Mano Menezes explains why Marcelo/Hernanes/Hulk are out of the Copa América squad

sportsczy wrote:

I do think the Brazil coach is overreacting. You give a young kid who is clearly your best at the position a chance to redeem himself.

But if Marcelo got called up now, he would think he is the boss, and would fake injuries again, and think he can do whatever.. and that would lead other players to do the same. Mano has to make a stand. He'll give Marcelo more chances after the Copa.

rsinatra wrote:

sportsczy wrote:

I do think the Brazil coach is overreacting. You give a young kid who is clearly your best at the position a chance to redeem himself.

But if Marcelo got called up now, he would think he is the boss, and would fake injuries again, and think he can do whatever.. and that would lead other players to do the same. Mano has to make a stand. He'll give Marcelo more chances after the Copa.

Making a stand going into major competitions is stupid imo. Call him on the squad and bench him for a game or two... you owe it to your country to call up the best.

France has been doing this "take a stand" bs for 10 years and it almost destroyed the NT.

rsinatra wrote:

buddytaller wrote:Someone is being economical with the truth. I’m finding it hard to believe Menezes’ side of the story, if he rates Marcelo so highly, why did he call him up for the national team only once. He had continuously ignored the player even after visiting Real Madrid’s training camp to have an up close view of him and Kaka. It’s quite clear that he never rated Marcelo so highly in the first place, so what’s with the hypocrisy.

Lol so much speculation. Would Mano just make up these stories if he didn't have some sort of proof?

Whoever rated Marcelo highly before the 10-11 season? He was on constant improvement, but I think that it was pretty much fair that he first got a call-up against Scotland.

Again, Marcelo is not the first one to actually show up for the NT, and then fake an injury. It causes a better impression than not going at all. It's simple logic, really.

Why would Real Madrid get mad at Mano? I think it's normal that they want their player to prioritize things. I remember Roma's GK Doni lost his position as a starter when he decided to go play for Brazil, and nobody tried to hide it.

Now, will Marcelo get mad? Probably. Is he bigger than Brazil? No, never, and in fact, he is nothing to us as of now, and he won't be until he can prove it otherwise. Other than that, I like him at Real Madrid.

FYI Marcelo made his international debut as a teenager before joining Real Madrid during the early years of Dunga's reign when he was first choice left back, he even scored on his debut with Scotland if my memory serves me right. He lost out on that position after he failed to secure a regular place in Madrid.

Menezes has reason to lie, as he has come under a lot of pressure over his player selection. Marcelo’s form was brilliant for most of this season, and merited at least an earlier call up to re-launch his international career. He doesn’t rate Marcelo as highly as he expects us to believe in this interview, I find nothing wrong not liking a player but pretending to like him just because you are under pressure over your squad selection just reeks of hypocrisy.

These allegations against Real Madrid are serious, from what Menezes is saying Madrid sent an email to someone which suggested they ordered their player to feign injury in order to avoid playing for the National team. That would do the image of the club no good, especially in Brazil where the club has a good following due to the number of Brazilians who have played for the club in recent years.

Like I said, I hope the report is nothing but a writer’s fantasy but if it is true expect a reaction from Madrid pretty soon. You cannot make such allegations without backing them up.

Makes perfect sense to me, its about what I expected in terms of Hulk.

Dont know how Marcelo is still getting people calling for him, what more do you need? You cant fake injuries, the coach know it and then still get a call up next time.

What he said about Hulk is correct, I been saying it from the start, he isnt using him in his correct position, he isnt a number 9 with his back to goal.


I understand too why Robinho goes over him, its unfortunate.

Dude.... Marcelo sucked until March. He was horrible defensively until then. Shockingly horrific actually. Then he turned it around.

sportsczy wrote:Dude.... Marcelo sucked until March. He was horrible defensively until then. Shockingly horrific actually. Then he turned it around.

A load of BS, he had off games, but he was brilliant for most of the first half, Mourinho even went out and said "for me he is the best" during the autumn. He had the off Barca game in which every single player on our team sucked. Remember the Milan game? When Pato changed sides since he couldn't get anywhere against Marcelo.

He went from good to great during the spring thou. He beasted Barca in most of the games, with a single or a few lapse during 360 minutes of football. Every single defender will make a mistake or two over that kind of time frame against so skilled opponents. He made Bale and Messi avoid him in the CL games...

And the injury report seems like BS, Mourinho even talked about the injury and Marcelo wasn't called up for the game after the International break because of injury. A game which Real Madrid lost against Gijon.

paperbackwriter wrote:

sportsczy wrote:Dude.... Marcelo sucked until March. He was horrible defensively until then. Shockingly horrific actually. Then he turned it around.

A load of BS, he had off games, but he was brilliant for most of the first half, Mourinho even went out and said "for me he is the best" during the autumn. He had the off Barca game in which every single player on our team sucked. Remember the Milan game? When Pato changed sides since he couldn't get anywhere against Marcelo.

He went from good to great during the spring thou. He beasted Barca in most of the games, with a single or a few lapse during 360 minutes of football. Every single defender will make a mistake or two over that kind of time frame against so skilled opponents. He made Bale and Messi avoid him in the CL games...

And the injury report seems like BS, Mourinho even talked about the injury and Marcelo wasn't called up for the game after the International break because of injury. A game which Real Madrid lost against Gijon.

He played well against some crap teams early and then just went down the toilet. The Barca game in November was just the worst of it. He continued to be crap until March. Almost every regular poster on the Madrid board was calling for his head if he didn't improve... In fact, we were analyzing Cissokho, Coentrao, etc. to see who we could get to replace him.

Always great on offense. But just pure atrocious on defense until March.

sportsczy wrote:

paperbackwriter wrote:

sportsczy wrote:Dude.... Marcelo sucked until March. He was horrible defensively until then. Shockingly horrific actually. Then he turned it around.

A load of BS, he had off games, but he was brilliant for most of the first half, Mourinho even went out and said "for me he is the best" during the autumn. He had the off Barca game in which every single player on our team sucked. Remember the Milan game? When Pato changed sides since he couldn't get anywhere against Marcelo.

He went from good to great during the spring thou. He beasted Barca in most of the games, with a single or a few lapse during 360 minutes of football. Every single defender will make a mistake or two over that kind of time frame against so skilled opponents. He made Bale and Messi avoid him in the CL games...

And the injury report seems like BS, Mourinho even talked about the injury and Marcelo wasn't called up for the game after the International break because of injury. A game which Real Madrid lost against Gijon.

He played well against some crap teams early and then just went down the toilet. The Barca game in November was just the worst of it. He continued to be crap until March. Almost every regular poster on the Madrid board was calling for his head if he didn't improve... In fact, we were analyzing Cissokho, Coentrao, etc. to see who we could get to replace him.

Always great on offense. But just pure atrocious on defense until March.

Please tell me about these horrible horrible games, examples..? Except the 5-0 game. We kept it at 0 against any other good flank team in La Liga during the fall (Sevilla, Atl. Madrid, Valencia) and ofcourse he was good against Milan, and Ajax, and Auxerre.

Just because the regular posters on the Madrid board write something it doesn't make it true. Most of us/you are extremely biased and knee-jerky. Heck, by Madrid-board-standard every player in our team suck since everybody have been hated at some point.

paperbackwriter wrote:

sportsczy wrote:

paperbackwriter wrote:

sportsczy wrote:Dude.... Marcelo sucked until March. He was horrible defensively until then. Shockingly horrific actually. Then he turned it around.

A load of BS, he had off games, but he was brilliant for most of the first half, Mourinho even went out and said "for me he is the best" during the autumn. He had the off Barca game in which every single player on our team sucked. Remember the Milan game? When Pato changed sides since he couldn't get anywhere against Marcelo.

He went from good to great during the spring thou. He beasted Barca in most of the games, with a single or a few lapse during 360 minutes of football. Every single defender will make a mistake or two over that kind of time frame against so skilled opponents. He made Bale and Messi avoid him in the CL games...

And the injury report seems like BS, Mourinho even talked about the injury and Marcelo wasn't called up for the game after the International break because of injury. A game which Real Madrid lost against Gijon.

He played well against some crap teams early and then just went down the toilet. The Barca game in November was just the worst of it. He continued to be crap until March. Almost every regular poster on the Madrid board was calling for his head if he didn't improve... In fact, we were analyzing Cissokho, Coentrao, etc. to see who we could get to replace him.

Always great on offense. But just pure atrocious on defense until March.

Please tell me about these horrible horrible games, examples..? Except the 5-0 game. We kept it at 0 against any other good flank team in La Liga during the fall (Sevilla, Atl. Madrid, Valencia) and ofcourse he was good against Milan, and Ajax, and Auxerre.

Just because the regular posters on the Madrid board write something it doesn't make it true. Most of us/you are extremely biased and knee-jerky. Heck, by Madrid-board-standard every player in our team suck since everybody have been hated at some point.

He was getting owned in every game defensively. He was recklessly jumping into the attack and leaving the back exposed... he also couldn't stop anyone. Both Casillas and Mou called him out on the field in early 2011 and Mou started talking Arbeloa up because he was about to make the switch... then Marcelo got it together in March. This is not even up for debate; it's just fact.

Marcelo has improved and what sportsczy is saying is true. Marcelo is however great at defense today, despite what people say. I swear he stopped Messi sometimes in the Barca games.

Marcelo started the season well enough, mid season, he lost it. My gosh he was terrible. He even lost his strating spot when we played Sevilla in Copa, mourinho wasnt even trusting him to handle Navas, but little around the lyon return game at home, he stepped it up again, and did wonder things.

So as far as consistency goes, he wasnt so much. up and down season.

He was one of the most consistent players for Madrid and he played nearly all our match when he was fit and available, he had a few off matches but to describe him is terrible is very unfair.

Doesn't take away from the fact that he was terrible for 3 months this year... December until March.

Something is odd.

One post says that he wasn't consistent, the other says he was one of the most consistent players.
One post says he was brilliant all throughout, another says that he got it together during March.

Confused much?

Terrible! he was shining with Ronaldo on the left all season long and had a few lapses in defence, is that terrible, would you also describe Pique as beign terrible for Barcelona this season.

Marcelo was involved in every goal we scored agaisnt Barcelona this season, either scoring, assisting the assist or winning a penalty - that is not terrible.

buddytaller wrote:

rsinatra wrote:

buddytaller wrote:Someone is being economical with the truth. I’m finding it hard to believe Menezes’ side of the story, if he rates Marcelo so highly, why did he call him up for the national team only once. He had continuously ignored the player even after visiting Real Madrid’s training camp to have an up close view of him and Kaka. It’s quite clear that he never rated Marcelo so highly in the first place, so what’s with the hypocrisy.

Lol so much speculation. Would Mano just make up these stories if he didn't have some sort of proof?

Whoever rated Marcelo highly before the 10-11 season? He was on constant improvement, but I think that it was pretty much fair that he first got a call-up against Scotland.

Again, Marcelo is not the first one to actually show up for the NT, and then fake an injury. It causes a better impression than not going at all. It's simple logic, really.

Why would Real Madrid get mad at Mano? I think it's normal that they want their player to prioritize things. I remember Roma's GK Doni lost his position as a starter when he decided to go play for Brazil, and nobody tried to hide it.

Now, will Marcelo get mad? Probably. Is he bigger than Brazil? No, never, and in fact, he is nothing to us as of now, and he won't be until he can prove it otherwise. Other than that, I like him at Real Madrid.

FYI Marcelo made his international debut as a teenager before joining Real Madrid during the early years of Dunga's reign when he was first choice left back, he even scored on his debut with Scotland if my memory serves me right. He lost out on that position after he failed to secure a regular place in Madrid.

Menezes has reason to lie, as he has come under a lot of pressure over his player selection. Marcelo’s form was brilliant for most of this season, and merited at least an earlier call up to re-launch his international career. He doesn’t rate Marcelo as highly as he expects us to believe in this interview, I find nothing wrong not liking a player but pretending to like him just because you are under pressure over your squad selection just reeks of hypocrisy.

These allegations against Real Madrid are serious, from what Menezes is saying Madrid sent an email to someone which suggested they ordered their player to feign injury in order to avoid playing for the National team. That would do the image of the club no good, especially in Brazil where the club has a good following due to the number of Brazilians who have played for the club in recent years.

Like I said, I hope the report is nothing but a writer’s fantasy but if it is true expect a reaction from Madrid pretty soon. You cannot make such allegations without backing them up.

Mano is under pressure just like any coach would be when coaching Brazil. Brazilian people are never fully satisfied with the team. Last year it was the same when Ronaldinho, Ganso, Neymar, etc, didn't make it into the WC squad. It's part of the coach's job to cope with it. But what you are doing is claiming that you know what is going on inside Mano's and his staff's minds. Which you don't.

And the report is not a writer's fantasy. Click on the links and you'll see the interview itself, on video.

Anyway, you seem to be more worried about Marcelo and Real Madrid than Brazil, so we can't really discuss it further..

buddytaller wrote:Terrible! he was shining with Ronaldo on the left all season long and had a few lapses in defence, is that terrible, would you also describe Pique as beign terrible for Barcelona this season.

Marcelo was involved in every goal we scored agaisnt Barcelona this season, either scoring, assisting the assist or winning a penalty - that is not terrible.

Lol at the comparison of Pique's defensive skills to Marcelo's. The latter is great attacking, but he still has to improve a lot defensively.

But no one is questioning Marcelo's ability and the fact that he deserves to have a chance. The fact is that he had it, blew it, and now shouldn't whine about it.

sportsczy wrote:

rsinatra wrote:

sportsczy wrote:

I do think the Brazil coach is overreacting. You give a young kid who is clearly your best at the position a chance to redeem himself.

But if Marcelo got called up now, he would think he is the boss, and would fake injuries again, and think he can do whatever.. and that would lead other players to do the same. Mano has to make a stand. He'll give Marcelo more chances after the Copa.

Making a stand going into major competitions is stupid imo. Call him on the squad and bench him for a game or two... you owe it to your country to call up the best.

France has been doing this "take a stand" bs for 10 years and it almost destroyed the NT.

You have a point. But for now, I just hope Mano can work these dilemmas out and get our team to display good performances at the Copa.

rsinatra wrote:

buddytaller wrote:Terrible! he was shining with Ronaldo on the left all season long and had a few lapses in defence, is that terrible, would you also describe Pique as beign terrible for Barcelona this season.

Marcelo was involved in every goal we scored agaisnt Barcelona this season, either scoring, assisting the assist or winning a penalty - that is not terrible.

Lol at the comparison of Pique's defensive skills to Marcelo's. The latter is great attacking, but he still has to improve a lot defensively.

But no one is questioning Marcelo's ability and the fact that he deserves to have a chance. The fact is that he had it, blew it, and now shouldn't whine about it.

Many Barcelona fans were unhappy with Pique during thee mid season, they claimed his affair with Shakira was having a toll on his game. He had a few off matches especially when Puyol was not around, yet hardly anyone described him as terrible. And I still don't believe in the email crap Menezes is spewing. If he has evidence he should let the whole world know, I believe he is only looking for excuses, Coaches leave and die by their player selection and I foresee Dunga's fate befalling him, the current squad doesn't look like meeting expectations. Building a team on the shoulders of an 18 year old hot head is not the way forward for any national team.

rsinatra:

Thing is that Mano is accusing Real Madrid of serious stuff here. As Madrid fans you have to question it. I hope Real Madrid make an official statement. If Manos version is correct then Real Madrid must have ordered Marcelo to fake a injury (haven't read it all, but some comment said that it was a mail from a madrid official that was the proof), since there is no way that he himself would pull out based on his own priorities when he finally got the chance to play for Brazil. He even had a press conference ahead of the game talking about how excited he was to play.

The other version is the one that played out at the time, Marcelo finally got a call up for Brazil, was excited, trained with the team, but ahead of the game he felt pain and decided that he didn't want to risk anything with important CL games around the corner. Hence he wasn't injured in the sense that he couldn't play for his life, but he still didn't feel comfortable. Zlatan Ibrahimovic made an interesting comment about this when refering to Erik Hamrén, the coach of sweden. Ahead of the Finland game Erik said that the most important thing is Zlatans health, not that he play a game when he doesn't feel 100 %. Something Zlatan claimed that "no coach" ever said to him. Every single coach (including Mourinho, Capello, Pep Guardiola, Mancini) have told him "can you play?" as in "is it possible?" and when he answered "yes but I don't feel comfortable at all" the last part was just ignored. He was playing. So I'm guessing this is what actually played out, Marcelo wasn't comfortable playing, especially a friendly when the most important games of the season was around the corner, but it wasn't impossible for him to play. He choose the safe route and is punished for it.

I find this far more likely than him faking the whole injury.

He was also left out of the squad for Real Madrid the game after the Scottland game because of the claimed injury.

I'm not denying that Marcelo has been great since the second leg of the Lyon CL matchup. But starting in November until that game he was nothing short of horrible... i mean just crazy bad... defensively. Mou had an interview where he was asked who impressed him the most on his squad in late Feb and he responded with Arbeloa (he was trying to prep him to take over the RB spot). He then benched Marcelo for a couple of games. Then the light finally turned on.

Nobody is questioning his offense. That was always great. But he forgot that he was a defender completely for a while there.

paperbackwriter... no way that is the insinuation. We had a lot of our players in international games and none of them sat. In fact, that's when Benz got his slight injury.

Marcelo was trying to secure his spot on the Brazil NT and was not completely secure with his Madrid position then either (remember this was late March/early April). He felt he couldn't afford to sit out the Brazil game and he was also afraid to get injured and lose his spot on Madrid to Arbeloa.

Very Kaka-ish.

Marcelo had bruised ribs and the medical staff decided not to risk him for the match, big deal!

smells to me like to coach doesnt want marcelo.

good riddens brazil

omarish wrote:So basicly Marcelo faked a injury for NT Friendlies? The thing almost every pro player does today and now hes gotta pay for it...

Representing the national team is a privilege. If you're not going to treat it as such, then you don't deserve to wear the shirt.

Real Madrid homepage:
Marcelo no jugó el Escocia-Brasil por estar lesionado

Google Translate:
Marcelo did not play the Scotland-Brazil because of injury

He suffered a blow to the league match against Atletico which caused the rupture of the right oblique muscle detachment of the 12 rib
Realmadrid.com

The player does not call Marcelo Real Madrid to play in Brazil next year's Copa America has led to a series of reports which stated that the white player's absence from the list may be due to the fact that March 27 would not play the Scotland-Brazil friendly held in London. According to this information, Marcelo claimed a back injury for not taking part in the meeting. The Real Madrid CF wishes to clarify that Marcelo could not play that game for being injured and the proof is the medical examinations were made to football.

March 19, Marcelo suffered a bruised right rib cage in the league match against Atletico Madrid and 24 joined to the concentration of the Brazilian national team to prepare for the friendly against Scotland. To persist for the inconvenience, Marcelo could not participate in the match, which certified the Brazilian Football Confederation (CBF) on 26 March with a statement confirming that during training on day 25 had suffered "a blow to the rib "and that after tests confirmed the existence of" a muscle contusion that kept him from playing against Scotland. "

Marcelo returned to the capital of Spain and day 28, as the discomfort continued, Sanitas medical services, Real Madrid, after talking to Dr. Runco (head of medical services of the Brazilian national team), decided to perform a magnetic resonance hospital Sanitas La Moraleja. After it was confirmed that he suffered "breakage right oblique muscle detachment of the 12th rib, with a low period of two weeks."

For this reason, the player did not make the squad for the league match when Real Madrid played against Sporting Gijon on 2 April. Marcelo reappeared with the white team on April 5 in the Champions League match against Tottenham at the Bernabeu.

The Real Madrid CF regrets that the version that has transcended the absence of Marcelo in the squad for the Copa America will no doubt question the footballer to play for his country.