De Jong replacement

+5
tonger
KR10
redblack88
Milantildeath
Dante
9 posters

Go down

De Jong replacement Empty De Jong replacement

Post by Dante Mon Dec 10, 2012 10:05 am

First of all , we have players to replace him , but.. 1) his contribution in our possesion play and 2) his ability to never lose his position , will be missed , regardless of who replaces him. It's the combination of the two that made him so important.

Ambro does the 2nd , but lacks the first trait these days.. Flamini has the first , but lacks the 2nd. Muntari will need time to be introduced and Nocerino must definitely not change position .

I don't know about Strasser. We have the Captain , Flamini and Muntari to replace De Jong and Allegri would make Strasser a regular ? Not sure , but nevertheless , he will find more playing time now than with De Jong there.

There's also the option to make a signing , but other than Cigarini , i am not sure who would replace him there. There's also Poli , but it would hardly replace De Jong , if not at all.

In the end , i hope De Jong makes a solid recovery and comes back stronger . Personaly , i would give it to Flamini and let either Ambro or Strasser replace him when necessary .
Dante
Dante
Fan Favorite
Fan Favorite

Club Supported : AC Milan
Posts : 5460
Join date : 2011-07-09
Age : 31

Back to top Go down

De Jong replacement Empty Re: De Jong replacement

Post by Milantildeath Mon Dec 10, 2012 3:32 pm

I would not mind looking like this until January, then making some changes.

----------------------------Abbiati
Abate----------Mexes--------------Acerbi----------De Sciglio

----------------------------Nocerino
-----------------Montolivo-----------Urby

--------Robinho-------------------------------------SES
-----------------------------Pazzini
Milantildeath
Milantildeath
First Team
First Team

Club Supported : AC Milan
Posts : 2275
Join date : 2011-06-05

Back to top Go down

De Jong replacement Empty Re: De Jong replacement

Post by Dante Mon Dec 10, 2012 4:18 pm

I felt like that before about Noce. But i was wrong. Noce's characteristics and play would get to waste there and he wouldn't even come close to replicate what De Jong has managed there.

Flamini can do it , honestly. Either him or Ambro must fill NDJ shoes most of the time. Prefferably, Ambro on the last two CL games Laughing , Flamini in Serie A and Strasser for the cup .

Muntari is the last player i would trust there , naive and irrational are the only words i can spare for his ugly ass. Better fight it off with Noce or gtfo if he doesn't like :coffee:

Dante
Dante
Fan Favorite
Fan Favorite

Club Supported : AC Milan
Posts : 5460
Join date : 2011-07-09
Age : 31

Back to top Go down

De Jong replacement Empty Re: De Jong replacement

Post by redblack88 Mon Dec 10, 2012 5:28 pm

IMO Ambrosini is perfect for that role, but he's too old to play all season. Flamini and Noce cannot play in that position (Noce is perfect on the left, Flamini is perfect on the bench...). Maybe Muntari would fit, but I honestly hope we spend some money on the market to buy somebody like Strootman.
redblack88
redblack88
Prospect
Prospect

Club Supported : AC Milan
Posts : 32
Join date : 2012-08-30
Age : 34

Back to top Go down

De Jong replacement Empty Re: De Jong replacement

Post by KR10 Mon Dec 10, 2012 5:34 pm

We needed a vice-Montolivo and now we needa vice-Dejong as well. What we need is someone who is capable of anchoring the midfield with good passing and distribution as well. This way, he can start at DM and replace Monty when required as well.

2 words. KEVIN. STROOTMAN.

KR10
Hot Prospect
Hot Prospect

Club Supported : AC Milan
Posts : 293
Join date : 2011-06-06

Back to top Go down

De Jong replacement Empty Re: De Jong replacement

Post by Dante Mon Dec 10, 2012 6:09 pm

As about Strootman ..
1) do you know how average he is defensively ?
2) do you know how much similar to Montolivo he is , thus making it difficult not only to replace De Jong , but to sign him in the first place ..

His creative part is what makes Strootman , not his ability to protect the defence or read the game and disrupt it .Those are still part of his game , but he would hardly prove an adequate replacement for De Jong .He would handle the possesion way better , perhaps throw one or two surprise assists here and there , but on counters and marking players , he would prove quite average right now. IMO , Strootman would be , idealy , Montolivo's replacement.

_

The ideal option on the market this moment , would be De Rossi. But Laughing , dreaming would do us no good as things stand.

So my option would be Flamini , only because Ambrosini can't play on regular basis without side effects . Flamini, he is solid defensively and can play a simple pass or two, though his passing game is average at best. In any case , Flamini knows the DM job , it's his original position afterall.

If Allegri trusts him , i am confident he will pleasantly surprise fans and critics alike.
Dante
Dante
Fan Favorite
Fan Favorite

Club Supported : AC Milan
Posts : 5460
Join date : 2011-07-09
Age : 31

Back to top Go down

De Jong replacement Empty Re: De Jong replacement

Post by Milantildeath Mon Dec 10, 2012 7:34 pm

In case everyone forgot Nocerino played as a regista for Palermo, he can run forever and make simple passes. Nocerino in my opinion would be the best player for that position.
Milantildeath
Milantildeath
First Team
First Team

Club Supported : AC Milan
Posts : 2275
Join date : 2011-06-05

Back to top Go down

De Jong replacement Empty Re: De Jong replacement

Post by tonger Mon Dec 10, 2012 8:32 pm

would be interesting if nocerino play there, because his most valuable asset imo right now is his runs up the field and go the front of the goal, taking the opportunities. However there is absolutely no way he can do this if he wants to replace dejong, as our back 4 would be very much exposed.

Id play more strasser if hes with the first team, in combination with ambro, and when ambro is tired, flamini can jump in.
tonger
tonger
Starlet
Starlet

Club Supported : AC Milan
Posts : 704
Join date : 2011-06-05
Age : 35

Back to top Go down

De Jong replacement Empty Re: De Jong replacement

Post by dostoevsky Mon Dec 10, 2012 9:30 pm

Nocerino was not a regista for Palermo, rather he was playing the same role as he has had under Allegri, an industrious role as a mezzala. During Nocerino's time at Palermo, players such as Bacinovic or Migiliaccio played at the base of the midfield and held the responsibilities of distribution which come with such a position. The closest Nocerino has come to assuming serious responsibility for the recycling of possession from the deep came during the very short time he spent in the pivot with Montolivo as a substitute for De Jong, a role he performed well, however it's significantly different to that required under the 4-3-3.

Until the January transfer market opens we should take the opportunity to test each reliable option in such a position. During the week we will be taking on Reggina in the Coppa Italia and it will be an ideal opportunity to test both Strasser and Flamini in this position. It is undoubtedly a role that Ambrosini can comfortably fulfil, however it is too much to ask of a player of his years to regularly play. Muntari's an alternative, however again, his time has largely been spent in a disciplined role but one next to an organiser or enforcer in midfield, such as last year with Van Bommel, though I do believe he could pull off the role against the lesser teams. He'd be a disaster in the Champions League if we were to use him there though.

Nocerino might still be worth a go, however the fact that he is already part of our first choice midfield merely opens up another hole in the team, something which Urby must still prove he is capable of filling.

Starting against Reggina, the likes of Strasser, Flamini, Muntari and Urby have a lot to prove about their ability to cut it in our midfield. Personally I'd like to see Strasser groomed for the position, whilst Flamini might provide some use for the first time in his career if he can finally realise that he's not a centre forward.
dostoevsky
dostoevsky
Super Moderator
Super Moderator

Club Supported : AC Milan
Posts : 7557
Join date : 2011-06-06

Back to top Go down

De Jong replacement Empty Re: De Jong replacement

Post by KR10 Mon Dec 10, 2012 9:47 pm

Dante wrote:As about Strootman ..
1) do you know how average he is defensively ?
2) do you know how much similar to Montolivo he is , thus making it difficult not only to replace De Jong , but to sign him in the first place ..

His creative part is what makes Strootman , not his ability to protect the defence or read the game and disrupt it .Those are still part of his game , but he would hardly prove an adequate replacement for De Jong .He would handle the possesion way better , perhaps throw one or two surprise assists here and there , but on counters and marking players , he would prove quite average right now. IMO , Strootman would be , idealy , Montolivo's replacement.

_

The ideal option on the market this moment , would be De Rossi. But Laughing , dreaming would do us no good as things stand.

So my option would be Flamini , only because Ambrosini can't play on regular basis without side effects . Flamini, he is solid defensively and can play a simple pass or two, though his passing game is average at best. In any case , Flamini knows the DM job , it's his original position afterall.

If Allegri trusts him , i am confident he will pleasantly surprise fans and critics alike.

To be honest, i don't know much about Strootman besides the fact that he's touted as Van Bommel's hier - that fact made me assume he was good in his defensive duties as well.

Point is we should ideally get someone who can play holding midfield as well as replace Monty when needed. A DM with good distribution, someone like Essien back in the day.

I haven't seen much of Strasser, but he has been around our first team for ages and i'm sure has learned a thing or two from Ambro and Gattuso.

Maybe we should loan Van Bommel again...

KR10
Hot Prospect
Hot Prospect

Club Supported : AC Milan
Posts : 293
Join date : 2011-06-06

Back to top Go down

De Jong replacement Empty Re: De Jong replacement

Post by Milantildeath Mon Dec 10, 2012 10:41 pm

dostoevsky wrote:Nocerino was not a regista for Palermo, rather he was playing the same role as he has had under Allegri, an industrious role as a mezzala. During Nocerino's time at Palermo, players such as Bacinovic or Migiliaccio played at the base of the midfield and held the responsibilities of distribution which come with such a position. The closest Nocerino has come to assuming serious responsibility for the recycling of possession from the deep came during the very short time he spent in the pivot with Montolivo as a substitute for De Jong, a role he performed well, however it's significantly different to that required under the 4-3-3.

Until the January transfer market opens we should take the opportunity to test each reliable option in such a position. During the week we will be taking on Reggina in the Coppa Italia and it will be an ideal opportunity to test both Strasser and Flamini in this position. It is undoubtedly a role that Ambrosini can comfortably fulfil, however it is too much to ask of a player of his years to regularly play. Muntari's an alternative, however again, his time has largely been spent in a disciplined role but one next to an organiser or enforcer in midfield, such as last year with Van Bommel, though I do believe he could pull off the role against the lesser teams. He'd be a disaster in the Champions League if we were to use him there though.

Nocerino might still be worth a go, however the fact that he is already part of our first choice midfield merely opens up another hole in the team, something which Urby must still prove he is capable of filling.

Starting against Reggina, the likes of Strasser, Flamini, Muntari and Urby have a lot to prove about their ability to cut it in our midfield. Personally I'd like to see Strasser groomed for the position, whilst Flamini might provide some use for the first time in his career if he can finally realise that he's not a centre forward.

I have to respectfully disagree with you on that. Nocerino did play as a regista, not full time but he would switch from Mezz'ala to regista. It was actually up for debate a lot on who would play there with he and Migliaccio. Then once Bacinovic came in Nocerino and Migliaccio played as Mezz'ala. Also to be noted once Palermo played a three back Nocerino played every game as the regista in that formation.
Milantildeath
Milantildeath
First Team
First Team

Club Supported : AC Milan
Posts : 2275
Join date : 2011-06-05

Back to top Go down

De Jong replacement Empty Re: De Jong replacement

Post by Milantildeath Mon Dec 10, 2012 10:44 pm

Against Reggina we sould try Nocerino as the Regista, it won't hurt at all to try it.
Milantildeath
Milantildeath
First Team
First Team

Club Supported : AC Milan
Posts : 2275
Join date : 2011-06-05

Back to top Go down

De Jong replacement Empty Re: De Jong replacement

Post by dostoevsky Mon Dec 10, 2012 11:13 pm

I can't claim to have watched every game of Palermo when they switched to a three-man backline, however I watched quite a few, and I can't remember any of them in which I'd describe Nocerino's work as that of a regista. The only unusual position I can recall him assuming was that of a makeshift LWB when the squad was reduced by injuries and suspensions. I can certainly say that I've never seen Nocerino play as a regista in a full strength Palermo side. I personally don't rate Bacinovic very highly, so I would accept that Nocerino could potentially be his equal in the role, however the role doesn't play to his strengths in any way.

Our replacement for De Jong, whoever they are, must first and foremost be positionally sound and not give the ball away cheaply, certainly not whilst playing short balls out from the base of midfield. Nocerino's greatest strengths are his endurance, intelligent off the ball movement and clinical finishing ability, none of which are best exploited by his use at the base of our formation.

I would only approve of Nocerino's use here if another player failed to make the position his own, given that Nocerino's better in his own role than any of our other midfielders. The likes of Flamini and Muntari will have to assume more responsibility in either one of these roles, my personal feeling is that they're likely to do better in a more disciplined, less expressive role, if they are to prove adequate at all.

dostoevsky
dostoevsky
Super Moderator
Super Moderator

Club Supported : AC Milan
Posts : 7557
Join date : 2011-06-06

Back to top Go down

De Jong replacement Empty Re: De Jong replacement

Post by Milantildeath Mon Dec 10, 2012 11:34 pm

at the time Bacinovic was regarded as very promising, and the only way to have all three of them play was to move both Nocerino and Migliaccio higher. They played a 4-3-2-1 that actually worked very well until some players dipped in form. It was largely due to the departure of Cavani in my opinion and the over-reliance of Miccoli. Then the manager was sacked (Delio Rossi). Zamparini brought in Cosmi as manager and he played with the 3-4-3 with Nocerino as the Regista, Balzaretti was the LWB, and Cassani the RWB. All of this is besides the point though. We all know that Muntari will be put there. I personally like him, but no one agrees with me. I posted about it in another thread.
Milantildeath
Milantildeath
First Team
First Team

Club Supported : AC Milan
Posts : 2275
Join date : 2011-06-05

Back to top Go down

De Jong replacement Empty Re: De Jong replacement

Post by dostoevsky Mon Dec 10, 2012 11:47 pm

I wouldn't go so far as to say that I like Muntari, however I do believe that he was a solid player for us last season when he arrived. He was relatively wasteful in possession and shot far too often rather than looking for a team mate when he did venture forward, however he provided balance next to Van Bommel. He understood his role well and did what was required of him, I think you'll find that many appreciate what he did for us. The doubts that exist over Muntari concern his consistency and his ability to take on more responsibility in midfield given the absence of other important elements - things that he has traditionally struggled to do during his career. Muntari is fine if used in a limited role, however he's proven unreliable over the long term in his career. He certainly has no role in the future as far as our starting line-up goes, however right now he might provide useful cover. He needs to keep his head in line and simply focus on doing the simple things well. Hold his position, choose simple passes and don't get sent off.
dostoevsky
dostoevsky
Super Moderator
Super Moderator

Club Supported : AC Milan
Posts : 7557
Join date : 2011-06-06

Back to top Go down

De Jong replacement Empty Re: De Jong replacement

Post by tonger Tue Dec 11, 2012 12:59 pm

muntari did great with the short time he had with us, but the role he played was similar to that of nocerino, not nigel de jong if i remember correctly, but like MTD said, the copa match is the best time to test a "risky" but "high reward" option at the regista. and imo if strasser plays well there, it has the "highest reward". we wont have to shift players around in terms of position, and we get a young replacement for de jong, strasser would finally get some solid minutes etc.
tonger
tonger
Starlet
Starlet

Club Supported : AC Milan
Posts : 704
Join date : 2011-06-05
Age : 35

Back to top Go down

De Jong replacement Empty Re: De Jong replacement

Post by Forza Tue Dec 11, 2012 6:23 pm

Strasser is my preferred solution - or at least he is the solution that should be tested first.
Forza
Forza
Fan Favorite
Fan Favorite

Club Supported : Fulham
Posts : 8871
Join date : 2011-06-06

Back to top Go down

De Jong replacement Empty Re: De Jong replacement

Post by Kaladin Tue Dec 11, 2012 6:52 pm

Forza Rossoneri wrote:Strasser is my preferred solution - or at least he is the solution that should be tested first.

Agreed, for all we know he could have vast amounts of potential.....or he could be just another fodder player
Kaladin
Kaladin
Stormblessed

Club Supported : Real Madrid
Posts : 24496
Join date : 2012-06-28
Age : 29

Back to top Go down

De Jong replacement Empty Re: De Jong replacement

Post by forza.milan Tue Dec 11, 2012 7:01 pm

Kucka on loan? Good tackler, decent distribution, cheap, can return to Genoa once De Jong is healthy again.
forza.milan
forza.milan
Prospect
Prospect

Club Supported : AC Milan
Posts : 137
Join date : 2012-07-13

Back to top Go down

De Jong replacement Empty Re: De Jong replacement

Post by Forza Tue Dec 11, 2012 7:11 pm

forza.milan wrote:Kucka on loan? Good tackler, decent distribution, cheap, can return to Genoa once De Jong is healthy again.
Inter tried a similar thing with Kucka a few yrs ago and it didn't work out for them.
Forza
Forza
Fan Favorite
Fan Favorite

Club Supported : Fulham
Posts : 8871
Join date : 2011-06-06

Back to top Go down

De Jong replacement Empty Re: De Jong replacement

Post by Milantildeath Tue Dec 11, 2012 7:22 pm

lets all not forget Ambrosini. Allegri will have first choice for him over everyone. I know he legs can't do it, but with the proper rest he can do well in big games. We should have Strasser and Muntari battle for Serie A and coppa Italia matches and leave champions league to Ambrosini.
Milantildeath
Milantildeath
First Team
First Team

Club Supported : AC Milan
Posts : 2275
Join date : 2011-06-05

Back to top Go down

De Jong replacement Empty Re: De Jong replacement

Post by Dante Tue Dec 11, 2012 7:47 pm

Milantildeath wrote:lets all not forget Ambrosini. Allegri will have first choice for him over everyone. I know he legs can't do it, but with the proper rest he can do well in big games. We should have Strasser and Muntari battle for Serie A and coppa Italia matches and leave champions league to Ambrosini.

I all in for Ambro playing the CL . It'll be just two games afterall Laughing

Anyway. I've read some interesting posts and suggestions. I have to say at this point , the worst i find to be Kucka. We simply can do better than that. Muntari , he will be in Allegri's plans for that position for sure , but it remains to be seen i guess.I am against him being handed a first team spot , for reasons clear as daylight.

He's behaviour off the pitch is naive for a pro , he's behaviour on the pitch is irrational often. From not being able to hold on to position , to overkills and not to mention how long he was sidelined .

I like the idea of Strasser , he's not a kid anymore. Allegri should give him a chance in the cup, him and Flamini. Ambro has nothing to prove , if he's able or the others can't do it , he'll just play the most important games.

Having said that , i think we aren't getting that easily away with it .. unless someone takes real control of that place , we must move on the market.
Dante
Dante
Fan Favorite
Fan Favorite

Club Supported : AC Milan
Posts : 5460
Join date : 2011-07-09
Age : 31

Back to top Go down

De Jong replacement Empty Re: De Jong replacement

Post by Milantildeath Tue Dec 11, 2012 7:54 pm

Another option is Montolivo, lets all not forget he can play there as well. He can play very well there as well.
Milantildeath
Milantildeath
First Team
First Team

Club Supported : AC Milan
Posts : 2275
Join date : 2011-06-05

Back to top Go down

De Jong replacement Empty Re: De Jong replacement

Post by Forza Tue Dec 11, 2012 7:59 pm

Milantildeath wrote:Another option is Montolivo, lets all not forget he can play there as well. He can play very well there as well.
We need him more in his current role though.
Forza
Forza
Fan Favorite
Fan Favorite

Club Supported : Fulham
Posts : 8871
Join date : 2011-06-06

Back to top Go down

De Jong replacement Empty Re: De Jong replacement

Post by Sponsored content


Sponsored content


Back to top Go down

Back to top

- Similar topics

 
Permissions in this forum:
You cannot reply to topics in this forum