For the sake of football, Barcelona must beat Chelsea, blasts Van der Sar

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Post by iNFINITY9910 Mon Apr 23, 2012 9:00 am

fatman123 wrote:so do all these people knocking us hate Guus Hiddinks PSV side that one the CL? and do they hate the Greece side that won the Euros? and do they hate APOELs performances in europe?

Im pretty sure, yes. But in the end... they got the trophies, others got butt hurt.

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Post by Zealous Mon Apr 23, 2012 9:03 am

The Dutch are the most butt hurt football nation of all time.

I would be too tbh, they keep preaching about good football while having to watch Greece and Italy win more silverware than them over recent years with radically different approaches.

When they decided to adopt Rugby style they reached the final and still lost. I feel for them lol
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Post by Onyx Mon Apr 23, 2012 9:12 am

An El Clasico final would be nice.

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Post by Neutral Mon Apr 23, 2012 9:21 am

The Verminator wrote:I think some people like VDS still don't understand that Barce do play defensive at times with the ball in possession. And honestly that's more boring than Catenaccio. I hate tbh. That's not football

everyone has their preferences but really? catenaccio over tiki taka? not many people would agree. tiki taka and possession football is much harder to master. i'd much rather see a team play with the ball then off it.

anyway to any of those who say barca are getting boring. almost every game is barca is the opposition's half, knocking it about and trying to break through. that's not fair to barca to call them boring. is it barca the ones being boring or their opposition who will almost always bus it these days. the last teams to try and take barca on at their own game were united and arsenal and those were probably the most entertaining games last cl campaign. arsenal even managed to beat them.

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Post by Lex Mon Apr 23, 2012 9:24 am

fatman123 wrote:so do all these people knocking us hate Guus Hiddinks PSV side that one the CL? and do they hate the Greece side that won the Euros? and do they hate APOELs performances in europe?
Uh yeah? Everyone's still arse sore about Greece winning the Euros, branding it "the worst Euros ever"

Jog it out, haterz :dance:
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Post by Doc Mon Apr 23, 2012 10:05 am

After seeing his "tenure" at Valencia, Koeman's opinion on tactics is null and void...
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Post by alexjanosik Mon Apr 23, 2012 10:17 am

VDS is telling the truth.And so is Koeman.

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Post by The Verminator Mon Apr 23, 2012 6:07 pm

Neutral wrote:
The Verminator wrote:I think some people like VDS still don't understand that Barce do play defensive at times with the ball in possession. And honestly that's more boring than Catenaccio. I hate tbh. That's not football

everyone has their preferences but really? catenaccio over tiki taka? not many people would agree. tiki taka and possession football is much harder to master. i'd much rather see a team play with the ball then off it.

anyway to any of those who say barca are getting boring. almost every game is barca is the opposition's half, knocking it about and trying to break through. that's not fair to barca to call them boring. is it barca the ones being boring or their opposition who will almost always bus it these days. the last teams to try and take barca on at their own game were united and arsenal and those were probably the most entertaining games last cl campaign. arsenal even managed to beat them.
Not saying Barce IS boring, rather they have the potential to be an extrememely boring side when they want to. And yes i would prefer catenaccio over that but the difference is though that Barce don't do it all game long. It's just when they do it that it annoys me. Like in this vid:



The guy who made the video was just trying to show how great Barce is at keeping possession. But to me, this is very boring. It's not that possession is boring, but ultra-possession like this is....
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Post by The Franchise Mon Apr 23, 2012 6:28 pm

If there are 10 players in the defensive half, where do you expect Barca do go?

This arguement is so stupid lol

When teams play more offensively, we are more direct...its been shown time and time again.

If oppnants put players behind the ball, we have to try and draw them out and create space higher up the pitch.

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Post by The Verminator Mon Apr 23, 2012 6:31 pm

We have faced plenty of teams that park the bus and have all players in their own half except their striker. Yea we pass in defence but not for minutes. That's just crazy. You're making it look as if Barce have no other option.
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Post by The Franchise Mon Apr 23, 2012 6:47 pm

The Verminator wrote:We have faced plenty of teams that park the bus and have all players in their own half except their striker. Yea we pass in defence but not for minutes. That's just crazy. You're making it look as if Barce have no other option.

Lets not compare Arsenal to Barca, with all due respect.

I have never seen teams defend will all the players in their own half for a full 90 minutes vs Arsenal. The only teams its remotely like that I recall (Chelsea a couplle years ago, Man Utd too) you lost and everyone complained how 1 dimensional Arsenal are and how lost they look.

We dont have any other options....I would love to hear you name them.

And we dont pass the ball in defence for minutes, thats horseshit. How can we pass the ball at the back for minutes and yet, its Xavi, Iniesta and Dani Alves who average by far, the most touches per game? You have to explain that to me.
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Post by Ali Tue Apr 24, 2012 12:57 am

The Franchise wrote:
The Verminator wrote:We have faced plenty of teams that park the bus and have all players in their own half except their striker. Yea we pass in defence but not for minutes. That's just crazy. You're making it look as if Barce have no other option.

Lets not compare Arsenal to Barca, with all due respect.

I have never seen teams defend will all the players in their own half for a full 90 minutes vs Arsenal. The only teams its remotely like that I recall (Chelsea a couplle years ago, Man Utd too) you lost and everyone complained how 1 dimensional Arsenal are and how lost they look.

We dont have any other options....I would love to hear you name them.

And we dont pass the ball in defence for minutes, thats horseshit. How can we pass the ball at the back for minutes and yet, its Xavi, Iniesta and Dani Alves who average by far, the most touches per game? You have to explain that to me.

Most of the Chelsea game had more than 9 players in their own half, MC earlier this season, etc
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Post by Blue Barrett Tue Apr 24, 2012 1:43 am

Ali"The Superman"8775 wrote:
The Franchise wrote:
The Verminator wrote:We have faced plenty of teams that park the bus and have all players in their own half except their striker. Yea we pass in defence but not for minutes. That's just crazy. You're making it look as if Barce have no other option.

Lets not compare Arsenal to Barca, with all due respect.

I have never seen teams defend will all the players in their own half for a full 90 minutes vs Arsenal. The only teams its remotely like that I recall (Chelsea a couplle years ago, Man Utd too) you lost and everyone complained how 1 dimensional Arsenal are and how lost they look.

We dont have any other options....I would love to hear you name them.

And we dont pass the ball in defence for minutes, thats horseshit. How can we pass the ball at the back for minutes and yet, its Xavi, Iniesta and Dani Alves who average by far, the most touches per game? You have to explain that to me.

Most of the Chelsea game had more than 9 players in their own half, MC earlier this season, etc
Not when AVB was manager(except the Valencia game). Oh and did you watch the FA Cup semi-final? Oki.
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Post by The Verminator Tue Apr 24, 2012 3:27 am

The Franchise wrote:
The Verminator wrote:We have faced plenty of teams that park the bus and have all players in their own half except their striker. Yea we pass in defence but not for minutes. That's just crazy. You're making it look as if Barce have no other option.

Lets not compare Arsenal to Barca, with all due respect.

I have never seen teams defend will all the players in their own half for a full 90 minutes vs Arsenal. The only teams its remotely like that I recall (Chelsea a couplle years ago, Man Utd too) you lost and everyone complained how 1 dimensional Arsenal are and how lost they look.

We dont have any other options....I would love to hear you name them.

And we dont pass the ball in defence for minutes, thats horseshit. How can we pass the ball at the back for minutes and yet, its Xavi, Iniesta and Dani Alves who average by far, the most touches per game? You have to explain that to me.
Not really minutes. I like to exaggerate alot tbh Wink. But i don't really need to explain it to you. I'm sure you've seen the video i posted earlier. That to me is alotta possession in your own half and you guys did all that in the same match. That's when it gets boring.

As for options? It's simple, play more direct instead of mindlessly passing in the back. And you were saying you guys play like this sometimes coz of every player being in their own half. In the vid i posted, in numerous occasions there were around 4 RM players in your half marking your players...

I don't wanna call the system crap. It gets you trophies and you guys do it in style, but sometimes it can get very boring...
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Post by kiranr Tue Apr 24, 2012 4:54 am


It is not mindless passing Verm. Do you think they enjoy doing that?

In the same video you posted, look at all the movement ahead in Madrid's half. Players are making runs cutting in or trying to beat the offside trap or they are coming back to receive the ball. A number of things happening and all that is not mindless.

Believe me, if there is space to be exploited, no one is going to pass or sideways.
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Post by The Verminator Tue Apr 24, 2012 6:00 am

Oh no they are not always useless i can guarantee it. Excuse my English, i speak fluently but i do have poor wording at times. :facepalm: I didn't mean that they pass it around for fun, rather that it always seems pointless. I understand what Dani says. Draw the opposition into your own half, exploit the space left behind them, reap the rewards. But it's a game of patience of course. And that's fine. But when you watch it on t.v it looks as if they're doing absolutely nothing with the ball, and yes i understand that there is plenty of movement off the ball. But it just looks soooo pointless at times. I dunno i guess i had a thing against it after i watched Spain vs Chile. It was disgusting. Spain went up a goal, and for i think the last 20 or more minutes, they held the possession the whole time, they didn't care about even making an attempt to get the ball into the back of the net again, all they wanted to do was keep hold of the ball for 20mins. I couldn't believe what i was seeing...
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Post by kiranr Tue Apr 24, 2012 6:53 am

The Verminator wrote: I dunno i guess i had a thing against it after i watched Spain vs Chile. It was disgusting. Spain went up a goal, and for i think the last 20 or more minutes, they held the possession the whole time, they didn't care about even making an attempt to get the ball into the back of the net again, all they wanted to do was keep hold of the ball for 20mins. I couldn't believe what i was seeing...

hmm.. i understand what you are saying. In that sense, yeah, it can be frustrating to watch.
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Post by The Verminator Tue Apr 24, 2012 7:12 am

I mean for you guys it's fine. You guys want your team to win and if you guys do whatever it takes to win without cheating that's cool. But for a neutral it can get boring....Although that doesn't really hold you guys down as you've more than made up for it with the great play you's do week in week out...
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Post by The Franchise Tue Apr 24, 2012 8:01 am

The Verminator wrote:Not really minutes. I like to exaggerate alot tbh Wink. But i don't really need to explain it to you. I'm sure you've seen the video i posted earlier. That to me is alotta possession in your own half and you guys did all that in the same match. That's when it gets boring.

As for options? It's simple, play more direct instead of mindlessly passing in the back. And you were saying you guys play like this sometimes coz of every player being in their own half. In the vid i posted, in numerous occasions there were around 4 RM players in your half marking your players...

I don't wanna call the system crap. It gets you trophies and you guys do it in style, but sometimes it can get very boring...

PLay it direct to who and where? lol Yeah, lets send a long ball to 1.70 Alexis vs 2 centerbacks...very smart.

You cant take isolated moments where Madrid apply pressure and then say, look, your not coming out of your half

Explain to me how, if its at the back, Xavi, Iniesta and Alves get the most passes per game? You really need to explain this to justify your opinion here.
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Post by The Franchise Tue Apr 24, 2012 8:04 am

I also dont get how you compare Chile and Spain, to the entire style of Barca.

First of all, Chile were wearing Spain out for much of that game and were causing them major problem.

If they winning, with timeĀ“running out, they keep the ball...the defended their lead for 20 mins. Hardly a big deal.


And not to mention, we are not Spain.
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Post by The Verminator Tue Apr 24, 2012 8:40 am

The Franchise wrote:
The Verminator wrote:Not really minutes. I like to exaggerate alot tbh Wink. But i don't really need to explain it to you. I'm sure you've seen the video i posted earlier. That to me is alotta possession in your own half and you guys did all that in the same match. That's when it gets boring.

As for options? It's simple, play more direct instead of mindlessly passing in the back. And you were saying you guys play like this sometimes coz of every player being in their own half. In the vid i posted, in numerous occasions there were around 4 RM players in your half marking your players...

I don't wanna call the system crap. It gets you trophies and you guys do it in style, but sometimes it can get very boring...

PLay it direct to who and where? lol Yeah, lets send a long ball to 1.70 Alexis vs 2 centerbacks...very smart.

You cant take isolated moments where Madrid apply pressure and then say, look, your not coming out of your half

Explain to me how, if its at the back, Xavi, Iniesta and Alves get the most passes per game? You really need to explain this to justify your opinion here.
Direct doesn't mean you have to hoof it up to the lone striker you know that bruv. You can simply play more forward balls. It's simple really.

I can take those isolated incidents, because that's what i've been talking about this whole time. Because as you may recall i didn't say that Barce's style is boring, rather i said that incidents like these just completely bore me.

I don't watch Barce on a regular basis. And i don't analyse them when i watch them. But i'll give it a shot. I'm assuming Xavi gets alotta passes because he drops deep to collects the passes and make himself available to the ball possessor, so that he can control the the game with the ball at his feet. Alves i believe is a sort of outlet. When things get a little congested, he is free on the wings. So you can give the ball to him, stretch out the play. Dunno about Iniesta tbh.

And i wasn't saying that you guys only play it at the back if that's what you thought.....
The Franchise wrote:I also dont get how you compare Chile and Spain, to the entire style of Barca.

First of all, Chile were wearing Spain out for much of that game and were causing them major problem.

If they winning, with timeĀ“running out, they keep the ball...the defended their lead for 20 mins. Hardly a big deal.


And not to mention, we are not Spain.
Of course you're not Spain. But i'm sure Spain were trying to replicate Barce's system to a certain extent. They were playing really possessive especially in the last 20mins. I don't remember too much but i was shocked. To keep the ball for sooo long without any intention of going forward (or barely any), is just well for the lack of a better word, crap. Sure it's no big deal. It wasn't like they cheated. but it was incredibly boring. Honestly parking the bus is not even as bad....
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Post by Zoidberg Tue Apr 24, 2012 9:07 am

What's with the hate against counter attacking?

Barca pin you in your own end with pointless, redundant, passing. They hold a high line as well.

It makes sense for teams to get in their own end and then break quickly.
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Post by eelir Tue Apr 24, 2012 9:13 am

The Verminator wrote:Of course you're not Spain. But i'm sure Spain were trying to replicate Barce's system to a certain extent. They were playing really possessive especially in the last 20mins. I don't remember too much but i was shocked. To keep the ball for sooo long without any intention of going forward (or barely any), is just well for the lack of a better word, crap. Sure it's no big deal. It wasn't like they cheated. but it was incredibly boring. Honestly parking the bus is not even as bad....

Dude, cmon, parking the buss is not as bad??? Ok it is a matter of taste and i respect that. But, how do you think parking the buss is better? I mean, if a team is winning and wants to keep the ball circulating without taking dangerous actions it is more interesting than parking the buss. The blame is on the other team who is loosing and not pressing, not taking action to win the ball to score. I like to see it as Pakring the buss = passive defense, circulating the ball = active defense. I prefer my team be proactive, even when defending.
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Post by Zealous Tue Apr 24, 2012 9:15 am

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Post by eelir Tue Apr 24, 2012 9:16 am

Zoidberg wrote:What's with the hate against counter attacking?

Barca pin you in your own end with pointless, redundant, passing. They hold a high line as well.

It makes sense for teams to get in their own end and then break quickly.

I wouldn't call it pointless passing, it is more patient passing. And i do not think anyone is agains counterattacking play, some people just do not like park the buss strategy. I consider them different things. RM for instance played counter, but they did not park the complete buss, so to say.
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Post by Zealous Tue Apr 24, 2012 9:22 am

eelir wrote:
Zoidberg wrote:What's with the hate against counter attacking?

Barca pin you in your own end with pointless, redundant, passing. They hold a high line as well.

It makes sense for teams to get in their own end and then break quickly.

I wouldn't call it pointless passing, it is more patient passing. And i do not think anyone is agains counterattacking play, some people just do not like park the buss strategy. I consider them different things. RM for instance played counter, but they did not park the complete buss, so to say.

I agree with this. There is a difference between just defending and defending then attacking when you get the ball.

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