Re: La Liga and Barcagate

by futbol_bill Mon Apr 17, 2023 8:32 pm

el pais,

Here’s an english version:

https://english.elpais.com/sports/2023-02-15/fc-barcelona-paid-14-million-euros-over-three-years-to-the-vice-president-of-the-referees-for-alleged-reports-on-officials.html

It isn’t sports media, it has been in all evening news.

by Myesyats Mon Apr 17, 2023 9:18 pm

Where in this article does it say that the payments were made "under the table"?? This phrase means "secretly", and there is nothing secret about invoices

"If a company pays someone under-the-table, the money is not documented and therefore won't be taxed."

The payments were documented and taxed ! As Pique said, if you want to bribe refs, you don't document anything albino

by Pedram Mon Apr 17, 2023 9:40 pm

Perucho21 wrote:hes saying theres no rvidence on Barca but accused with Real Madrid being the true culprit, with no evidence.

Also sprinkled Franco on top as always. Guy is clueless

Franco lives on cules heads rent free, not surprised tbh.

Joke club suffering from victim mentality from top to bottom.

by futbol_bill Mon Apr 17, 2023 9:51 pm

Myesyats wrote:Where in this article does it say that the payments were made "under the table"?? This phrase means "secretly", and there is nothing secret about invoices

"If a company pays someone under-the-table, the money is not documented and therefore won't be taxed."

The payments were documented and taxed ! As Pique said, if you want to bribe refs, you don't document anything

Can you even read?

by futbol_bill Mon Apr 17, 2023 10:02 pm

Here’s the orginal source ‘Cadena Ser Barcelona’

https://cadenaser.com/especial/caso-negreira/

I wouldn’t want you to get mislead by an english translation and also note that this whole story originated in Barcelona not Madrid

by Myesyats Mon Apr 17, 2023 10:31 pm

futbol_bill wrote:Here’s the orginal source ‘Cadena Ser Barcelona’

https://cadenaser.com/especial/caso-negreira/

I wouldn’t want you to get mislead by an english translation and also note that this whole story originated in Barcelona not Madrid

This article actually says some payments were incorrectly taxed, the previous one only said that Negreira couldnt provide any document to prove what service was provided to Barca because he claims it was verbal. There were some rumors of cash funneling being involved to Barca directors personal accounts, but that is neither here nor there in the case of influencing referee decisions, more like money laundering

Clearly on the same page it states that his own son (the actual administrator of the company in question) and the Barca board denied this and said there's both invoices and physical proof of the service provided.

Joan Laporta: “Barça got refereeing reports but that is not illegal. There are invoices, everything is in the club's accounting books. We did it clearly and transparently. We haven't hidden anything” #FCB
— Reshad Rahman (@ReshadRahman_) April 17, 2023

The articles are quoting Negreira senior and the important part that everyone seems to leave out is that he has alzheimers so I'm not sure why they're taking his word on this? It's like a soap opera

by futbol_bill Mon Apr 17, 2023 11:29 pm

By god, talk about selecting reading! “It started as an investigation of money laundering and when Gaspart said he didn’t know about payments and Negriera said it was for oral advice, it changed into possible referee influence’’

by halamadrid2 Tue Apr 18, 2023 5:28 am

pic.twitter.com/kILbbHbnzv
— Real Madrid C.F. (@realmadrid) April 17, 2023

Real Madrid answers Laporta with a video broadcast on RMTV:

"Barcelona awarded the gold and diamond badge to Franco. Barcelona named Franco an honorary partner in 1965. Barcelona was saved 3 times from bankruptcy with 3 reclassifications by Franco." @relevo #rmalive pic.twitter.com/PtmuaCkBHR
— Madrid Zone (@theMadridZone) April 17, 2023

Laporta trying to take on RM, he will lose 10/10. What a clown!

by halamadrid2 Tue Apr 18, 2023 5:36 am

Franco and Barça, the chronology of a lie.

FC Barcelona during the dictatorship, and the real truth behind their myths about Real Madrid

(A THREAD): pic.twitter.com/2aiAF6dQml
— John H O N E S T Y (@ExJohnHonestyy) April 17, 2023

Laporta opened a can of worm when he decided to declare war against RM Laughing

Franco saved Barca from bankruptcy THREE times rofl

and they have the gall to claim we've been favoured.

Now do the police's job and find the slam dunk evidence in the Negreira case to send these clowns down to Segunda.

by Myesyats Tue Apr 18, 2023 10:26 am

futbol_bill wrote: By god, talk about selecting reading! “It started as an investigation of money laundering and when Gaspart said he didn’t know about payments and Negriera said it was for oral advice, it changed into possible referee influence’’

Okay and? Negreira is senile and Gaspart is 80 aswell… this doesn’t prove that payments were undocumented, it proves that these two grandpas are perhaps unreliable witnesses?? Laporta said himself if there are irregularities he’d want to be the first to know who’s responsible

The problem is that Negreira couldnt say what the payments were for (hence, money laundering), but his son did and Laporta did as well backed up by physical evidence so it's already been rebutted

Laporta showed about 700 written and video reports and thats just from 2014-2018 so clearly it wasnt only "verbal".

by Myesyats Tue Apr 18, 2023 10:40 am

halamadrid2 wrote:
Franco and Barça, the chronology of a lie.

FC Barcelona during the dictatorship, and the real truth behind their myths about Real Madrid

(A THREAD): pic.twitter.com/2aiAF6dQml
— John H O N E S T Y (@ExJohnHonestyy) April 17, 2023

Laporta opened a can of worm when he decided to declare war against RM

Franco saved Barca from bankruptcy THREE times and they have the gall to claim we've been favoured.

Now do the police's job and find the slam dunk evidence in the Negreira case to send these clowns down to Segunda.

I'm not familiar with the history of Spain but I'd wager it's a long shot for Madrid to distance themselves from Franco and that attempt sounds like whitewashing

by Pedram Tue Apr 18, 2023 11:03 am

Myesyats wrote:
halamadrid2 wrote:
Franco and Barça, the chronology of a lie.

FC Barcelona during the dictatorship, and the real truth behind their myths about Real Madrid

(A THREAD): pic.twitter.com/2aiAF6dQml
— John H O N E S T Y (@ExJohnHonestyy) April 17, 2023

Laporta opened a can of worm when he decided to declare war against RM

Franco saved Barca from bankruptcy THREE times and they have the gall to claim we've been favoured.

Now do the police's job and find the slam dunk evidence in the Negreira case to send these clowns down to Segunda.

I'm not familiar with the history of Spain but I'd wager it's a long shot for Madrid to distance themselves from Franco and that attempt sounds like whitewashing

Madrid was the last city to be taken by Franco's army during the civil war, a lot of Madrid supporters died fighting for the Republicans.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Siege_of_Madrid

by Myesyats Tue Apr 18, 2023 1:05 pm

BREAKING: “It is a manipulation of history, it is irresponsible”, the Catalunya Government has announced. They want Madrid’s video to be taken down. #FCB
— Reshad Rahman (@ReshadRahman_) April 18, 2023

This drama is unbelievable, the spanish civil war is upon us

by futbol_bill Tue Apr 18, 2023 1:21 pm

Mysyats, you start off by asking me to give you the source of the under the table payments, which you have self interpreted to secret payments. I give you the link to the Barcelona (not Madrid) source that broke the story in February and you can’t read it. Then when I point out it was discovered in a tax audit of Negriera’s company with no documentation, you immediately disavowed the source due to age of two principals involved. For god sake, one of them is younger than me and the other just 5 years my senior. Do you think we can’t be believed because of age. As to Negriera’s illness you better do a little more fact finding on it as you are extremely over exaggerating that claim! As to the latter documentation, has it ever occurred to you that documentation fixing was done after the fact. It had already been demonstrated in earlier Barcagate investigations that there was a lot of “fixing” near the end of Bart’s reign.

You and Laporte claimed for weeks that the so called speech on Monday would prove there was no criminal activity, yet there was no proof offered, only him trying to point blame elsewhere with no basis, other than “everyone knows”. Sounds familiar, like something “the naive one” would say!!

By the way, I’ve given up on trying to look at this unbiased! I hope your club rots in segunda!

by Myesyats Tue Apr 18, 2023 2:53 pm

Are the technical reports provided not proof? then what is? Rolling Eyes

And I didn’t say laportas press conference would erase any doubt, just that it’d be entertaining. But likewise trusting everything that comes from the spanish media is foolish. Even so, why do you omit the fact that the same media reported Negreira had no influence to alter results ?

The media reports are conflicting and really we should wait for the verdict of the prosecutors office.

by futbol_bill Tue Apr 18, 2023 10:12 pm

Did you see any of the evening news in Spain?

The entire country is laughing at the statements of Laporte and the Catalans. The response by Madrid was the perfect answer to all the bullshit and the reaction of the separatists is hilarious.

BC, if this story was ancient as you proclaimed, Laporte has brought it back front and centre to all news outlets.

And it isn’t a deportes story, it’s the lead news story.

by sportsczy Tue Apr 18, 2023 11:46 pm

What the hell is wrong with La Liga and Barcelona... I mean refs got paid off. Just punish them harshly and they'll come back in 2-3 years (maybe).

In the meantime, there are teams like Sevilla, Valencia (if they don't get relegated lol), Atletico, Villareal, etc.

You can't let this go. It's a horrible message and would destroy the league if Barca got away with it.

And Laporta is an idiot. Yes, both Real Madrid and Barcelona got preferential treatment... anyone BUT THOSE TWO can complain lol.

by futbol_bill Wed Apr 19, 2023 12:17 am

They haven’t found any proof Sports. Lots of innuendo but nothing concrete.

by Myesyats Wed Apr 19, 2023 8:15 pm

Tebas: “I don't think Barcelona bought referees, but what we believe is that with those payments they may have intended to influence.”

Rolling Eyes

by Casciavit Thu Apr 20, 2023 7:02 am

I know 7.7M sounds like a lot, but across an 18 year time period that's like 400k per year.

I can imagine a club paying a former head referee 400k a year to compile such reports.

Obviously the fact that it involved an executive member of the referee committee is a major conflict of interest, but I don't think the payment amount is high enough of an amount to influence results. We have evidence of the actual reports that were compiled on referee behaviour, so it's not like it was an imaginary job.

Like Pique said if you're going to pay off the referees, you give the brown envelope and higher amounts where it can't be traced back.

Also let's say if Barca did pay off to influence referees, am I supposed to believe Madrid or any other top club doesn't engage in such behaviour. There's nothing funnier than football fans taking the moral high horse. Laughing

Perez is one of the biggest crooks in football. Italy had the calciopoli scandal too. There's too much money involved in football for it to be completely transparent and honest.

But the tribalism between Madrid and Barca fans has been funny especially with the political propaganda videos and press conferences. Maybe El Classico will finally have some heat again.

by Myesyats Thu Apr 20, 2023 7:23 am

30k per month is kind of a lot, but I'm assuming a sizeable chunk of that cash was funneled to Barca directive personal accounts aswell, and obviously a service was also provided as evidenced by the reports.

Refs in La Liga earn 12,500 per month in base salary + 4,200 for every game they whistle. So they can easily make over 20/30k per month, which makes it hard to believe those amounts would be enough ! If they were, la liga refs are cheap whores Heart

by Myesyats Fri Apr 21, 2023 8:47 am

Real Madrid, el equipo del Régimen.@Zona_Blaugrana pic.twitter.com/hUGkA6XkCb
— José Ortiz (@joseorttiiz) April 20, 2023

by futbol_bill Thu Jun 01, 2023 2:10 pm

“Los dos inspectores de la UEFA creen que El Barca debe ser sancionada sin Champions, según ABC”

by Harmonica Thu Jun 01, 2023 2:30 pm

futbol_bill wrote:“Los dos inspectores de la UEFA creen que El Barca debe ser sancionada sin Champions, según ABC”

Who's trying to bribe these? Qatar for Messi not renewing, Saudi's to stop Messi joining?

by Myesyats Tue Jun 06, 2023 3:57 pm

Ex-police chief alleges Caso Negreira was previously dropped due to Real Madrid involvement

Former undercover policeman Jose Manuel Villarejo has accused Real Madrid of being involved in ‘Caso Negreira‘, claiming that the Spanish Government knew about the case over a decade ago.

Villarejo, who himself has been accused of a number of crimes himself including money laundering, espionage and involvement in criminal activity, claims that he became aware of ‘the buying of referees’ in 2012. On two occasions, the later in 2014, he communicated this to the government at the time, but the case was not pursued.

He admitted to spying on former Barcelona President Sandro Rosell, and the Board of Directors at Barcelona, as part of his mission to spy on, and create false evidence in smear campaigns against pro-independence Catalan political factions. Cronica Libre had access to some of his testimony.

“There are two informative notes of mine, two intelligence notes that we are going to see. One is from more or less the end of 2012 and another from 2014, where I state that it is a football issue, I even mention some trouble with referees and such, but as I had previously said that Real Madrid were also involved, apparently, someone was not interested in continuing in that line [of investigation].”

The espionage operation, carried out on various Catalan figures, was allegedly mounted by the sitting government at the time, the right-wing Partido Popular. Real Madrid President Florentino Perez has close links to the party, and has been seen associating with various members of the party over the years.

Whether Villarejo’s testament is true or not, remains to be proven. He has been accused of deception in the past, but equally is responsible for uncovering a number of scandals. As this is a leaked tape of his testimony, it is not yet clear whether these comments will go any further.

https://onefootball.com/en/news/ex-police-chief-alleges-caso-negreira-was-previously-dropped-due-to-real-madrid-involvement-37600886

by futbol_bill Wed Jun 07, 2023 8:23 pm

I have a suspicion on how this will end!

First off, I think Spanish justice and Tebas are incompetent and will not find anything incriminating enough to make charges let alone penalties.

However I think the UEFA threat is more serious and I think Ceferin will use the possible sanction to his benefit like he has just done with Juve. He will remove the possible sanction to get Laporte to denounce and step down from superliga. That way he will totally isolate Flo and the superliga, meaning it will be a death sentence for superliga and Flo’s dreams.

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