Carvalho: I quit Portugal because I couldn't stand my team-mate Pepe being picked ahead of me

Such an immature thing to do by a 33-year-old.

ragbirjosh wrote:Guys this is way too much speculation.I highly doubt that carvalho would quit if he didn't feel disrespected in some way by the coach. Judging by the way the coach reacted him and carvalho weren't on great .

You guys are focusing on the event a little too much.Things like this don't just suddenly happen, every story has a past. It is clear that past occurrences caused Bento to drop Carvalho and this caused Carvalho to retire , other than that we know nothing.

Even if he was so mad about being dropped that he retired ,it's his personal decision, who are we to judge him for it.?

St_Nick09_of_Goal wrote:all he is saying is, there is always precedent with this kind of story, carvalho is 33. he knows and expects to be put aside but obviously there is history between the two men, which led to this incident. we will just never know what the true story is

The Madrid One wrote:people are making too much out of this..

hes out

he didnt need portugal and portugal didnt need him.

i can agree that maybe he should have taken it in a different manner.

there seems to be one similarity between everyone who's tried defending carvalho in this thread, though i can't put my finger on it just yet... would be an amazing coincidence

Carvalho was wrong... plain and simple. He needs to apologize and do so quickly. 3 of his Madrid teammates are on the Portugal NT and this should not sit well with them until he does apologize. He should also be punished heavily for his actions.

As far as comparing Balo to Ricky, Lol x10000000000. The most pathetic straw man logic i have ever seen on a football board. One has had a WC career with very few or no incidents on and off the field while the other is a serial offender with zero career credibility. How could you even make such argument? Unbelievable.

Carvalho should be ashamed of himself.

Why are some people defending him on this one is beyond me.

The only reason this is different from the anelka situation is that we know for a fact Domenech is stupid.We don't know anything about this so,we can just speculate.

che wrote:

there seems to be one similarity between everyone who's tried defending carvalho in this thread, though i can't put my finger on it just yet... would be an amazing coincidence

Defend Carvalho? it's time to take off those goggles

Very disappointed in Carvalho. I sympathise that maybe the coach is also at fault here but you suck it up like a professional. What he did was stupid.

Having said that it would be extremely petty of the Portuguese FA to ban him from European competition.

Lord Spencer wrote:

@The Franchise; I disagree on your definition of the player and coach roles. You make it sound like a dictatorship. Coaches are not chess master where the players are pawns. Each coach has his own approach to the job, but human interaction between the coach and players is vital if not necessary for any team. Sure, at the end of the day what the coach say goes, and he owes no explanation to the players. However, a coach who abuses his control is a bad coach IMO.

Also, when your a veteran and you are treated badly (I am speaking in general here). Then the rest of the team's morale will go down. I can't see Del Bosque for example disrespecting any of Spain's veterans without losing the trust of the team. As a player, you want the security that if you work hard enough you get your chance.

And how does what I say go against any of that? I didnt say human interaction isnt needed, I didnt say coaches can abuse control (and Bento hasnt here) so I dont know why you have said that.

I hve said Carvalho is out of his mind is he thinks he has a say in the team. His words suggests he believes he has an opinion, when he certaintly doesnt and shouldnt.

sportsczy wrote:Carvalho was wrong... plain and simple. He needs to apologize and do so quickly. 3 of his Madrid teammates are on the Portugal NT and this should not sit well with them until he does apologize. He should also be punished heavily for his actions.

As far as comparing Balo to Ricky, Lol x10000000000. The most pathetic straw man logic i have ever seen on a football board. One has had a WC career with very few or no incidents on and off the field while the other is a serial offender with zero career credibility. How could you even make such argument? Unbelievable.

Nobody is comparing Ricky to Balo, read properly please.

What I said was, Ricky is getting people defend him and getting people make up things about "past issues" and giving him the benefit of some sort of doubt.

If this was Balo doing this, he wouldnt get any of that and on top of it, this thread would be 3 times aslong with people waiting to throw dirt on him.

If this same story came out about Balo, then he said what Ricky said, people would crucify him. If then he came out and talked about "past issues" with the coach, would anyone even believe him?

Ricky hasnt even talked about past issues and yet people want to believe because he went from upset to storming of, there must be something in between it.

@Dani
Well I don't know about that "Shouldn't and doesn't have a opinion" part.

A player will always have an opinion and he should.

I think you mean that a player shouldn't expect his opinion to hold any water when it goes against the coaches.

The Franchise wrote:
Ricky hasnt even talked about past issues and yet people want to believe because he went from upset to storming of, there must be something in between it.

Well I don't think that is too unreasonable.

Granted it doesn't mean that there is anything but you can't say there is no chance of that being the case either.

Whether Carvalho mentions anything about it or not doesn't really matter. The belief that there might be something wrong there is a reasonable one.

The Franchise wrote:

sportsczy wrote:Carvalho was wrong... plain and simple. He needs to apologize and do so quickly. 3 of his Madrid teammates are on the Portugal NT and this should not sit well with them until he does apologize. He should also be punished heavily for his actions.

As far as comparing Balo to Ricky, Lol x10000000000. The most pathetic straw man logic i have ever seen on a football board. One has had a WC career with very few or no incidents on and off the field while the other is a serial offender with zero career credibility. How could you even make such argument? Unbelievable.

Nobody is comparing Ricky to Balo, read properly please.

What I said was, Ricky is getting people defend him and getting people make up things about "past issues" and giving him the benefit of some sort of doubt.

If this was Balo doing this, he wouldnt get any of that and on top of it, this thread would be 3 times aslong with people waiting to throw dirt on him.

If this same story came out about Balo, then he said what Ricky said, people would crucify him. If then he came out and talked about "past issues" with the coach, would anyone even believe him?

Ricky hasnt even talked about past issues and yet people want to believe because he went from upset to storming of, there must be something in between it.

It's perfectly understandable. Carvalho is a first time offender while Balo is known for his antics. Of course, people would question why now all of the sudden?

Perhaps I should of said it different. They obviously do have an opinion, they arent robots, but what I mean is they have no right to say their opinion to the coach. No right to tell the coach who should be playing and who shouldnt.

Of course they have an opinion, but from the coaches perspective, you dont have one unless I ask for it.

babun1024 wrote:

The Franchise wrote:

sportsczy wrote:Carvalho was wrong... plain and simple. He needs to apologize and do so quickly. 3 of his Madrid teammates are on the Portugal NT and this should not sit well with them until he does apologize. He should also be punished heavily for his actions.

As far as comparing Balo to Ricky, Lol x10000000000. The most pathetic straw man logic i have ever seen on a football board. One has had a WC career with very few or no incidents on and off the field while the other is a serial offender with zero career credibility. How could you even make such argument? Unbelievable.

Nobody is comparing Ricky to Balo, read properly please.

What I said was, Ricky is getting people defend him and getting people make up things about "past issues" and giving him the benefit of some sort of doubt.

If this was Balo doing this, he wouldnt get any of that and on top of it, this thread would be 3 times aslong with people waiting to throw dirt on him.

If this same story came out about Balo, then he said what Ricky said, people would crucify him. If then he came out and talked about "past issues" with the coach, would anyone even believe him?

Ricky hasnt even talked about past issues and yet people want to believe because he went from upset to storming of, there must be something in between it.

It's perfectly understandable. Carvalho is a first time offender while Balo is known for his antics. Of course, people would question why now all of the sudden?

There is nothing wrong with questioning why all of sudden, but thats not all what people are doing here.

They are outright saying there MUST be past issues.

He made a mistake regardless and should be punished... but when a player is 33 and has zero track record of being a trouble maker, you wonder what happened to make him suddenly blow up. There has to be some reason, justified or not. With a player like Balo who's been a punk all his life, you expect him to act like an arse... there's no reason to give Balo the benefit of the doubt.

That's really all this is about: the benefit of the doubt.

Regarding player opinions about coaching... they will and should have one. A lot of the superstars only express their opinions behind closed doors because they know the impact of public criticism. Only in extreme cases do you see them publicly criticize a coach. A prime example is Zidane who roasted Domenech from the get go and publicly. Domenech had no choice but to play him because he was Zidane. It's all a game of power and politics frankly.

The Franchise wrote:

There is nothing wrong with questioning why all of sudden, but thats not all what people are doing here.

They are outright saying there MUST be past issues.

I didn't read the whole thread. Of course, it's nonsense Everything is possible unless proven otherwise

St_Nick09_of_Goal wrote:No one here said ricky was right to do what he did.

ragbirjosh wrote: I feel that he was entirely in the right to do what
he did and therefore should not be oficially punished.

Dani's definition of coach-player relationships works best for 20 years ago. Maybe even 10. The dynamic should still be the same, but coaches nowadays take a lot of time to explain things to players and have a back and forth conversation with them. Some players may be smitten by this kind of relationship and believe that they have the right to question the coach. They are not. At it's core, the coach is their boss and they're the employee. The position demands an amount of respect.

The Franchise wrote:Perhaps I should of said it different. They obviously do have an opinion, they arent robots, but what I mean is they have no right to say their opinion to the coach. No right to tell the coach who should be playing and who shouldnt.

Of course they have an opinion, but from the coaches perspective, you dont have one unless I ask for it.

Well when put that way then yes I agree with you whole heartedly.

But of course there are exceptions to that rule. (Sport's Zidane/Domenech example is a good one.)

BarrileteCosmico wrote:

St_Nick09_of_Goal wrote:No one here said ricky was right to do what he did.

ragbirjosh wrote: I feel that he was entirely in the right to do what
he did and therefore should not be oficially punished.

LOL

Judge us not equally. Some of our rookie's have their moments but it's your fault for taking them seriously

BarrileteCosmico wrote:

St_Nick09_of_Goal wrote:No one here said ricky was right to do what he did.

ragbirjosh wrote: I feel that he was entirely in the right to do what
he did and therefore should not be oficially punished.

.

St_Nick09_of_Goal wrote:

BarrileteCosmico wrote:

St_Nick09_of_Goal wrote:No one here said ricky was right to do what he did.

ragbirjosh wrote: I feel that he was entirely in the right to do what
he did and therefore should not be oficially punished.

.

I just meant he has the right to retire whenever he wants , even if it is in the middle of a training session.

Zealous wrote:

The Franchise wrote:Perhaps I should of said it different. They obviously do have an opinion, they arent robots, but what I mean is they have no right to say their opinion to the coach. No right to tell the coach who should be playing and who shouldnt.

Of course they have an opinion, but from the coaches perspective, you dont have one unless I ask for it.

Well when put that way then yes I agree with you whole heartedly.

But of course there are exceptions to that rule. (Sport's Zidane/Domenech example is a good one.)

I know a couple of very well respected NBA coaches and they've told me on more than one occasion that they want players who are never satisfied. They prefer the closed door complaints about playing time and tactics as long as the player is uber-competitive and performs like a professional. The only thing they wouldn't allow were public outbursts.

I think the modern coach is a combination of coaching and psychologist. The best ones know how to manipulate their players to get the best out of them both tactically and mentally. Phil Jackson was a master at it and he had feuds with players internally every year.

The mentality of American sports is different though. I not sure if it translates well into football.

I think if we look at it over past successful teams the players don't really have to like the coach or agree with him so long as they respect him and understand what he wants.

sportsczy wrote:

Zealous wrote:

The Franchise wrote:Perhaps I should of said it different. They obviously do have an opinion, they arent robots, but what I mean is they have no right to say their opinion to the coach. No right to tell the coach who should be playing and who shouldnt.

Of course they have an opinion, but from the coaches perspective, you dont have one unless I ask for it.

Well when put that way then yes I agree with you whole heartedly.

But of course there are exceptions to that rule. (Sport's Zidane/Domenech example is a good one.)

I know a couple of very well respected NBA coaches and they've told me on more than one occasion that they want players who are never satisfied. They prefer the closed door complaints about playing time and tactics as long as the player is uber-competitive and performs like a professional. The only thing they wouldn't allow were public outbursts.

I think the modern coach is a combination of coaching and psychologist. The best ones know how to manipulate their players to get the best out of them both tactically and mentally. Phil Jackson was a master at it and he had feuds with players internally every year.

You know them personally?

Agree with everything you say , but I mean what exactly more should you do to punish him.He retired, he's no longer the part of the squad. Are you gonna stop Pele from criticizing Brazil or Maradona from criticing Argentina?. I know it's different but, no official governing body should be able to punish a retired player.

ragbirjosh wrote:

sportsczy wrote:

Zealous wrote:

The Franchise wrote:Perhaps I should of said it different. They obviously do have an opinion, they arent robots, but what I mean is they have no right to say their opinion to the coach. No right to tell the coach who should be playing and who shouldnt.

Of course they have an opinion, but from the coaches perspective, you dont have one unless I ask for it.

Well when put that way then yes I agree with you whole heartedly.

But of course there are exceptions to that rule. (Sport's Zidane/Domenech example is a good one.)

I know a couple of very well respected NBA coaches and they've told me on more than one occasion that they want players who are never satisfied. They prefer the closed door complaints about playing time and tactics as long as the player is uber-competitive and performs like a professional. The only thing they wouldn't allow were public outbursts.

I think the modern coach is a combination of coaching and psychologist. The best ones know how to manipulate their players to get the best out of them both tactically and mentally. Phil Jackson was a master at it and he had feuds with players internally every year.

You know them personally?

Agree with everything you say , but I mean what exactly more should you do to punish him.He retired, he's no longer the part of the squad. Are you gonna stop Pele from criticizing Brazil or Maradona from criticing Argentina?. I know it's different but, no official governing body should be able to punish a retired player.

Talked to a couple socially. Superstars and icons are different... they can say whatever they want basically lol. As far as punishment, a ban is appropriate for a certain number of games (like the France NT after the WC). Asking UEFA to take action that would affect his club play is ridiculous though.

Lol banning a retired player would be like drowning a dead fish.Pointless.