The Athletic Bilbao Situation

BarrileteCosmico wrote:Actually Spencer from my own research I can say I was disappointed to find out that if you are raised in the basque country but don't have a parent that is basque then you're likely to be rejected when trying out for them. Apparently being raised there is not enough.

BarrileteCosmico wrote:Actually Spencer from my own research I can say I was disappointed to find out that if you are raised in the basque country but don't have a parent that is basque then you're likely to be rejected when trying out for them. Apparently being raised there is not enough.

BarrileteCosmico wrote:Well just for argument's sake, is there any player right now that does not have Basque heritage? Last time I looked, I didn't find any. So it looks like exceptions, while theoretically possible, are not very probable.

BarrileteCosmico wrote:Well just for argument's sake, is there any player right now that does not have Basque heritage? Last time I looked, I didn't find any. So it looks like exceptions, while theoretically possible, are not very probable.

Arquitecto wrote:

BarrileteCosmico wrote:Well just for argument's sake, is there any player right now that does not have Basque heritage? Last time I looked, I didn't find any. So it looks like exceptions, while theoretically possible, are not very probable.

As of now? Not at all.

Yet, given that the biggest minorities are the buhameak (Bohemians) and the French (hardly considered a minority here for many reasons) there is little chance to see an exception to crop up within the ranks is fairly low given the odds.

Other exceptions were Bixente Biurrun of back then who was born in Sao Paolo but with Basque heritage and identification for the culture.

Now? There is Ayermic Laporte who is a 16 year old and very talented CB from the Basque region within France who is half French and Half french Basque.

worms wrote:

BarrileteCosmico wrote:Well just for argument's sake, is there any player right now that does not have Basque heritage? Last time I looked, I didn't find any. So it looks like exceptions, while theoretically possible, are not very probable.

Ramalho is only half Basque.

So no you don't have to have full Basque heritage anymore.

I don't even see the point in the rule anymore.They might as well let any player be eligible to play for them but still play mostly local players.

Arquitecto wrote:I can guarantee you RG, that you will receive little input from this thread given that Cataracho and I are the only Athletic Club followers here. The rest will be based on half assed assumptions. I can see 'em coming.

Want to know what happened? I'll start.

Marcelo Bielsa an avid student of Basque and Dutch Football comes in to replace a the pragmatic Caparros. He immediately Athletic's and the Basque footballing philosophy in high end pressing, constant interchanging forward lines, false midfielders switching positions within the blink of an eye etc etc.

The training is brutal, tactical and meticulously detailed to the point of insanity. In other words. Basque to the core.

Bielsa's formation as his best throughout the season were quintessentially, the 4-2-3-1 and the 3-4-3 diamond along with a 3-5-2 modification. 4-3-3 is his favourite but worked with mixed results going black and white.

What he did was brilliant. He developed Jon Aurtunexte and unearth his world class potential. Showed that Iraola as a wingback is devastatingly good on attack. Itturaspe trusted as the midfield general showing his superb range of passing and excellent defensive positioning. Javi? When he wasn't bossing midfields with Itu he was playing CB and doing a fine job there. Then there was the versatile De Marcos who played in front as a CAM rotating often with Ander Herrera (brilliant playmaker) while Munian given a free role on the left with option to interchange with Susaeta on the flanks as inside attacking midfielders with Susaeta providing the bulk of the width. He trusted Fernando Llorente as more than just a #9 unlike Caparros who played him restricted with long balls on his way. Llorente's false 9 position was a revelation with his dropping deep, creating links, creating chances and dominating back lines like anything. He was trusted into the complete forward that he is.

Problem then arose.

1. Bielsa had a knack for rotating players who didn't need to be rotated and did not rotate and rest the players who needed to rest. The sheer fatigue in training of the Basque philosophy eventually started to catch up to Atheltic's squad. The training not only was brutal physically but mentally tested them to their limits. Bielsa's perfectionism in training was starting to catch up. Keep in mind this is/was the youngest Spanish team in La Liga today.

2. La Liga, Europa League, Copa Del Rey all with all players starting and not being rotated correctly. Fatigue mentally and physically taking its toll increasingly.

3. And of course, my biggest criticism. Bielsa as mentioned is a perfectionist. Athletic finally found the original Euskadi system to work and the increasing momentum devastated teams. Yet Bielsa's biggest strength was his biggest flaw....He kept on changing the Basque systems to other variances, which is fine to an extent given their training since childhood to adopt to those. The problem was he changed the formation too many times. Instead of following through with the philosophy and system he tried eventually too many times to adapt to the opposition's tactics, effectively abandoning the dominant identity of Athletic's unearthed footballing way. Formations changed almost every game. Atheltic destroy Man United with a 3-5-2? Oh, scrap that and go back to the 4-3-3. 4-2-3-1 working vs Madrid first half? Scrap that and change the formation for absolutely no reason, thus letting Madrid destroy Atheltic. The consistent change of formations and systema disillusioned, alienated and mentally destroyed the young squad and setting their development back, and burning them out completely. Each and everyone of the squad bar Muniain, Iraola, Javi, De Marcos were completely burnt out. Llorente out of all was completely destroyed.He then scrapped plans again and again and again until the Basque philosophy lost its core identity and became into a bunch of burnouts attempting the same systema, just without the quick and tactical pressing, interchanging and domination from the spread. Did I mention half of the players with the changing formations were consistently forced out of their best roles in the 2nd half of the season?

Take #1 and #2 and combine it #3 and you have a complete disaster which occured 2nd half of the season along with the tactics moving onto be more conventional and uninspired. Not to mention the best formations were abandoned for the bloody 4-3-3 which further added to the burnout process. Barca, Madrid, Atheltic in the EL final all took advantage and exploited the weaknesses perfectly. Oh yeah, and remember how devastated Athletic were after being destroyed both finals? I once mentioned how badly us Euskadi take losses. Losing 3-0 in both finals was the gold nail in the coffin. I said after that it'll take a year to bounce back from that especially given the youth of this squad.

Ever wonder why Bielsa is called El Loco? He is a genius, but a flawed genius.

New season begins and the players get little time to even recover after being called early upon from the holidays and now you have Bielsa starting from scratch and playing a very uninspired, conservative, and conventional system which is restrictive to most of the players, doesn't use them to their strengths and frankly...isn't Basque.

Bilbai's and the players love Bielsa and frankly so do I but his near maniacal tendencies in all forms above has destabilized their development and the mentality which made them successful. The players look a shadow of themselves almost. Munain, Itu, De Marcos, Susaeta etc are all performing but nowhere near to what they can do and its systemically, tactically Bielsa's fault right now. The loss of Javi wasn't as big as many expected as Iturrapse filled that void. Llorente was a huge loss since his False 9 role and creativity made the front tick along with Ander, De Marcos and Munain. Aduriz is a solid player but in the end he thrives within the box and defines Bielsa's tactics this season, which is conservative and almost self concious.

I'm still hoping for him to find sanity and resort back to what the Bilbai's are shouting for and that is to stop changing the system like clothes, rest the goddamn players, rotate more effetively and play them in their position stick to what worked best, stick to the Basque way.

I still have faith in the long term project of Bielsa as the fans need to as well. It'll be slow to crawl out of the hole he has dug himself but he has all the resources and potential to do so. The squad is full of talent, hunger and potential.

Positives and progress is there, but for every one step forward its two steps back at the moment.

BarrileteCosmico wrote:half is still heritage. I'm clearly speaking about people who are not born basque, but were raised there and are probably as culturally basque as any other.

Catracho wrote:

worms wrote:

BarrileteCosmico wrote:Well just for argument's sake, is there any player right now that does not have Basque heritage? Last time I looked, I didn't find any. So it looks like exceptions, while theoretically possible, are not very probable.

Ramalho is only half Basque.

So no you don't have to have full Basque heritage anymore.

I don't even see the point in the rule anymore.They might as well let any player be eligible to play for them but still play mostly local players.

You said that already. Our local Euskal dropped knowledge on you. You seem mad now.

plz go back to reddit or something.

BarrileteCosmico wrote:Lol vivas is not a die-hard nationalist.

VivaStPauli wrote:
First off, I really want Bayern to be coached by a German.

VivaStPauli wrote:Seriously, in the age of globalization, internationalization, and the European Union, how can you manage to give a shit in which valley a dude is born?

VivaStPauli wrote:
Get a German, they're all good.