Has anyone's reputation ever taken a hit like Guardiola this past season?

1 year where he's out of his comfort zone & isn't coaching one of the most stacked teams in the World & he gets completely exposed. It's been a streak of Ls since summer 16.

Even his Barca stint looks far less impressive when you see what Zidane is doing at Madrid.

Just your run of the mill chequebook manager, he's no genius.

carried by messi and prime xaviesta.

his most memorable introduction to the football world was referee crowding

Just give him a limitless budget and a couple transfer windows and he'll be able to build a winning team. #Philosophy

Forget Zidane, even Luis Enrique won the treble with Messi on his side.

his reputation has not taken a hit, it's just some organized take down by the british medias to take him down a peg or two. They love taking down a successful foreigner who is nt doing as well as he was in his previous clubs.

Winning trophies in football is in most part a factor of who you have playing for you. He had prime Messi and xaviniesta so he won a lot. It's normal. He played the most dominant team in bundesliga and so he dominated with them nationally, although he got his ass whooped by spanish teams which were at a higher level.

Pep in my opinion is a great manager because of how he gets his players to believe on his idea of what football is, and make them commit to it. He is also a great tactician in the way that his teams always seek to create advantage on the pitch with and without the ball. All his teams show consistently in chance creation and game management.

He can't always win, and his way of playing football requires high IQ football with very high technical level. To me it feels like people inflates what he is as a coach so they can take him down harder the moment he doesnt reach their ridiculous expectations.

Pep is a great coach and manager, he is the best i have seen this generation at coaching talents, technical players etc... But like with many, the trophies he won are also a factor of the players he coached, and that applies to everyone. There are exceptions like what Ranieri did with Leicester but these things can happen.

That he is not winning and walking over the league was predictable and i had said so early on. you dont go from coaching messi, to robben, to sterling and you expect the same results... his reputation is just fine to me. He is still arrogant as ever, and yes he founded the referee crowding movement but that has nothing to do with his ability to coach football.

farfan wrote:Just give him a limitless budget and a couple transfer windows and he'll be able to build a winning team. #Philosophy

This is ridiculous, like in 2008 when he sold Ronaldinho and Deco, signed a couple of nobodies, and won the treble with a team that had previously finished 3rd? In fact, Guardiola's weak point throughout his entire career is that he has survived in spite of constantly blundering in the transfer market. Ibra, Chigrinsky, etc. This is really not a valid criticism you can lay at his feet.

Klopp had his BVB team on a relegation spot. Mourinho had his Chelsea champions falling apart and heading towards relegation too.

But never has anyone's reputation taken a hit like Pep's after finishing 3rd and CL last 16 exit, in his first season at club, league, and country.

Here we have the different standards, black and white, laid out. Case closed.

Nowhere near as much as OPs has, that's for sure.

BarrileteCosmico wrote:

farfan wrote:Just give him a limitless budget and a couple transfer windows and he'll be able to build a winning team.  #Philosophy

This is ridiculous, like in 2008 when he sold Ronaldinho and Deco, signed a couple of nobodies, and won the treble with a team that had previously finished 3rd? In fact, Guardiola's weak point throughout his entire career is that he has survived in spite of constantly blundering in the transfer market. Ibra, Chigrinsky, etc. This is really not a valid criticism you can lay at his feet.

I was mostly talking about his current work with City where we're constantly being told that last year's CL semi-finalists are just not good enough and that investments upwards of 400 million are required before we could judge Guardiola's impact.

I don't think he's a fraud btw, but his first year was a huge disappointment imo especially when contrasted with what some other managers have managed to accomplish with lesser resources ad weaker squads.

farfan wrote:I was mostly talking about his current work with City where we're constantly being told that last year's CL semi-finalists are just not good enough and that investments upwards of 400 million are required before we could judge Guardiola's impact.

I don't think he's a fraud btw, but his first year was a huge disappointment imo especially when contrasted with what some other managers have managed to accomplish with lesser resources ad weaker squads.

But like I said, he is not a transfers genius and no one has ever argued that he is. His record is so bad that Bayern simply took control away from him. His first season at City falls into his Barca trend, with Stones, Bravo and Gundogan flopping handsomely. So can you really argue that he buys his way to a title?

Also let's not ignore the fact that everyone recognized that City players are ill suited to play Guardiola-styled football. He had no ball playing CBs or good midfielders on the ball, which are the core of his system, a renewal was needed anyways, and while City spend more, it's not like Chelsea, United and even Arsenal have a shy wallet as of late.

Hapless_Hans wrote:Klopp had his BVB team on a relegation spot. Mourinho had his Chelsea champions falling apart and heading towards relegation too.

But never has anyone's reputation taken a hit like Pep's after finishing 3rd and CL last 16 exit, in his first season at club, league, and country.

Here we have the different standards, black and white, laid out. Case closed.

Klopp did not require 500m to build his BVB squad. Similarly, last season, Mourinho did not get the players he wanted. Meanwhile, the entire management hierarchy at City has been set up to cater to/facilitate Pep.

Also, Pep does not have to worry about players turning their backs on him like Mourinho as he has essentially rebuilt 75% of the squad so seemingly no one probably has any dressing room influence.

Don't get me wrong, I'm a big admirer of Pep, but the kind of freedom he has been enjoying is disgusting. There are many managers who have had to struggle with lesser resources yet have achieved more.

Until Pep carries a midtable team to a league title on a shoestring budget or wins the CL with an underdog a la Porto, it's unfair to compare him with Klopp or Mourinho.

It's probably not his fault that he has had stacked teams and limitless cash, but it's definitely his fault if he cannot deliver after spending insane amounts of money on signing new players.

Having an underwhelming season under the pretense of building a squad for the future is not really encouraging given the fact that City had the biggest transfer spending last summer.

I think his reputation got a lil rough up but nothing where he'll not be part of the best managers around discussion. I do also think he was the victim of a media doing their very best to make him seem not be "as good" as his reputation but that's just my own personal thinking.

As for the season gone, it was disappointing and I'm sure he knows very well that more is expected from a team managed by him. I do enjoy the excuses by his fans though. Fun for the whole family stuff...

spent hundreds of millions on a squad (95% of signings have underwhelmed or outright flopped)

clownish tactical decisions like playing Kolarov as his star CB for the first part of the season

discarding Hart and seeing the likes of Bravo play like he's blind and deaf

discarding Yaya then having to bring him back to save him

more damning than anything he took a team that were competitive in multiple tournaments last season (even winning one) and made them non-competitive in EVERYTHING this season

this is a season when Arsenal have played their worst football in years, United have underwhelmed in the league..and all teams have made finals or won trophies


and unlike with United, you can't even say there are signs of positivity going forward..he hasn't shown anything to make you believe that this season, instead his solution? spend hundreds of millions overhauling the team. Again. This isn't some tactical genius. It's a lad that's been coddled by being surrounded by the best players in the world in weak leagues

The full verdict is still out but he needs to compete next season or he's going to be sacked

Doc wrote:I think his reputation got a lil rough up but nothing where he'll not be part of the best managers around discussion. I do also think he was the victim of a media doing their very best to make him seem not be "as good" as his reputation but that's just my own personal thinking.

As for the season gone, it was disappointing and I'm sure he knows very well that more is expected from a team managed by him. I do enjoy the excuses by his fans though. Fun for the whole family stuff...

This is what I don't understand though. Peps "fans" will tell you he's underwhelmed this season, that it hasn't been a successful season. Nobody is saying that. Nobody has said there hasn't been enough investment from City, that his transfer market forays have been an unmitigated success.

Rather as usual it is thread after thread or in separate threads you see people, usually seemingly after no provocation even attacking Pep saying he's been a complete failure, that he's a fraud, that he needs Messi to be successful, that his football is boring, he introduced crowding the ref (which btw is completely insane, and Madrid has always "crowded the ref" as much as Barca. Watch any clasico).

I find it hilarious. I actively play a role to be a Pep lover who sees him do no wrong and yet somehow my level of obsession, where I'm playing a role lmao doesn't even touch the level of obsession of any single Pep hater on this forum. It's like Mole said in another thread, it's become toxic to talk about Pep in any context because the haters will enter that thread within the minute offer a couple single sentences talking about him being a fraud, and that's all they have to offer.

After reading everyones post i cant even decide anymore

For me whether hes one of the best I still have my doubts. The thing I dont like is his style will always have major flaws, and hence exploitable, and beatable. So probably luck would play a major factor when it comes getting trophies or not. Making it harder to judge perhaps considering all the things built up, what he achieved previously already, all the different opinions on him, etc.

Still, u cant help but enjoy the teams he creates, the players he buys are always the exiting ones, the entertaining but also frustrating at times football u see from his teams...

Yeah it is annoying for posters to keep calling a manager one likes an unfair and quite frankly inaccurate description of their abilities just because they wanna make fun of them. Especially if the topic demands a serious response.

Nothing wrong with replacing players who are out of contract with quality replacements. City wants to win trophies, and their chances of doing so, increases with big signings.

Doc wrote:Yeah it is annoying for posters to keep calling a manager one likes an unfair and quite frankly inaccurate description of their abilities just because they wanna make fun of them. Especially if the topic demands a serious response.

Nah it's not even that. That's just how the forum is these days. It's the level of obsession from Pep haters.

It's laughable.

Inb4 ES come in "now listen to me punk" etc shite that's getting old

There have been Pep haters for so long, they finally get a season where he doesn't win anything, and they take every chance they get to rub it in everyone's face. I suppose after waiting for 8 years to get a "win" over Pep we should let them have it.

Football is so tumultuous that knee jerks are always going to be a thing especially since people have been questioning Pep for a while and see this as his first 'legit' challenge. People know that Pep could win it all next season, it's what top managers with ludicrous amounts of money are capable of doing. And that's what Pep is, he's a good manager, who undeniably failed in his first season and it happens to everyone - he isn't some transcendent being that is better than his peers. Pep detractors will enjoy their time in the sun for now, this season won't define Pep's City tenure. Next season will if he doesn't win anything again. I'm looking forward to seeing what he can do, it's not like City are going to be spending hundreds of millions and their rivals won't.

Firenze wrote:spent hundreds of millions on a squad (95% of signings have underwhelmed or outright flopped)

clownish tactical decisions like playing Kolarov as his star CB for the first part of the season

discarding Hart and seeing the likes of Bravo play like he's blind and deaf

discarding Yaya then having to bring him back to save him

more damning than anything he took a team that were competitive in multiple tournaments last season (even winning one) and made them non-competitive in EVERYTHING this season

this is a season when Arsenal have played their worst football in years, United have underwhelmed in the league..and all teams have made finals or won trophies


and unlike with United, you can't even say there are signs of positivity going forward..he hasn't shown anything to make you believe that this season, instead his solution? spend hundreds of millions overhauling the team. Again. This isn't some tactical genius. It's a lad that's been coddled by being surrounded by the best players in the world in weak leagues

The full verdict is still out but he needs to compete next season or he's going to be sacked

Are you retarded?

Serious Question.

BarrileteCosmico wrote:There have been Pep haters for so long, they finally get a season where he doesn't win anything, and they take every chance they get to rub it in everyone's face. I suppose after waiting for 8 years to get a "win" over Pep we should let them have it.

As a Pep hater © -- I've been winning since 2013!

chemicalboy99 wrote:Are you retarded?

Serious Question.

He's a treble winner. Not sure if that answers it.

urbaNRoots wrote:

BarrileteCosmico wrote:There have been Pep haters for so long, they finally get a season where he doesn't win anything, and they take every chance they get to rub it in everyone's face. I suppose after waiting for 8 years to get a "win" over Pep we should let them have it.

As a Pep hater © -- I've been winning since 2013!

If not winning the CL is the standard by which we are judging Pep then that says more about Pep's haters than him, imo.

chemicalboy99 wrote:

Firenze wrote:spent hundreds of millions on a squad (95% of signings have underwhelmed or outright flopped)

clownish tactical decisions like playing Kolarov as his star CB for the first part of the season

discarding Hart and seeing the likes of Bravo play like he's blind and deaf

discarding Yaya then having to bring him back to save him

more damning than anything he took a team that were competitive in multiple tournaments last season (even winning one) and made them non-competitive in EVERYTHING this season

this is a season when Arsenal have played their worst football in years, United have underwhelmed in the league..and all teams have made finals or won trophies


and unlike with United, you can't even say there are signs of positivity going forward..he hasn't shown anything to make you believe that this season, instead his solution? spend hundreds of millions overhauling the team. Again. This isn't some tactical genius. It's a lad that's been coddled by being surrounded by the best players in the world in weak leagues

The full verdict is still out but he needs to compete next season or he's going to be sacked

Are you retarded?

Serious Question.

Just a humble lad that's won as many football trophies this season as Pep Guardiola tbf