Re: Pique suspected Guardiola detectives

by Guest Fri Mar 22, 2013 6:17 pm

If you ever become a manager you will learn that blind trust will often get you walked all over.

I'm glad you mention the contract situation, I am curious to know if anything like this is mentioned in a contract. Bottom line is that these players have a responsibility to their employers and I have no issue with a manager making sure his players are following certain guidelines. Keep in mind that Pep is not Pique's employer, so there goes that logic. Pep is merely a manager who is going above and beyond do make sure he is getting HIS job done (something that certain players were not doing).

The Nature Boy wrote:

Professional athletes are public figures and the standard for privacy is different, so I see your point. However, when someone is being paid to deliberately invade said privacy and use the intelligence that they get to formulate opinions and possible consequences for the actions inherent to the information obtained, it is different, at least IMO.

If certain players are out in the public when they "should" be in the privacy of their own homes sleeping, there is no privacy being broken (hence the word out in the public). Not sure if you recall Ronaldinho having fans capture images of him because he was out late partying when he should have been at home resting his body. I know that gridiron football players have been know to have curfews and if they break them, they are liable liable for fines and such.

by Guest Fri Mar 22, 2013 6:19 pm

The Nature Boy wrote:
BTW, this is all LEGAL (not illegal) the issue is more betrayal of trust and invasion of privacy.

Aren't said players breaking that trust by being out late when they are supposed to be home and resting?

I highly doubt that Pep put private investigators on players because he assumed they were breaking the rules that have been set forth. The privacy thing is irrelevant, that comes with the territory of being a public figure. They were not complaining when they signed those multimillion dollar contracts.

by BarrileteCosmico Fri Mar 22, 2013 6:27 pm

Professional athletes are public figures and the standard for privacy is different, so I see your point. However, when someone is being paid to deliberately invade said privacy and use the intelligence that they get to formulate opinions and possible consequences for the actions inherent to the information obtained, it is different, at least IMO.

You could argue that rag magazines that just publish fotos of people so that they can make up stories and sully celebrities names do the same thing, but the big difference is that that magazine isn't your employer. they cannot terminate your contract or do any other such thing. and before people say barca wouldn't have taken in that far, then why hire a dick in the first place?

So it's okay if a rag magazine does it but not if the employer does it? What's the difference if they're doing the same thing? If it was the rag magazine that caught Pique instead of a private PI going to nightclubs and posted it the result would be the same: Pep would have a word with Pique. It's either not okay for both or okay for both to do it.

by Guest Fri Mar 22, 2013 6:28 pm

Pique and Pep were being paid by the same employer...

by Rebaño Sagrado Fri Mar 22, 2013 6:29 pm

highburied wrote:
Swagg wrote:Disgusting club..

by Albiceleste Fri Mar 22, 2013 6:31 pm

I can see why he would tbh, the way his form has been over the past few years.

Lex wrote:

comedy gold lex as per usual

by The Nature Boy Fri Mar 22, 2013 6:36 pm

yes, they are indeed breaking the trust. And with that, I don't necessarily have a problem. And yes, when you become a public figure, you are subjected to certain things that are undesirable. For sure.

Its different when it is your employer. The multimillion-dollar contracts has nothing to do with it either. They could have been following scrubs too for all we know.

My problem with this is the whole principal of the thing. The betrayal of trust by the player can be repaid by performance on the pitch, and the manager can instill trust in a player by ensuring that they won't have them followed by a PI.

by Guest Fri Mar 22, 2013 6:39 pm

Did you not read my post, Nature Boy? Pep is not the employer, he is the manager of his players and it is his job to ensure that his players are doing their jobs properly. Pep and Pique work for the same employer.

You need to get over this trust thing, players often move clubs and clubs often sell players. This is a business, not a personal relationship. Keep in mind that these players broke that initial trust, so I fail to see your logic when it comes to the whole trust factor. If a manager leaves his employees unattended, nine times out ten the work level is going to decrease.

by The Nature Boy Fri Mar 22, 2013 6:52 pm

ranDOM 10 wrote:Did you not read my post, Nature Boy? Pep is not the employer, he is the manager of his players and it is his job to ensure that his players are doing their jobs properly. Pep and Pique work for the same employer.

You need to get over this trust thing, players often move clubs and clubs often sell players. This is a business, not a personal relationship. Keep in mind that these players broke that initial trust, so I fail to see your logic when it comes to the whole trust factor. If a manager leaves his employees unattended, nine times out ten the work level is going to decrease.

I did read, i missed that part though. Like I said I'm at work so I missed that. I think you are missing why I am disgusted by this. Its not the fact that the employer (pep or barcelona or whoever) have the right to monitor the players, its the way that its done. Its sneaky, its not face to face, its subterfuge. These are players that give their all (most), sacrifice a lot an in turn get paid. Im not sure being spied on is part of the equation.

I just don't like the manner in which it happens. You are not wrong that (legally) the club is within their rights to ensure that the product that is ut on the field, which makes them money (protection of investments) is a quality one. Not one that is hung over, strung out, or whatever you want to say.

I guess I'm old school and just prefer a face to face confrontation.

by Guest Fri Mar 22, 2013 6:56 pm

I grew up with an old school father and I was raised to do my job whether my manager is around or not. Players who follow through do not seem to have been spied on. It seems we shall agree to disagree (but please keep in mind that I do understand your point Thumbs up

)

by The Nature Boy Fri Mar 22, 2013 6:57 pm

BarrileteCosmico wrote:
Professional athletes are public figures and the standard for privacy is different, so I see your point. However, when someone is being paid to deliberately invade said privacy and use the intelligence that they get to formulate opinions and possible consequences for the actions inherent to the information obtained, it is different, at least IMO.

You could argue that rag magazines that just publish fotos of people so that they can make up stories and sully celebrities names do the same thing, but the big difference is that that magazine isn't your employer. they cannot terminate your contract or do any other such thing. and before people say barca wouldn't have taken in that far, then why hire a dick in the first place?
So it's okay if a rag magazine does it but not if the employer does it? What's the difference if they're doing the same thing? If it was the rag magazine that caught Pique instead of a private PI going to nightclubs and posted it the result would be the same: Pep would have a word with Pique. It's either not okay for both or okay for both to do it.

Its not really OK if a silly tabloid does it either, but then again, celebrities are public figures with a different standard of privacy. Alfred, think about it though. you have no idea about those paparazzi most of the time. Your boss, or your bosses boss spying on you is different. I don't really have a problem with what the end result is, as employers have a right to protect their investment, yet spying on them is a bit over the top. You the employer decide to get in bed with the people you hire and you must live with that decision for better or worse.

Im 99% positive that if a solid player like Pique got cut from Barca because he had a PI on him that reported he liked the night life too much, every club in Europe would sign him without a second thought.

again, I just don't like the method. Im not calling Barca a disgusting club, I just wholeheartedly disagree with their method. Having language in a contract that states that this sort of treatment is to be expect, however, would change my opinion entirely.

by The Nature Boy Fri Mar 22, 2013 6:58 pm

ranDOM 10 wrote:I grew up with an old school father and I was raised to do my job whether my manager is around or not. Players who follow through do not seem to have been spied on. It seems we shall agree to disagree (but please keep in mind that I do understand your point )

Right. see that, I agree with too. I grew up the same way, you do your job the right way no matter what. You can't expect to be perfect but as long as you do what your told when it comes to work, you can look back and say at the end of the day I did the right thing.

by Onyx Fri Mar 22, 2013 7:11 pm

The Nature Boy wrote:
Yohan Modric wrote:It's just the job they do requires them to be focused. I doubt they'd get privacy anyway considering they're famous footballers.

my job requires me to be focused, among other things like obeying the law, and doing things that would be deemed as responsible behavior by a public employee.

If i stray from those things, I am subject to termination. If they based the termination of my contract on information they obtained from a private eye, there would be hell to pay.

BTW, this is all LEGAL (not illegal) the issue is more betrayal of trust and invasion of privacy.

But those people are trained to do all of that and I'm sure they report accurately.

I'm sure players wouldn't want someone following them around etc. That's why it's better doing it secretly.

by The Nature Boy Fri Mar 22, 2013 7:20 pm

Yohan i don't really follow your last post (night being an asshole, just saying its difficult to understand).

PLayers don't want people following them around, but they have fans so its only natural. Some people are in the sport for that reason. Still would bug the shit out of me if people had me followed on purpose.

And doing it secretly is better for the people following, but IMO worse for those being followed.

by Onyx Fri Mar 22, 2013 7:23 pm

Yeh but there's a difference between security following/protecting you and fans following you. In fact doing it secretly is probably a more respectful way, because it just mean someone's keeping an eye on the players. Having someone follow a player is probably childish, because it would mean the players can't go anywhere without someone.

by The Nature Boy Fri Mar 22, 2013 9:17 pm

Aaaah ... I didn'tknow that you meant follow as in security detail/protection.

by FennecFox7 Sat Mar 23, 2013 12:11 am

Se7en wrote:
Yohan Modric wrote:Maybe Pep just wanted his players to behave properly and stay focused.

Interesting theory

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