How important are goalkeepers?

It's something I amuse myself by thinking about occasionally.

Let's say you have Iker Casillas vs Wayne Hennessey (Wales & Wolves GK). Or any non-world-class-but-good 'keeper.
What do you think, how many of the saves Casillas makes Hennessey would make as well? 80%? 90%? 95%?

I believe the percentage is pretty high. Most of the saves a goalkeeper has to make do not require 100% of his ability. With outfield players the differences become much clearer, imo, because they face many more individual performances / moments in a game than goalkeepers and are also required to put all of their abilities to use more often than goalkeepers, especially those players who see the ball a lot. Or think about how often you hear the phrase "the 'keeper couldn't do anything about those goals"? While outfield players almost always could have done something better in the situations they face in the game that didn't go so well for them.

So let's put it this way: If I had £30m to spend and my team needed a GK, chances are that I wouldn't buy Casillas for £30m but Hennessy for £10m and spend the rest on outfield players.

Agree, disagree, or something in between?

Something in between.

While your argument regarding saves is sound, it mostly considers a GKs reflexes on the line, while with a truly WC keeper, you mostly spend not for reflexes, but for instinct and positioning.

The really WC keepers like Neuer, Casillas, VdS, Buffon etc. know exactly when to come off their line, they know how to open up play, and they are actually decent outfield players if caught out of the box.

Most "decent", or whatever, keepers might be pretty good on the line, but they usually lack the decision-making skills to come off their line as perfectly as the truly WC keepers do. That, imho, is what you pay for.

well, in fifa 11 they all seem to suck/own whenever they feel like it.

I ll post in details late but i need to say this,SAF a legendary coach choose to splash 20 mill for De gea to replace Van Der sar.Look,their primary and by far concern was supposed to be their midfield but saf went straight to bring a potential world class GK from the market first,he know how important is a GK to the team.Some times you could steel a match if you have a great GK.

You also have to factor in that the great 'keepers always organize the defence, move the wall, yell at the back four etc. - that's worth a lot as well. Look at Neuer, he's just a kid, and already you can see him almost rip peoples heads off if his defence positioned itself badly.

spain don't call oliver kahn in 2001, DEVIL for nothing

we signed Mondragon from Monchengladbach this year for the Union

The difference between this year and last year is ridiculous.

The ironic thing is that he hasn't really made any mind blowing saves...in fact he kind of lets in some that I think a younger keeper would stop

But his organization of the defense has been brilliant

Adit wrote:I ll post in details late but i need to say this,SAF a legendary coach choose to splash 20 mill for De gea to replace Van Der sar.Look,their primary and by far concern was supposed to be their midfield but saf went straight to bring a potential world class GK from the market first,he know how important is a GK to the team.Some times you could steel a match if you have a great GK.

You know How happy I am we dont have to deal with Van Der Sar anymore lol. He stole many games from Arsenal by making the crazy saves he did, he will be missed but not by Arsenal fans.

so...you would rather not spend 30 million on Iker, but spend 5 million on Almunia?

bhends wrote:we signed Mondragon from Monchengladbach this year for the Union

You signed him from Köln, though.

Duke Neukem is god.

/thread

I've count of the number of times Iker has made an amazing save after which we score a few moments later.

A truly great keeper can win you points and win you trophies.

Last match being the copa del rey final for eg

Adit wrote:Last match being the copa del rey final for eg

Iker he played better than in 2nd leg of CL than in the copa final imo( it could have been 5 or 6 before halftime if it was'nt for Iker)

When you have defenders who aren't as good as they should, a good goalie tends to make one's soul feel a lot less frustrated than when you have a bad goalie. If it weren't for Iker, Real Madrid would have literally lost either more games or by bigger margins whilst if Arsenal didn't have such weird goalies, they probably would have held on to leads a bit longer.

Both teams have suspect defenses (or defensive mindset I think).

So I think a goalie makes a hell of a difference and thus, agree with Art on this issue...

A good keeper makes the confidence of his defense stronger. Aswell as the other way around. The keeper have full view of everything happening and will/should scream and direct his defense if he sees a hole. He also correct things afterwards and lets his defenders know when a dangerous situation was their fault. Defenders can also trust the keeper to handle everything they should be able to leave for him (like aerial balls, back passes and so on).

A good keeper also have great delivery with both his feet and hands. He make sure to not put his team mates under pressure by throwing them a bad ball when there is an attacker close by.

Overall, a bad keeper can break a great defense. While a great keeper can make an average defense good.

Eivindo wrote:well, in fifa 11 they all seem to suck/own whenever they feel like it.

use Abate as Goal Keeper and you'll have no problem.

a great Goal keeper can win you games. that's the difference.

example ? Justo Villar vs Brazil, Iker Casillas vs Barcelona.

I think that goalkeepers are usually quite underrated. The way they command the defenders and position them usually goes unnoticed. Goalkeepers like Buffon, Neuer, and Casillas do that pretty well and deserve some extra credit for that, you can always see them shouting at their defenders, telling them who to mark, where to stand..etc.

And I think I can safely say that goalkeepers can get a team 10-15 points a season if he does well.

1 excellent goalkeeper & 1 excellent striker can win you a trophy

A goalkeeper is vital as already stated here. It gives the defense confidence, organizes it, can steal you points from otherwise unwinnable or tough matches and they can be huge leaders as well (Casillas, Buffon, Kahn).

Chelsea has one of the best defences... thats partly due to Petr Cech. He doesn't get many shots but the ones he get are world class shots, most of the time..

Kahn.. no need to say anything.. he can change games.

Thanks for the replies.

Many have pointed out that a great 'keeper can win you games. Agreed, but so can great outfield players, too.

For the sake of debate, if your team had no 1st choice GK and no 1st choice striker, which of these two combinations would you choose?

1. Casillas + Bendtner
2. Hennessey + Eto'o

crucial moments counts of course...

Art Morte wrote:Thanks for the replies.

Many have pointed out that a great 'keeper can win you games. Agreed, but so can great outfield players, too.

For the sake of debate, if your team had no 1st choice GK and no 1st choice striker, which of these two combinations would you choose?

1. Casillas + Bendtner
2. Hennessey + Eto'o

Casillas + Bendtner, attackers win games, defense wins championships.

Eto for all his glory could not help Inter when Julio Ceasar was in a horrible confidence problem period.