Real Madrid vs Liverpool

The Demon of Carthage wrote:sports, That's not an excuse or a valid argument. You're lumping different Madrid teams from different eras in the same box while completely ignoring the fact that they aren't equally strong or dominant to be compared to each other.

Zidane has one of the most talented Madrid sides in the club's history. He had no excuse to lose the league by October and certainly no excuse to finish trophyless.

He must win the CL in Kiev. There's no other way around it. That's the only way to make us forget about the atrocities he has made us go through this season.

A trophyless season should warrant the sack.

Not different eras.  We've gone trophy-less 3 out of those 7 since 2009.  It just happens.  The reason we're all so upset is that we've been very poor in La Liga.  That's more a red flag on age and depth....  so we need to shake things up this summer for La Liga's sake.  But I don't question the quality of anyone from CR to Zidane in big games.

La Liga is mostly about winning against the small teams.  The current group doesn't have that kind of hunger anymore to stay consistent for a whole season.  Need a few changes and/or competition. Too many players felt far too comfortable with their status on the team.

I'll add that CR being so shit for half a season is a massive red flag too. We MUST have alternative scoring options to Ronaldo.

I wouldn't mind not winning the league if it meant us winning the CL. Even more so if it's the third time in a row.

I have said it many times that I rate the CL far higher than any other competition in club football. So if we win the CL this year, I'll be completely satisfied.

What I have zero tolerance with, however, is to finish trophyless.

If Barcelona can win the double with freaking Paulinho AND after losing Neymar, then this Madrid side must at the very least win a major trophy. And given the fact that the CL is the last and only trophy we're still in contention for this season, then that's the one we must win.

Here's a good piece by Ecos Del Balon, and maybe the definitive regarding Real Madrid's tactical disposition in the final.

http://www.ecosdelbalon.com/2018/05/los-planes-de-zidane-en-kiev-para-acompanar-a-ronaldo/

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"Against Juventus, playing a 4-3-1-2, Madrid had serious problems to give continuity to its attacks and also defend the lateral areas of the pitch well after losing possession. The impact was significant enough that Madrid changed its scheme in the second half and prepared for the battle at the Allianz with Isco and Lucas in a 4-3-3. It was then when Ronaldo had to play alone in front of the Bavarian defense.

Looking forward to the final at Kiev, the lateral and counterattacking danger posed by Liverpool is evident. Zidane needs three things: Presence on the lateral areas of the pitch, superiority in the Midfield, and a partner for Ronaldo. This is a goal that Zidane will try to meet based on higher priorities."

"The Liverpool defense can be described to be in an intermediate point between its capacity for sacrifice, concentration, and presence in numbers to avoid being opened up. Klopp's team trains to attack, press, and counterattack, it does not train to occupy its own side of the pitch and defend all too profficiently at the sides of the pitch or in the box. Liverpool has capacity to repel some attacks but not to stop them completely

From this point come the possibilities of prioritizing a structure that concedes initiatives and possibilities for the Madrid fullbacks as a first step to counter the danger of Salah-Firmino-Mane. If Marcelo and Carvajal are given support, then inspired actions and the accumulation of opportunities next to a second forward (Benzema or Bale), seem like the most appropriate option with the essence evocative of a prestigious and domineering Madrid in a transcendental occasion."

"And like that, the figure of Cristiano Ronaldo-- every time more focused at starting at the tip of the team with liberty to intervene and interplay with a partner forward who can relieve him continuously of the role of supporting in an attacking midfield zone and/or as a distraction of the marking of the opposition centre-backs-- would fit well with a Madrid side that would feed the necessities of its different players that add up aptitudes for control of the ball, of the structure necessary to take control of the game, and also distance any chance of deadly counter attacks by Liverpool, whilst also placing Madrid's goal man in front of goal.

Kiev will dictate how appropriate is the mantle with which Zinedine Zidane will try to envelop the role of Cristiano Ronaldo."
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As is the case with most of us here im sure, these are the things that i've been thinking of myself during the last few days; i think that Isco will start, leaving only Bale and Benz for the disputed start. Benz could be a plus in order to help the team get out of pressure with his ability to hold up the ball, turn, and pass, he could also help the team in establishing itself upfront while passing the ball around, as well as with orientating counters, whilst Bale arguably offers better form, velocity during counters, danger during set pieces, and tactical flexibility and higher work rate. Maybe BBC could surprise us but Isco would be important in working against pressure and with possession.

You don't need to be better than us in midfield imho, Roma and City were both infinitely superior than us in midfield, We do long balls into space bypassing both sets of midfielders.

In regards to the midfield and game plan described by the author, i think he's talking about being able to work around pressing, marking, and aerial duels in order to asphyxiate Liverpool both with and without the ball. Madrid should have as an objective to stop Liverpool's forwards from getting to much space against too few Madrid players.

The teams successfully been able to do that are Chelsea and United, You know how they play. I doubt Real will even try that hard to defend. You'll beat us playing your usual game.

Was going to make a new thread but decided against it.

Scoreline predictions anyone?

Nishankly wrote:The teams successfully been able to do that are Chelsea and United, You know how they play. I doubt Real will even try that hard to defend. You'll beat us playing your usual game.

You don't watch Real Madrid. Our tactics are Serie A in concept. We sit back and suck team in and then attack by preference. That's why we do well against attacking teams. We struggle to make play ourselves.

Injuries to fullback and Ramos suspension have hurt us. But those issues aren't there for this game.

If by 60' Liverpool is not leading , the game would be over.

Roma did not have an "infinitely superior" midfield than Liverpool. While they could pass better, they were slow and lacked legit defensive coverage to which Liverpool abused over and over again. Also, what Sports just wrote. Madrid won't be playing like City or Roma did (that doesn't mean Pool won't be able to find space or be a legit threat, they would).

Also

LeBéninois wrote:If by 60' Liverpool is not leading , the game would be over.

Kroos and casemiro need to step it up

A midfield of kroos modric isco n bale will be fun
Just bench casemiro and control the game

sportsczy wrote:

Nishankly wrote:The teams successfully been able to do that are Chelsea and United, You know how they play. I doubt Real will even try that hard to defend. You'll beat us playing your usual game.

You don't watch Real Madrid. Our tactics are Serie A in concept. We sit back and suck team in and then attack by preference. That's why we do well against attacking teams. We struggle to make play ourselves.

Injuries to fullback and Ramos suspension have hurt us. But those issues aren't there for this game.

Then it'll be fun.

Ecos team's last two videos on the final pretty much make the argument that it is important Madrid withstand first half pressure from Pool, and then do what we did against Juventus last year in the second half, strand a tired Liverpool in their half through good pressure and possession and barrage them with the additional help of Asensio, Lucas, Benz/Bale substitutions.

To top it off, that is how Klopp lost against Bayern with Dortmund.

http://www.zonalmarking.net/2013/05/26/bayern-munich-2-1-borussia-dortmund-dortmund-take-control-with-good-pressing-but-robben-moves-upfront-to-make-the-difference/

"But Dortmund’s pressing had two consequences: a high defensive line, and second half tiredness, meaning little pressure on the ball. That’s a notoriously dangerous mix – Dortmund’s defence weren’t comfortable when forced to turn and run, Bayern continually got in behind, and Robben’s switch to a centre-forward position meant he picked up an assist for the opener, and then scored the winner."

I'm scared. We're usually very exposed vs. mid table teams, and three CLs just isn't possible in this age.

I really think we're going to lose it. Dortmund and countless teams have shown that if they press us they can win us

guest7 wrote:I'm scared.

Don't be. Salah is fasting which means he'll completely ignore the ball and spend the whole time running after the fattest player on the pitch. I'd worry more about their second assistant coach, Peter Krawietz, tbh.

You’re on a roll today, DoC

Mo Salah will not be fasting as he has been purdoned not to fast on that day of Champions League Final by the Grand Mufti of Egypt.

Great news for Liverpool fans

I would've loved to have been there when "The Grand Mufti of Egypt" announced the news. In my mind, it must've gone something like this:

Egyptians: "Grand Mufti, can Salah break his fast?"
GM: "No. No man can. As long as he's not travelling and/or sick, he can't. BTW, who's Salah?".
Egyptians: "He plays for Liverpool and tomorrow they'll play against Madrid in the CL final"
GM:"And you're telling me this now? *bleep* it, of course he can break it. Heck, I'm going to break it too! YNWA"

Hmm, i had a dream last night where i was walking around with the 11/12 Home Kit, which is symbolic to me because I've always kind of seen that CL as the one that got away. My subconscious (and all my consciousnesses tbf) are in red alert.

My prediction is 3-1 Madrid.  A Por La 13!

Real Madrid 2 - 3 Liverpool

Those are the numbers that came to mind. This match could literally go a million different ways though. Zidane is so unpredictable in his lineups and tactics, not to mention how uneven our performances have been. If the big guys show up (Ronaldo, Bale (if he starts), Benz (if he starts), Ramos, Marcelo) we win, if they don't we lose.

The Demon of Carthage wrote:

guest7 wrote:I'm scared.

Don't be. Salah is fasting which means he'll completely ignore the ball and spend the whole time running after the fattest player on the pitch. I'd worry more about their second assistant coach, Peter Krawietz, tbh.

Which means he'll be following Benzema, who will be nowhere near the ball most of the time. Brilliant.

Marca saying BBC starts

I think it's just to make sure benzema starts!

Huge game for benz. He is the only creative player in attack besides Marcelo.. it's do or die today for him

EXCLUSIVA @elchiringuitotv!
XI REAL MADRID (VS. Liverpool) Keylor Navas; Carvajal, Ramos, Varane, Marcelo; Kroos, Casemiro, Modric, Isco; Cristiano y Benzema.

The elephant in the room: I think it's time for everybody to say whether or not Zidane should keep his job beyond tonight. I'm sure everybody has mixed feelings and some of you want him to say regardless of the result tonight. I'm also sure that there are others who think his fate should be predicated on the result tonight.

I'll go first. I think he should keep his job if he wins tonight. If he loses, however, he should be let go. He made countless mistakes this season that only a CL can fix. So if he doesn't win, he must go.

Of course that's my opinion and I'm sure many of you will disagree with me

Anyway, let's hope it doesn't come to that. Let's hope he wins tonight and proves me wrong.