barkley, Lallana, Oxlade-Chamberlain, Jay Rodriguez, Henderson and Rooney are proper footballers imo

Lampard and Gerrard are past it but they have pedigree and can still offer you a lot by way of leadership.

Walker, Wilshere, Sterling and Sturridge obviously have a lot of talent but their approach to the game needs improving. They are still young though so making that next step is still possible for them.

I fancy England for a deep run in Brazil if they play their cards right. The quality is definitely there, just need to put the jig saw puzzle together.

so Barkley and Jay Rodriguez are already proper footballers, while Wilshere and Sturrydge need to improve their approach to the game to get to their level ? hmm , sort of stuff you expect from hipster posters like Mole to say.....hmm

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Post by Gil Thu Feb 27, 2014 5:19 pm

I don't care what anyone says both the Euro 04 and WC 06 squads were legit. We just had piss poor coaching at the time.

A lot of people are eager to devalue the level of talent in both teams since they "failed" but only an idiot would fail to acknowledge the individual quality of those players.

Can't tell me overhyped and overrated youngsters like Henderson, Wilshere, Barkley etc are better than Gerrard, Lampard, Scholes, Owen, Beckham, Terry, Ferdinand, Campbell, Cole etc


Last edited by Gil on Thu Feb 27, 2014 5:22 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Post by Zealous Thu Feb 27, 2014 5:21 pm

sportsczy wrote:England's best possible outcome for the WC is getting out of the group stage...  after that, the quality isn't good enough.

There are some decent players there...  but nobody world class or even close to it other than Rooney.  That's not enough.  I also feel that the manager isn't very good; so there's a tactical handicap too.

The fact that the competition is not on European soil is always a recipe for disaster for European NTs.., which is unfortunate...

They would beat France.
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Post by BeautifulGame Thu Feb 27, 2014 5:22 pm

Hart

Chambers Terry Cahill Baines

Gerrard

Henderson Wilshere / Lallana

Rooney. Struddige. Sterling / Ox

This squad/ XI has enough in it to get into quarters IMO playing good attractive football as well.

Problem is they have a manager who prefers outdated 19th century football and selects players based on which club they play for rather than their performance imo
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Post by Ganso Thu Feb 27, 2014 5:23 pm

How can a team with the likes of Gerrard,Roonaay,Wilshere and Sturridge be average?They also have great secondary players like Sterling,Lampard,Henderson,Cahill,Baines etc

I dont care how low you guys rate them, England are one of the teams I would like to avoid in the WC.
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Post by Highburied Thu Feb 27, 2014 5:25 pm

Problem with England is 4-4-2 and english academies producing very little talent.

Getting rid of Hodgson would be a perfect start and hire bergkamp or someone who can teach english pöayers a couple techniques.

They stand no chance in this world cup.
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Post by Zealous Thu Feb 27, 2014 5:26 pm

Natalie Portman wrote:
Zealous wrote:Unpopular opinion but some of those names are actually a lot better than they are given credit for.

Baines, Cahill, Shaw, Barkley, Lallana, Oxlade-Chamberlain, Jay Rodriguez, Henderson and Rooney are proper footballers imo

Lampard and Gerrard are past it but they have pedigree and can still offer you a lot by way of leadership.

Walker, Wilshere, Sterling and Sturridge obviously have a lot of talent but their approach to the game needs improving. They are still young though so making that next step is still possible for them.

I fancy England for a deep run in Brazil if they play their cards right. The quality is definitely there, just need to put the jig saw puzzle together.

so Barkley and Jay Rodriguez are already proper footballers, while Wilshere and Sturrydge need to improve their approach to the game to get to their level ? hmm, sort of stuff you expect from hipster posters like Mole to say.....hmm

I hold Wilshere to a higher standard because he can be the centre piece of England if he wants to be, but he needs to make the next step by improving how he plays.

Sturridge is a great talent, maybe the best of the lot, but his game could be sooooo much better if he made the effort. He needs to thank his lucky stars that he plays with Suarez, who can accommodate him but he won't have that luxury with England.

Barkley and Jay can obviously get better but imo all they need is more experience. Their weaknesses are there but they aren't holding them back from developing.
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Post by DuringTheWar Thu Feb 27, 2014 5:28 pm

Who is Jay Rodriguez? Can some of dem hipsters on here shed some light on who this man is?

And why the feck are Southampton dominating the England team? The only good players from there play for arsenal, apart from shaw

Scrubs, scrubs everywhere
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Post by vivabarca38 Thu Feb 27, 2014 5:30 pm

Hart
Walker/Johnson-Cahill-Terry-Shaw/Cole

Carrick-Gerrard
Barkley
Rooney-Lallana
Sturridge
Subs:Forster/Foster-Shaw/Cole-Johnson/Walker-Smalling-Rodriguez-Sterling-Wilshere-Milner

Looks like a pretty strong lineup to me.They'd just have to convince Terry to come back and the team would be pretty strong,and even then Englands's main issue is not scoring not bad defending.
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Post by REWB Thu Feb 27, 2014 5:42 pm

when gibbs comes back from injury he should be in the starting 11, he has been the best english lb this season. better than baines (because he is more technique/athletic and shaw more experience on the big stage.
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Post by BarrileteCosmico Thu Feb 27, 2014 5:55 pm

England should merge with Wales for Team Britain so they can call up future Ballon d'Or winners Ramsey and Bale.
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Post by Curtinho Thu Feb 27, 2014 6:09 pm

I must be the only person that thinks England is being underrated here, and that they could reach as far as the semis this summer?

If you have a starting XI of:

Johnson/Walker - Cahill - Jagielka - Baines
Sterling - Carrick - Gerrard - Lallana
Sturridge - Rooney

It's a dangerous team for anyone to play against truthfully. I wouldn't count them out.
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Post by Le Samourai Thu Feb 27, 2014 6:10 pm

DuringTheWar wrote:Who is Jay Rodriguez? Can some of dem hipsters on here shed some light on who this man is?

And why the feck are Southampton dominating the England team? The only good players from there play for arsenal, apart from shaw

Scrubs, scrubs everywhere

For a moment there I actually mistook him for Jose Baxter, thinking maybe the undisputed GOAT of Fifa 09 had finally made something of himself.....\

But nah, he's in the third division.
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Post by Robespierre Thu Feb 27, 2014 6:11 pm

it is average compared to past England NT  , who didn't get good results because of coaches and jinx mainly.
now this England is in transition phase , and when you are in transition phase you see best players in declining phase ,  some scrub to fill the squad and good player who are hyped for the general context. These are the main 3 factors.
Then of course there are also important players not in declining , as in this case ( Sturridge and Wilshere on all but also some other)  but they have never leaded the England and so you can't have same confidence you had with Gerrard,Lampard or the old Wazza

Anyway even Italy and Uruguay the 2 opponents are not in a situation so different.
Infact Italy is also in a transition phase and it seems average compared to past but Prandelli gave that surplus and Italy disputed a great WC then it's normal to lose against a NT as Spain defintely stronger.

For this reason , compared to my situation , my main skeptitism is about Hodgson more than players infact, we know him , an average coach good to lead clubs as Fulham or NT as Swiss.
Anyway the group stage must be passed and then " que sera sera " , everything will be earned .Much depends if Sturridge will play as to Liverpool. He's sufficient his name and Wazza because I don't underrated you for the qualification.
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Post by VendettaRed07 Thu Feb 27, 2014 6:13 pm

Roy takes them down from being slightly above average to slightly below.
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Post by BeautifulGame Thu Feb 27, 2014 6:14 pm

El Cujo wrote:I must be the only person that thinks England is being underrated here, and that they could reach as far as the semis this summer?

If you have a starting XI of:

Johnson/Walker - Cahill - Jagielka - Baines
Sterling - Carrick - Gerrard - Lallana
Sturridge - Rooney

It's a dangerous team for anyone to play against truthfully. I wouldn't count them out.

Lallana ahead of CT23 Laughing

Woy will be going nuts
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Post by Art Morte Thu Feb 27, 2014 6:36 pm

They'll prove the doubters wrong :coffee:
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Post by sportsczy Thu Feb 27, 2014 6:49 pm

Zealous wrote:
sportsczy wrote:England's best possible outcome for the WC is getting out of the group stage...  after that, the quality isn't good enough.

There are some decent players there...  but nobody world class or even close to it other than Rooney.  That's not enough.  I also feel that the manager isn't very good; so there's a tactical handicap too.

The fact that the competition is not on European soil is always a recipe for disaster for European NTs.., which is unfortunate...

They would beat France.
Laughing No.  But it's nice to dream.  Best England could do was draw us in the Euro (while parking the bus)... and that was with Mexes-Rami crap CB partnership and the horrific Alou Diarra-M'Vila double pivot.  Now you're looking at Varane-Koscielny, Pogba-Matuidi-Cabaye mid AND Griezmann to join Ribery/Benzema.  Talent is very good with France in the top 11 if injuries allow...  Not elite by any chance, but really good and with a lot of upside there.

Griezmann and DIgne both got their first callups today.
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