Art Morte wrote:Sure there's reason to leave if he wants to play more, but other than that I'm all for honoring contracts. I just don't totally get why United are so very reluctant to let him leave.

Well its quite similar to the Pool-Suarez situation really.Why would United strengthen a direct rival ? Absolutely no reason to do so.And i dont put much weight into the Arsenal rumors.Chelsea are the only club  with concrete interest and its totally a sensible decision to not let him go there.

You cant blame United for not letting him go to Chelsea.

Bit odd that you'd say you can't understand United's stance, Art. Liverpool fans should be intimately familiar with the reasoning behind United's apparent decision.

Forcing players to stay is all fine and good.... but let's see how they perform while unhappy. Usually, it works out badly.

S wrote:

Art Morte wrote:Sure there's reason to leave if he wants to play more, but other than that I'm all for honoring contracts. I just don't totally get why United are so very reluctant to let him leave.

Well its quite similar to the Pool-Suarez situation really.Why would United strengthen a direct rival ? Absolutely no reason to do so.And i dont put much weight into the Arsenal rumors.Chelsea are the only club  with concrete interest and its totally a sensible decision to not let him go there.

You cant blame United for not letting him go to Chelsea.

RedOranje wrote:Bit odd that you'd say you can't understand United's stance, Art.  Liverpool fans should be intimately familiar with the reasoning behind United's apparent decision.

The differences are that Rooney wouldn't strengthen Chelsea as much as Suarez would strengthen Arsenal. Also Suarez will be playing as much as he wants at Liverpool, whereas Rooney's frustration seems to come from him riding the bench and/or being played in different position than he'd like to. And still what's more is that Liverpool would have a much, much harder time replacing Suarez than United would have replacing Rooney.

Those are the reasons why I understand Liverpool really not wanting to sell Suarez to Arsenal, but don't quite as well understand United's stance on Rooney.

Art Morte wrote:The differences are that Rooney wouldn't strengthen Chelsea

Why not ? Especially when they have a coach who can get the best out of his players.We arent talking about how much he'd strengthen them in comparison to Suarez but do Chelsea have a better chance of winning the title than they do now ? The answer would be a resounding yes hence why i completely understand United's stance.You speak as if Rooney has completely regressed as a player which isnt really the case and United are fully aware that there's a very good possibility of him being rejuvenated at Chelsea thereby denting their own title hopes.

And as far as performance of disgruntled players goes,it wouldnt matter for United as they have Kagawa and Chicarito as stand in.United wont lose much as much as Liverpool would if Suarez suddenly has a dip in his performances.

If the possibility of selling abroad arised i think they would've sold him imo which doesnt seem to be the case.So calling this a 'dick move' from United is very harsh as they are looking at the interest of the team primarily here.

Da hell, man, why would you quote me like that xD

I didn't say Rooney wouldn't strengthen Chelsea, of course he would, but not as significantly as Suarez would Arsenal.

Obviously it would be better for United if Rooney didn't join another title rival, but I wouldn't say it'd be a massive blow for them - and certainly not as massive as Suarez joining Arsenal would be for Liverpool.

Chelsea's chances of winning the title automatically increases with Rooney and maybe they could become a even bigger contender than United with him so i'm not sure why they would want that..Or am i missing something here ?
Its not a big loss if he left yes,but i think from their perspective they would rather keep a disgruntled Rooney at United than seeing a rejuvenated Rooney blossoming for Chelsea and possibly pipping them for the title.
All i'm saying is United wouldnt want to pile additional pressure on themselves by selling him to Chelsea.

I don't understand why Rooney isn't attracting more interest abroad, he would be sold by now if a big foreign club wanted him.
Would he not improve a squad like Barcelona, Juve, Madrid, Bayern or PSG?

He's not going to chelsea or city I can't see united strengthening either of those clubs purely because of the domestic rivalry, unless it's unrealistic money mind you.

As it stands Rooney needs Man United more then Man United needs him, wonder how it will work out.

Gemini wrote:I don't understand why Rooney isn't attracting more interest abroad, he would be sold by now if a big foreign club wanted him.
Would he not improve a squad like Barcelona, Juve, Madrid, Bayern or PSG?

He's not going to chelsea or city I can't see united strengthening either of those clubs purely because of the domestic rivalry, unless it's unrealistic money mind you.

As it stands Rooney needs Man United more then Man United needs him, wonder how it will work out.

His salary is monstrous and he is not that good (given how much he earns) + he is inconsistent. Of all those clubs I can only see him getting easily in to the juventus 11.in madrid he would compete with benzema or ronaldo. He may be better than benzema, but why buy a different player when the difference isn't big and benzema is younger. In barcelona, where would he play? or you think he can play over Messi? In Psg they have Cavani and Ibrahimovic and bayern is pretty packed in front to. Maybe he could improve them, but why pay so much when what you have is already quite good and the newcomer would be unproffesional, inconsistent and a trouble maker that can destroy your wage structure.
.

Barcelona have been crying out for a proper striker for a while now and Barca can't rely on Messi to do everything anymore (last season's CL anyone?)

Nirgall wrote:why pay so much when what you have is already quite good

As if PSG can't afford to splash money on Rooney. "Pay so much" is not in PSG's vocabulary

Nirgall wrote:

His salary is monstrous and he is not that good (given how much he earns) + he is inconsistent. Of all those clubs I can only see him getting easily in to the juventus 11.in madrid he would compete with benzema or ronaldo. He may be better than benzema, but why buy a different player when the difference isn't big and benzema is younger. In barcelona, where would he play? or you think he can play over Messi? In Psg they have Cavani and Ibrahimovic and bayern is pretty packed in front to. Maybe he could improve them, but why pay so much when what you have is already quite good and the newcomer would be unproffesional, inconsistent and a trouble maker that can destroy your wage structure.  
.

Most good players wage are monstrous, but he is a good football player. Is he worth what he's getting paid - I don't think so but who is in the sport?

Madrid would do well to have him, he's a step up from benzema. As with most things in life you have to pay big for small improvements. Rooney would cost around the 30-35m outside of england it would make a lot more sense then buying 100m bale.
Don't know with Barcelona, but neymar - messi - rooney doesn't sound bad to me...
I would take a rejuvenated Rooney over Mandzukic any day it's probably the only area Bayern could improve, surprises me that they're not in for him.

Rooney's lack of attention physical fitness is a big, big concern for anyone looking to invest in him. Typically, these players' careers are shorter than the average...

In terms of Barca going for Suarez/Rooney, neither are RW's, however when Barca have the ball, they can just move central like Villa did at times last season.

When they don't have the ball, Suarez/Rooney would press from RW and track back from RW?

Gemini wrote:I don't understand why Rooney isn't attracting more interest abroad, he would be sold by now if a big foreign club wanted him.
Would he not improve a squad like Barcelona, Juve, Madrid, Bayern or PSG?
.

When you take the whole picture into account the answer is: No, yes, no, no and no. And jive has a cash balance of 1m so good luck with getting them interested.

Barcelona should have no intrest in Rooney or any other star type name forward.

Already have Neymar and Messi, the right side is crying out for dirty work, role player types who take a minimal amount of touches and can still be effective.

Could use a real number 9 in the squad, but as a squad player and little more.

Gemini wrote:

Nirgall wrote:

His salary is monstrous and he is not that good (given how much he earns) + he is inconsistent. Of all those clubs I can only see him getting easily in to the juventus 11.in madrid he would compete with benzema or ronaldo. He may be better than benzema, but why buy a different player when the difference isn't big and benzema is younger. In barcelona, where would he play? or you think he can play over Messi? In Psg they have Cavani and Ibrahimovic and bayern is pretty packed in front to. Maybe he could improve them, but why pay so much when what you have is already quite good and the newcomer would be unproffesional, inconsistent and a trouble maker that can destroy your wage structure.  
.

Most good players wage are monstrous, but he is a good football player. Is he worth what he's getting paid - I don't think so but who is in the sport?

Madrid would do well to have him, he's a step up from benzema. As with most things in life you have to pay big for small improvements. Rooney would cost around the 30-35m outside of england it would make a lot more sense then buying 100m bale.  
Don't know with Barcelona, but neymar - messi - rooney doesn't sound bad to me...
I would take a rejuvenated Rooney over Mandzukic any day it's probably the only area Bayern could improve, surprises me that they're not in for him.

He earns as much as the best players in the world. Right now, do you think he is one of them? If you think so, then we are not on the same page.

And I don't agree with paying big for small improvements. Maybe PSG can afford it, but the other clubs are either not that rich, or like madrid and barcelona, they are investing in other very expensive players, who are also much better and younger.

For me the thing with rooney right now is that you get all that's bad about a super star: the ego, the wage, the no tracking back, the ball hogging, etc... You get all the requirements that players like Ronaldo and Messi would ask for, but you don't get Ronaldo/Messi kind of performances.

Nirgall wrote:

Gemini wrote:

Nirgall wrote:

His salary is monstrous and he is not that good (given how much he earns) + he is inconsistent. Of all those clubs I can only see him getting easily in to the juventus 11.in madrid he would compete with benzema or ronaldo. He may be better than benzema, but why buy a different player when the difference isn't big and benzema is younger. In barcelona, where would he play? or you think he can play over Messi? In Psg they have Cavani and Ibrahimovic and bayern is pretty packed in front to. Maybe he could improve them, but why pay so much when what you have is already quite good and the newcomer would be unproffesional, inconsistent and a trouble maker that can destroy your wage structure.  
.

Most good players wage are monstrous, but he is a good football player. Is he worth what he's getting paid - I don't think so but who is in the sport?

Madrid would do well to have him, he's a step up from benzema. As with most things in life you have to pay big for small improvements. Rooney would cost around the 30-35m outside of england it would make a lot more sense then buying 100m bale.  
Don't know with Barcelona, but neymar - messi - rooney doesn't sound bad to me...
I would take a rejuvenated Rooney over Mandzukic any day it's probably the only area Bayern could improve, surprises me that they're not in for him.

He earns as much as the best players in the world. Right now, do you think he is one of them? If you think so, then we are not on the same page.

And I don't agree with paying big for small improvements. Maybe PSG can afford it, but the other clubs are either not that rich, or like madrid and barcelona, they are investing in other very expensive players, who  are also much better and younger.

For me the thing with rooney right now is that you get all that's bad about a super star: the ego, the wage, the no tracking back, the ball hogging, etc... You get all the requirements that players like Ronaldo and Messi would ask for, but you don't get Ronaldo/Messi kind of performances.

and now I know you're just talking shite and don't watch Rooney play

ball hogging

pls go

I may have been exaggerating with the gall hogging, but it's true that Rooney's work rate has decreases a lot.

Regardless my point stands. He is not worth the money, you can get better.

How is Rooney inconsistent?

He's been asked to play forward, midfield and ALWAYS does his role. Just because he doesn't score does not mean he doesn't perform.

Nirgall wrote:I may have been exaggerating with the gall hogging, but it's true that Rooney's work rate has decreases a lot.

Regardless my point stands. He is not worth the money, you can get better.

I really dont think you know what your talking about. He does have a pretty high work rate, he does track back, he likes having the ball. I feel like your judging the the decreased work rate from articles on espn saying that when he did play for united in the last part of the season he seemed out of sorts (which he did), but it was pretty obvious there was some alienation. I do agree there there are better strikers for his price, but a fit rooney is worth 38 -40 mill price tag, and if you have a grand talented midfeild, he would no doubt flourish in it (you have to also consider that before kawaga came into the picture, he was probably uniteds most creative player for the past 3 seasons).

The lack of work rate and the inconsistency are simply my personal views based on watching him play last season. He seemed to not care many times.

And I'm don't think I should be the only one that thinks that way. Has none of you honestly noticed that Rooney tends to be very hit and miss, sometimes playing really badly and getting easily frustrated.  I've heard countless excuses about why that is, from injuries, to unhappiness, to a messy personal life, but I have either been very unfortunate every time I see him or he has been horrible more than once this season.

Lets say that a fit and motivated rooney could do wonders with the rigth midfield. But players that earn as much as he does, do not need much to be fit and motivated. You just play them and they perform. What's the point of a club paying Ronaldo/Messi kind of wages to a player that doesn't give you Ronaldo/Messi performances level and consistency?

I miss the old angry chavish Rooney from mid 2000s. Wonder where it went wrong for him.

I mean that is not to say that he is no longer a top tier player.... but he could have been a lot better.

Uncanny wrote:

Nirgall wrote:I may have been exaggerating with the gall hogging, but it's true that Rooney's work rate has decreases a lot.

Regardless my point stands. He is not worth the money, you can get better.

I really dont think you know what your talking about.  He does have a pretty high work rate, he does track back, he likes having the ball.  I feel like your judging the the decreased work rate from articles on espn saying that when he did play for united in the last part of the season he seemed out of sorts (which he did), but it was pretty obvious there was some alienation.  I do agree there there are better strikers for his price, but a fit rooney is worth 38 -40 mill price tag, and if you have a grand talented midfeild, he would no doubt flourish in it (you have to also consider that before kawaga came into the picture, he was probably uniteds most creative player for the past 3 seasons).

still is are most creative player, kagawa hasn't proved he can dictate a game at rooney's level yet, big reason the club will hold on to him still.

Nirgall wrote:The lack of work rate and the inconsistency are simply my personal views based on watching him play last season. He seemed to not care many times.

And I'm don't think I should be the only one that thinks that way. Has none of you honestly noticed that Rooney tends to be very hit and miss, sometimes playing really badly and getting easily frustrated.  I've heard countless excuses about why that is, from injuries, to unhappiness, to a messy personal life, but I have either been very unfortunate every time I see him or he has been horrible more than once this season.

Lets say that a fit and motivated rooney could do wonders with the rigth midfield. But players that earn as much as he does, do not need much to be fit and motivated.  You just play them and they perform. What's the point of a club paying Ronaldo/Messi kind of wages to a player that doesn't give you Ronaldo/Messi performances level and consistency?

Because Ronaldo and messi are picked for every game and have to freedom to play in their desired position. Rooney is rather annoyed at playing a midfielder and on top of that not being picked for important games. You could argue the Ronaldo messi argument with Rooney the season before, but remember he was the one that was carrying united before RvP, think about it.

Arsenalfaithfull wrote:I miss the old angry chavish Rooney from mid 2000s. Wonder where it went wrong for him.

I mean that is not to say that he is no longer a top tier player.... but he could have been a lot better.

He's carried United on his own since Ronaldo's left the club...

something-red wrote:

Arsenalfaithfull wrote:I miss the old angry chavish Rooney from mid 2000s. Wonder where it went wrong for him.

I mean that is not to say that he is no longer a top tier player.... but he could have been a lot better.

He's carried United on his own since Ronaldo's left the club...

Complete BS...He has been a Ghost for the past two seasons.

And now that Chelsea are after Eto'o, i hope Rooney rots in United's Reserves.