Barcelona 09 vs Barcelona 11

They have the same core players but different style. Barcelona 09 played more attacking and though maintaining possession was high, they were a lot more attacking whereas now they are more cautious and wear down their oppomnents with their ball movements. I personally think that though 09 was more entertaining, '11 are a better team and would do to them what they have been doing to most teams. 09's attacking unit was better and more prolific, but 11 are a more cohesive unit and have mastered tikki taka. 09 was the offensive version, Spain is the defensive version, 11 is the healthy medium of the 2. Btw this is a proper vs thread not a preference. In a h2h match up who would win, and if you can please state the reason for your choice .

I enjoyed wathcing Barca 09 more... not sure if they were better tbh

2011 Barcelona is a much more complete team and when they're on form they are just as if not more attacking than the 2009 Barcelona i.e. 5-0 v Madrid, 8-0 v Almeria etc.

The current team is better and the main reason is Messi.
Messi 09 was great but Messi 11 is a couple of levels better and far more lethal and clutch.
At their best Barca 11>Barca 09

jibers
The attacking part I dont agree fully.I think its also down to how teams play against us.In 09 very few teams parked the bus against us.So as a result me might have seemed more attacking.Now quite a few teams park the bus.So theres nothing much Barca can do except pass patiently and wait for an opportunity.

alexjanosik wrote:The current team is better and the main reason is Messi.
Messi 09 was great but Messi 11 is a couple of levels better and far more lethal and clutch.
At their best Barca 11>Barca 09

jibers
The attacking part I dont agree fully.I think its also down to how teams play against us.In 09 very few teams parked the bus against us.So as a result me might have seemed more attacking.Now quite a few teams park the bus.So theres nothing much Barca can do except pass patiently and wait for an opportunity.

Good point, I was going to mention that but I forgot.

This team is superior to 2009 team IMO

Cautious play had a lot to do with world cup fatigue IMO . Almost everyone in their XI played in the WC final so burnout was expected .So its a credit to them that they have managed such a great season this year despite fatigue.

They played great attacking football at the start of the season ( Real 5-0 etc ) but once fatigue caught up with them they played within themselves IMO .

Barca in CL final played with the same energy and attacking venom similar to start of season once they had a decent break. I would say we will see the best of this Barca team next year when they have a full pre-season rest .

The 09' team had Henry and Eto'o... how much sexier can you get? Those guys are known for being direct players, as well, so it's an obvious choice for me.

Both are same annoyingly good side in my eyes. Of course, they both play different from each other but the end result is about the same...

I think the 2011 team is overall more mature and better, especially tactics wise.

Jibers with his hard on for barca in the new forms as well I see.

pretty much equal.i would say 2009 was a less difficult season.people never expected such high level of football from us.we had more depth,less injury and our attacking trio was invincible.

2011 was a much more difficult season.big injury problems,pedro and villa out of form for large stretches of the 2nd half,puyol and abidal missing.we won the liga and CL with a makeshift defence.people this time knew how to stop us but we managed to win it in the end.this was a royal pep victory.we had doubts whether he could tackle the bus parking tactics,the media pressure and the internal troubles due to change of club presidents.and finally he did.

Eto made them look more attacking team.

they sure miss Eto'o

Eto made them look more attacking team.

they sure miss Eto'o

Yuri Yukuv wrote:Jibers with his hard on for barca in the new forms as well I see.

lol after that spanking they gave us i conceded mate. Good to see you

Barcelona 09 was humble and respectful ...

Barcelona 11 is better imo

Alex's point about the difference in tactics used by the opposition is a very important aspect in comparing the two.

Pedro > Henry ?
Villa > Eto'o ?
Busquets > Toure?

FML.

It shouldn't even be compared ! The 09 team must be 3rd best team ever period. They had nothing called play acting, didn't have these long boring periods of back passing, they were legit attack and pass. Henry to Eto'o to Messi was the fastest style of play you could see !

Also, I don't know why you all act like you don't remember, Barcelona 09 did get lucky with the referee against Chelsea, but at least didn't have the oppositions best players red carded ... twice...

Just my two cents in the hat!

ali8775 wrote:Pedro > Henry ?
Villa > Eto'o ?
Busquets > Toure?

FML.

It shouldn't even be compared ! The 09 team must be 3rd best team ever period. They had nothing called play acting, didn't have these long boring periods of back passing, they were legit attack and pass. Henry to Eto'o to Messi was the fastest style of play you could see !

Also, I don't know why you all act like you don't remember, Barcelona 09 did get lucky with the referee against Chelsea, but at least didn't have the oppositions best players red carded ... twice...

Just my two cents in the hat!

see not the players, see the system.. real madrid original galacticos vs real madrid 2011.. was ozil better than zizou? was di maria better than figo? was benzema better than el phenomeno>? nope but this rm 2011 is more balanced and better suited and got one crazy portugese goal machine ...similiarly villa> henry in this barca team.. his link up play having played in la liga and spain for years suits barca.. pedro too being a la masia graduate works harded and doesnt disillusion the team and create dressing room drama that etoo was err a bit accustomed to doing.. and xavi iniesta and messi the best players in both sides are even better now and plus this team is more efficient at keeping possesion.. and lastly, yaya for all his greatness cant dive like biscuits which won them the cl match..

diptiman wrote:

ali8775 wrote:Pedro > Henry ?
Villa > Eto'o ?
Busquets > Toure?

FML.

It shouldn't even be compared ! The 09 team must be 3rd best team ever period. They had nothing called play acting, didn't have these long boring periods of back passing, they were legit attack and pass. Henry to Eto'o to Messi was the fastest style of play you could see !

Also, I don't know why you all act like you don't remember, Barcelona 09 did get lucky with the referee against Chelsea, but at least didn't have the oppositions best players red carded ... twice...

Just my two cents in the hat!

see not the players, see the system.. real madrid original galacticos vs real madrid 2011.. was ozil better than zizou? was di maria better than figo? was benzema better than el phenomeno>? nope but this rm 2011 is more balanced and better suited and got one crazy portugese goal machine ...similiarly villa> henry in this barca team.. his link up play having played in la liga and spain for years suits barca.. pedro too being a la masia graduate works harded and doesnt disillusion the team and create dressing room drama that etoo was err a bit accustomed to doing.. and xavi iniesta and messi the best players in both sides are even better now and plus this team is more efficient at keeping possesion.. and lastly, yaya for all his greatness cant dive like biscuits which won them the cl match..

but can you tell me, that this Real Madrid team would even stand half a chance against them ? having a balanced team is great, but in the end that team has just the same amount of chemistry, and I want to disagree, Henry scored 28 goals in his second year and I don't recall how many assists, but it was quite a number. If anyone recalls, Henry had a fantastic understanding with Eto'o ! Pedro just being a La Masia graduate makes him a hard worker over Eto'o ?! That's ridiculous! Eto'o worked like a horse! Last season, which was 09, not a peep came out of Eto'o , he was really professional. This team is more efficient at keeping possession, but that team was better at doing something with the ball at their feet. I must agree about the buscuits thing though

ali8775 wrote:Pedro > Henry ?
Villa > Eto'o ?
Busquets > Toure?

FML.

It shouldn't even be compared ! The 09 team must be 3rd best team ever period. They had nothing called play acting, didn't have these long boring periods of back passing, they were legit attack and pass. Henry to Eto'o to Messi was the fastest style of play you could see !

Also, I don't know why you all act like you don't remember, Barcelona 09 did get lucky with the referee against Chelsea, but at least didn't have the oppositions best players red carded ... twice...

Just my two cents in the hat!

Well, most people who follow us regularly would say that this indeed is a better team than we had in 09.

You started with player comparisons, so let's make some (although they don't mean that much after all, the biggest changes have been in our tactics).

Villa plays on the left where Henry used to be, Messi in the center instead of Eto'o and Pedro on the right instead of Messi. So by your logic the comparison should be:

Villa > Henry
Messi > Eto'o
Pedro< Messi

Not only that, the biggest reason for our improvement (as alex pointed out) is Messi. He's much, much better than he was in 09. His whole game has stepped up a level or two.

Then there's the midfield. You can say what you want about Yaya and Busquets, but our current midfield trio is better than the Xavi-Yaya-Iniesta we had in 09. Busquets compliments the Xaviesta duo perfectly. There really isn't a better DM for us (note: I'm not saying that Busquets is the best DM, because he isn't imo, but he suits us the best. Better than Yaya did). We also have to keep in mind that Busquets displaced Yaya in the latter parts of the 09 season and he's miles better now than he was back then. Add to that Iniesta's increased consistency and the current midfield is better.

Then there's the defense. Puyol is getting old and his level might've dropped slightly (although I can't recall a single mistake he would've made last season) but his near perfect partnership with Pique makes up for it. Pique himself has matured a lot. Alves was a beast for us right after his transfer and he still is, not much has changed there. But the biggest improvement here is Abidal. He used to be regarded as the "weak link" by some, but he was our best defensive player last season before his surgery. His performance level is higher now than it was in 09.

Lastly there's Valdes. He was good in the 09 also, but his performances last season were pretty brilliant. He has evolved into on of the top keepers around.

Then there's the bench which has been a bit of a problem for us. It's just that it's nearly impossible to properly replace our starting XI members so the quality drops a bit when someone's missing. We've been very lucky with injuries during Pep's tenure so we've managed to deal with it. I don't see that big of a difference between our current and 09 bench players really.

Then there are the tactics. Alex made a brilliant point how most teams in 09 played us the way they played everyone else which resulted in flowing, attacking matches. Compare that to the teams we face now, there's nowhere near that much space available than there was in 09. Teams didn't expect us to dominate in 09, now most teams set up to be completely defensive and rely on quick counters. Of course we can't be that attacking that we were back then. I'm sure that many people preferred to watch the 09 Barca instead of this one, but even if their style was more entertaining this is just as effective. It might be more boring but it works and that's pretty much what this thread is about. It's not which of the teams were more entertaining, it's which one's better.

Messi always used to just cut in from the right, now he plays as a false nine and is much more unpredictable and dangerous. Increased possession has made us control the matches more. Busquets's role as a DM -3rd CB - sweeper has made wonders for our defensive security, ball retention and passing. Subtle changes have made us a more balanced unit.

This turned out to be quite a long post and it's incoherently written, my apologies for that. But hopefully you get my point, this team is more refined and slightly better than the one which we had in 09. Some of our key players are getting old (Puyol, Xavi) so it remains to be seen what the future holds for us, but for me, this Barca side of 2011 is the best team we've ever had.

well as a neutral i enjoyed watchin henry-eto'o-messi play together..the 6-2 drubbing of real madrid was one hell of an entertaining match..also there were more glamourous names in the 09 lineup than the '11 one

joksa wrote:

Well, most people who follow us regularly would say that this indeed is a better team than we had in 09.

You started with player comparisons, so let's make some (although they don't mean that much after all, the biggest changes have been in our tactics).

Villa plays on the left where Henry used to be, Messi in the center instead of Eto'o and Pedro on the right instead of Messi. So by your logic the comparison should be:

Villa > Henry
Messi > Eto'o
Pedro< Messi

Not only that, the biggest reason for our improvement (as alex pointed out) is Messi. He's much, much better than he was in 09. His whole game has stepped up a level or two.

Then there's the midfield. You can say what you want about Yaya and Busquets, but our current midfield trio is better than the Xavi-Yaya-Iniesta we had in 09. Busquets compliments the Xaviesta duo perfectly. There really isn't a better DM for us (note: I'm not saying that Busquets is the best DM, because he isn't imo, but he suits us the best. Better than Yaya did). We also have to keep in mind that Busquets displaced Yaya in the latter parts of the 09 season and he's miles better now than he was back then. Add to that Iniesta's increased consistency and the current midfield is better.

Then there's the defense. Puyol is getting old and his level might've dropped slightly (although I can't recall a single mistake he would've made last season) but his near perfect partnership with Pique makes up for it. Pique himself has matured a lot. Alves was a beast for us right after his transfer and he still is, not much has changed there. But the biggest improvement here is Abidal. He used to be regarded as the "weak link" by some, but he was our best defensive player last season before his surgery. His performance level is higher now than it was in 09.

Lastly there's Valdes. He was good in the 09 also, but his performances last season were pretty brilliant. He has evolved into on of the top keepers around.

Then there's the bench which has been a bit of a problem for us. It's just that it's nearly impossible to properly replace our starting XI members so the quality drops a bit when someone's missing. We've been very lucky with injuries during Pep's tenure so we've managed to deal with it. I don't see that big of a difference between our current and 09 bench players really.

Then there are the tactics. Alex made a brilliant point how most teams in 09 played us the way they played everyone else which resulted in flowing, attacking matches. Compare that to the teams we face now, there's nowhere near that much space available than there was in 09. Teams didn't expect us to dominate in 09, now most teams set up to be completely defensive and rely on quick counters. Of course we can't be that attacking that we were back then. I'm sure that many people preferred to watch the 09 Barca instead of this one, but even if their style was more entertaining this is just as effective. It might be more boring but it works and that's pretty much what this thread is about. It's not which of the teams were more entertaining, it's which one's better.

Messi always used to just cut in from the right, now he plays as a false nine and is much more unpredictable and dangerous. Increased possession has made us control the matches more. Busquets's role as a DM -3rd CB - sweeper has made wonders for our defensive security, ball retention and passing. Subtle changes have made us a more balanced unit.

This turned out to be quite a long post and it's incoherently written, my apologies for that. But hopefully you get my point, this team is more refined and slightly better than the one which we had in 09. Some of our key players are getting old (Puyol, Xavi) so it remains to be seen what the future holds for us, but for me, this Barca side of 2011 is the best team we've ever had.

haha yeah it was quite long

In my opinion, I think Henry in 09 with you was better than Villa is now, he was more of a leader on the pitch, and his stats back him up as well. It depends on how you want to look at it, Messi leaves the center and goes right and left, Eto'o was a natural number 9 who served his purpose VERY well, its a different sort of attack. The attack back then was wayy more direct, I remember this because I used to be a very big Barca fan up to the end of the season 09.

The midfield in 09 was way safer, Yaya was so much more reliable and was a better dribbler, tell me he wasn't ? His short passing wasn't as good as Busquets but that doesn't mean it wasn't good, it was great for a DM, plus his runs ahead also added another dimension in attacking. Also when he was put in CB he also performed very well.

Their understanding now doesn't differ much from then, the difference is that Puyol back then was the worlds 2nd best CB after Vidic and Pique was getting into the top 10. I don't think Xavi has changed much except his stamina, but Iniesta has gotten much better I must admit.

The 09 team had this aura around them, not to say the current doesn't, but in the 09 team, Eto'o and Henry in particular, they were hungry for success and each player had tons of experience and were a leader in their own respect, the team hasn't changed much so you can bring up the point that this team might have the same thing, but imo Alves' mentality has changed a lot since 09. Busquets would never have the same mentality as Yaya ! That team could come back from anything, there was no such thing as defeat in their vocab, they tasted it once and didn't do it again all season . There wasn't a team that could compare back then, like the teams even knew they wouldn't stand a chance, this year it's very different, we had a chance, Madrid had a chance, and to some extent the United team thought they did as well. I also want to point out again the assistance that came into helping Barca reach the final (I'm not accusing Barcelona of bribes or anything, I'm just saying the referee decisions affected them), while the 09 team steamrolled their way into the finals (minus the Chelsea game) . They were record breakers, I don't think Villa - Messi - Pedro will ever crack the 100+ goal mark set by them unless Messi gets even BETTER and scores 90 goals himself Also the 09 team had unparalleled success.

I also apologize for writing an essay but you bring up very good points Joksa, it might just be opinion at the end of the day. :farao:

ali8775 wrote:haha yeah it was quite long

In my opinion, I think Henry in 09 with you was better than Villa is now, he was more of a leader on the pitch, and his stats back him up as well. It depends on how you want to look at it, Messi leaves the center and goes right and left, Eto'o was a natural number 9 who served his purpose VERY well, its a different sort of attack. The attack back then was wayy more direct, I remember this because I used to be a very big Barca fan up to the end of the season 09.

The midfield in 09 was way safer, Yaya was so much more reliable and was a better dribbler, tell me he wasn't ? His short passing wasn't as good as Busquets but that doesn't mean it wasn't good, it was great for a DM, plus his runs ahead also added another dimension in attacking. Also when he was put in CB he also performed very well.

Their understanding now doesn't differ much from then, the difference is that Puyol back then was the worlds 2nd best CB after Vidic and Pique was getting into the top 10. I don't think Xavi has changed much except his stamina, but Iniesta has gotten much better I must admit.

The 09 team had this aura around them, not to say the current doesn't, but in the 09 team, Eto'o and Henry in particular, they were hungry for success and each player had tons of experience and were a leader in their own respect, the team hasn't changed much so you can bring up the point that this team might have the same thing, but imo Alves' mentality has changed a lot since 09. Busquets would never have the same mentality as Yaya ! That team could come back from anything, there was no such thing as defeat in their vocab, they tasted it once and didn't do it again all season . There wasn't a team that could compare back then, like the teams even knew they wouldn't stand a chance, this year it's very different, we had a chance, Madrid had a chance, and to some extent the United team thought they did as well. I also want to point out again the assistance that came into helping Barca reach the final (I'm not accusing Barcelona of bribes or anything, I'm just saying the referee decisions affected them), while the 09 team steamrolled their way into the finals (minus the Chelsea game) . They were record breakers, I don't think Villa - Messi - Pedro will ever crack the 100+ goal mark set by them unless Messi gets even BETTER and scores 90 goals himself Also the 09 team had unparalleled success.

I also apologize for writing an essay but you bring up very good points Joksa, it might just be opinion at the end of the day. :farao:

I don't know about leadership, it's very difficult to judge. Our current crop of players have lots of leaders (Puyol, Xavi, Messi, Iniesta stepping up in big games). Henry's stats were indeed slightly better, but Villa more than makes up for it by his incredible workrate, movement and link-up play imo. But as said, the biggest difference in our attack is Messi, who's on a completely another level now than he was in 09. I do agree that our attack in 09 was more direct, but that's partly because of the opposing teams' tactics that were described in the previous post. In 09 we had much more space to attack, now there's a wall of players ahead of you so our players have to search for openings with their sideway passes. The 09 were more attacking but it's mainly because of the opposition imo.

I don't agree that Yaya was more reliable. Yes, he was better at 1-on-1s but other than that Busquets has been better for us imo. How often is Busquets responsible for a defensive error? Not very often, it's extremely rare in fact. Yaya's physicality and intimidation factor make people think of him as a defensively more secure player when in fact Busquets has been very good for us defensively. Yaya's forward runs did add a dimension to our attack but they were also the main reason for his shortcomings: he was often out of position and thus he left our defense exposed. That doesn't happen with Busquets really, his positioning is flawless. I can understand the differing opinions here though.

The aura is also a grey matter, I don't necessarily agree with it. Did you see us conceding defeat in any of our matches last season? I didn't. We always fought and believed in ourselves. One of the main improvements has been our attitude when the game hangs in balance. Before we used to become nervous, desperately searching for the winning goal and thus making stupid mistakes occasionally. Now we believe in ourselves and keep doing our own thing, knowing that we'll get our break sooner than later.

Maybe you're referring more to the killer instinct we lack. That's something I could agree with. When we were leading matches by a goal we struggled to make the opposition pay for their mistakes and sometimes let teams get back into the game because we didn't take our chances, some of our players seemed to think that the points were already in the bag. That didn't happen in 09 iirc. One of the explanations here could be fatigue, our players appeared to be exhausted throughout the season, maybe this summer's proper rest will get them back into full fitness.

The goals scored is again pretty much down to the tactics we face imo. But I agree that we were a bit more clinical back then, although Eto'o missed even more sitters than Villa did this season

But as you said, it's pretty much a matter of opinion.