Barcelona 09 vs Barcelona 11

ali8775 wrote:haha yeah it was quite long

In my opinion, I think Henry in 09 with you was better than Villa is now, he was more of a leader on the pitch, and his stats back him up as well. It depends on how you want to look at it, Messi leaves the center and goes right and left, Eto'o was a natural number 9 who served his purpose VERY well, its a different sort of attack. The attack back then was wayy more direct, I remember this because I used to be a very big Barca fan up to the end of the season 09.

The midfield in 09 was way safer, Yaya was so much more reliable and was a better dribbler, tell me he wasn't ? His short passing wasn't as good as Busquets but that doesn't mean it wasn't good, it was great for a DM, plus his runs ahead also added another dimension in attacking. Also when he was put in CB he also performed very well.

Their understanding now doesn't differ much from then, the difference is that Puyol back then was the worlds 2nd best CB after Vidic and Pique was getting into the top 10. I don't think Xavi has changed much except his stamina, but Iniesta has gotten much better I must admit.

The 09 team had this aura around them, not to say the current doesn't, but in the 09 team, Eto'o and Henry in particular, they were hungry for success and each player had tons of experience and were a leader in their own respect, the team hasn't changed much so you can bring up the point that this team might have the same thing, but imo Alves' mentality has changed a lot since 09. Busquets would never have the same mentality as Yaya ! That team could come back from anything, there was no such thing as defeat in their vocab, they tasted it once and didn't do it again all season . There wasn't a team that could compare back then, like the teams even knew they wouldn't stand a chance, this year it's very different, we had a chance, Madrid had a chance, and to some extent the United team thought they did as well. I also want to point out again the assistance that came into helping Barca reach the final (I'm not accusing Barcelona of bribes or anything, I'm just saying the referee decisions affected them), while the 09 team steamrolled their way into the finals (minus the Chelsea game) . They were record breakers, I don't think Villa - Messi - Pedro will ever crack the 100+ goal mark set by them unless Messi gets even BETTER and scores 90 goals himself Also the 09 team had unparalleled success.

I also apologize for writing an essay but you bring up very good points Joksa, it might just be opinion at the end of the day. :farao:

I don't know about leadership, it's very difficult to judge. Our current crop of players have lots of leaders (Puyol, Xavi, Messi, Iniesta stepping up in big games). Henry's stats were indeed slightly better, but Villa more than makes up for it by his incredible workrate, movement and link-up play imo. But as said, the biggest difference in our attack is Messi, who's on a completely another level now than he was in 09. I do agree that our attack in 09 was more direct, but that's partly because of the opposing teams' tactics that were described in the previous post. In 09 we had much more space to attack, now there's a wall of players ahead of you so our players have to search for openings with their sideway passes. The 09 were more attacking but it's mainly because of the opposition imo.

I don't agree that Yaya was more reliable. Yes, he was better at 1-on-1s but other than that Busquets has been better for us imo. How often is Busquets responsible for a defensive error? Not very often, it's extremely rare in fact. Yaya's physicality and intimidation factor make people think of him as a defensively more secure player when in fact Busquets has been very good for us defensively. Yaya's forward runs did add a dimension to our attack but they were also the main reason for his shortcomings: he was often out of position and thus he left our defense exposed. That doesn't happen with Busquets really, his positioning is flawless. I can understand the differing opinions here though.

The aura is also a grey matter, I don't necessarily agree with it. Did you see us conceding defeat in any of our matches last season? I didn't. We always fought and believed in ourselves. One of the main improvements has been our attitude when the game hangs in balance. Before we used to become nervous, desperately searching for the winning goal and thus making stupid mistakes occasionally. Now we believe in ourselves and keep doing our own thing, knowing that we'll get our break sooner than later.

Maybe you're referring more to the killer instinct we lack. That's something I could agree with. When we were leading matches by a goal we struggled to make the opposition pay for their mistakes and sometimes let teams get back into the game because we didn't take our chances, some of our players seemed to think that the points were already in the bag. That didn't happen in 09 iirc. One of the explanations here could be fatigue, our players appeared to be exhausted throughout the season, maybe this summer's proper rest will get them back into full fitness.

The goals scored is again pretty much down to the tactics we face imo. But I agree that we were a bit more clinical back then, although Eto'o missed even more sitters than Villa did this season

But as you said, it's pretty much a matter of opinion.

both goals were class.

2009

Henry+Eto'o+ Toure made them better. I have little doubt they would win against the 2011 Barcelona.

Plus they won more trophies.

Just watched the el classico 2-6 to Barca match. Barcelona 11 would wipe the floor with them for sure

jibers wrote:Just watched the el classico 2-6 to Barca match. Barcelona 11 would wipe the floor with them for sure

I rewatched the 2009 CL final not long ago, and had the same feeling, considering the 2011 CL final. Then again, 2009 United was probably stronger than 2011 United.

free_cat wrote:

jibers wrote:Just watched the el classico 2-6 to Barca match. Barcelona 11 would wipe the floor with them for sure

I rewatched the 2009 CL final not long ago, and had the same feeling, considering the 2011 CL final. Then again, 2009 United was probably stronger than 2011 United.

Barcelona didn't press that high up the pitch, they just outpassed us in that final, in 2011 final, they utterly dominated us. The amount of slck passing in the el classico games were just unbelievable, they attacke dand defended in seperate phases then as well. Messi is much better now as well, so is iniesta. Xavi is about the same. The 2011 is just unbelievable, they were stopped by a the best Real Madrid team I have seen in my lifetime. This Real Madrid team is better than 09 Barcelona as well. If they played that Barcelona team that won 6-2 at the barnabaeu they would have fared far better. The most important change is the ridiculous pressing.

jibers wrote:

Barcelona didn't press that high up the pitch, they just outpassed us in that final, in 2011 final, they utterly dominated us. The amount of slck passing in the el classico games were just unbelievable, they attacke dand defended in seperate phases then as well. Messi is much better now as well, so is iniesta. Xavi is about the same. The 2011 is just unbelievable, they were stopped by a the best Real Madrid team I have seen in my lifetime. This Real Madrid team is better than 09 Barcelona as well. If they played that Barcelona team that won 6-2 at the barnabaeu they would have fared far better. The most important change is the ridiculous pressing.

Barcelona 08/09 pressed the same as 10/11 all along the season. In the final, Pep took a more conservative approach than usual, to defend better and play slightly more counterattacking and I think he outwitted Fergusson then.

Barca 06 ftw

free_cat wrote:

jibers wrote:

Barcelona didn't press that high up the pitch, they just outpassed us in that final, in 2011 final, they utterly dominated us. The amount of slck passing in the el classico games were just unbelievable, they attacke dand defended in seperate phases then as well. Messi is much better now as well, so is iniesta. Xavi is about the same. The 2011 is just unbelievable, they were stopped by a the best Real Madrid team I have seen in my lifetime. This Real Madrid team is better than 09 Barcelona as well. If they played that Barcelona team that won 6-2 at the barnabaeu they would have fared far better. The most important change is the ridiculous pressing.

Barcelona 08/09 pressed the same as 10/11 all along the season. In the final, Pep took a more conservative approach than usual, to defend better and play slightly more counterattacking and I think he outwitted Fergusson then.

LOl, go and watch most of their games again mate. They didn't press anywhere as mucjh, they always stood off till the half way line then they started pressing. Thye didnt press half as much in the opponents final third, no where near. Rewatched all their big games that season and it's evidnet. This rigourous pressing started in the 09/10 season. Xavi gave the ball al lot mre as well. This Barcelona side would literaly wipe the fllor with the 09 side, hell I think Real Madrid now are better than Barcelona 09. Barcelona 11 are the best team I have ever seen.

11 is better team imo. The 09 team was maybe more clinical and direct, but that was mainly due to the way other teams played us. Check out the 11 games where other teams did not park the buss and you will see the differences.

eelir wrote:11 is better team imo. The 09 team was maybe more clinical and direct, but that was mainly due to the way other teams played us. Check out the 11 games where other teams did not park the buss and you will see the differences.

Without question. Barcelona 11 are probably the most dominant team I have ever seen. They were far more direct and gave the ball away quite a bit by their current standards in 09. Individual performances got them out of stickky situations whereas now Barca play in a certain syetematic way that the team depends very little o individuals and doesnt fall apart when one key player is missing. Plus they have better players and are more comfortable with each other.

jibers wrote:

free_cat wrote:
Barcelona 08/09 pressed the same as 10/11 all along the season. In the final, Pep took a more conservative approach than usual, to defend better and play slightly more counterattacking and I think he outwitted Fergusson then.

LOl, go and watch most of their games again mate. They didn't press anywhere as mucjh, they always stood off till the half way line then they started pressing. Thye didnt press half as much in the opponents final third, no where near. Rewatched all their big games that season and it's evidnet. This rigourous pressing started in the 09/10 season. Xavi gave the ball al lot mre as well. This Barcelona side would literaly wipe the fllor with the 09 side, hell I think Real Madrid now are better than Barcelona 09. Barcelona 11 are the best team I have ever seen.

Your opinion, which is completely wrong. In big matches in the season 08/09 Barça was more carefull and so we were in 10/11, or you don't remember CL semifinals against Madrid? We didn't press much that day.
Oh, and no way in the 09/10 season we pressed more than the 08/09 with Ibrainmobile instead of Eto'o.
Spare your LOLS another time, I was speaking respectfully about your points of view.

jibers wrote:

free_cat wrote:

jibers wrote:

Barcelona didn't press that high up the pitch, they just outpassed us in that final, in 2011 final, they utterly dominated us. The amount of slck passing in the el classico games were just unbelievable, they attacke dand defended in seperate phases then as well. Messi is much better now as well, so is iniesta. Xavi is about the same. The 2011 is just unbelievable, they were stopped by a the best Real Madrid team I have seen in my lifetime. This Real Madrid team is better than 09 Barcelona as well. If they played that Barcelona team that won 6-2 at the barnabaeu they would have fared far better. The most important change is the ridiculous pressing.

Barcelona 08/09 pressed the same as 10/11 all along the season. In the final, Pep took a more conservative approach than usual, to defend better and play slightly more counterattacking and I think he outwitted Fergusson then.

LOl, go and watch most of their games again mate. They didn't press anywhere as mucjh, they always stood off till the half way line then they started pressing. Thye didnt press half as much in the opponents final third, no where near. Rewatched all their big games that season and it's evidnet. This rigourous pressing started in the 09/10 season. Xavi gave the ball al lot mre as well. This Barcelona side would literaly wipe the fllor with the 09 side, hell I think Real Madrid now are better than Barcelona 09. Barcelona 11 are the best team I have ever seen.

Dont agree there.I think we pressed just as much.I think you are judging this off of the CL final in 09.
As free already explained that was a tactical move by Guardiola and a very clever one at that.
We didnt play as high a line.Stayed a bit back,didnt press as much and sucked United into a trap.
But that was the exception.Other games we pressed just as much if not more.Eto'o used to hound defenders much more than Messi now or even Villa.
I do agree however that we give the ball away lesser now.

ali8775 wrote:Pedro > Henry ?
Villa > Eto'o ?
Busquets > Toure?

FML.

It shouldn't even be compared ! The 09 team must be 3rd best team ever period. They had nothing called play acting, didn't have these long boring periods of back passing, they were legit attack and pass. Henry to Eto'o to Messi was the fastest style of play you could see !

Also, I don't know why you all act like you don't remember, Barcelona 09 did get lucky with the referee against Chelsea, but at least didn't have the oppositions best players red carded ... twice...

Just my two cents in the hat!

players dont make teams.. busquets is better than yaya for barca.. he is incredibly underrated.. villa is the lw and etoo is the cf so he should be compared to messi.. though villa and pedro are better than henry and etoo for this barca team because they link up so well and maintain their game..

and btw good players dont make a strong team.. our rm team with zizou,becks, ronaldo, raul were thrashed by the likes of lyon, leverkusen while this madrid side would beat them easily..

alexjanosik wrote:

jibers wrote:

free_cat wrote:

jibers wrote:

Barcelona didn't press that high up the pitch, they just outpassed us in that final, in 2011 final, they utterly dominated us. The amount of slck passing in the el classico games were just unbelievable, they attacke dand defended in seperate phases then as well. Messi is much better now as well, so is iniesta. Xavi is about the same. The 2011 is just unbelievable, they were stopped by a the best Real Madrid team I have seen in my lifetime. This Real Madrid team is better than 09 Barcelona as well. If they played that Barcelona team that won 6-2 at the barnabaeu they would have fared far better. The most important change is the ridiculous pressing.

Barcelona 08/09 pressed the same as 10/11 all along the season. In the final, Pep took a more conservative approach than usual, to defend better and play slightly more counterattacking and I think he outwitted Fergusson then.

LOl, go and watch most of their games again mate. They didn't press anywhere as mucjh, they always stood off till the half way line then they started pressing. Thye didnt press half as much in the opponents final third, no where near. Rewatched all their big games that season and it's evidnet. This rigourous pressing started in the 09/10 season. Xavi gave the ball al lot mre as well. This Barcelona side would literaly wipe the fllor with the 09 side, hell I think Real Madrid now are better than Barcelona 09. Barcelona 11 are the best team I have ever seen.

Dont agree there.I think we pressed just as much.I think you are judging this off of the CL final in 09.
As free already explained that was a tactical move by Guardiola and a very clever one at that.
We didnt play as high a line.Stayed a bit back,didnt press as much and sucked United into a trap.
But that was the exception.Other games we pressed just as much if not more.Eto'o used to hound defenders much more than Messi now or even Villa.
I do agree however that we give the ball away lesser now.

Respectfully diagree. Over the whole course of 09 season Barcelona did not press as rigourously and as systematically as they did today. Most of the games they stood off to the half way line then the team started pressing, the united game was nothing out of the ordinary. They went through a patch were they tried to start pressing hight up the pitch like they ddi today but generally through out 09 they didn't, and they weren't as organised, and they definately dint have this much possession. The team plays quite differently. 2011 is a very scary team. Very scary.