Why are the Premier League teams doing so badly in Europe

by Ruben Pardo Mon 03 Mar 2014, 06:09

All the T.V. money and odd oil teams like Man City and Chelsea yet they are still struggling

I wouldn't be surprised in 2 weeks time if only 2 English teams remain: Chelsea and Tottenham

Despite Chelsea winning the champions league in 2012 (worst/luckiest winners ever) i feel the premier league has been sinking for the past 3 seasons or so in Europe

I can see Valencia and Sevilla in the quarter finals of the Europa League and Real Madrid, Barca and Atletico in the quarter finals of the Champions League

by S Mon 03 Mar 2014, 06:29

IMO i would say the league is in sort of a transitional phase especially with managerial changes among top teams.

Man City have a good squad but they are not cut out for Europe yet.By getting more CL experience ,it would improve i suppose.

Arsenal dont have a squad yet to challenge top European teams so we can exclude them out of this discussion for now.

Most importantly England's premier team,Manchester United are infact in a transitional phase.They need a squad overhaul and possibly a better coach to return to the European elite again like they were some 3-4 yrs ago.

Out of all these teams,Chelsea are probably the only side who are more 'ready' to take on the Champions League elite but they have their own flaws too atm(a spearhead in attack is what they lack).

I think these arguments can be made in regards to the 4 English teams participating in the Champions League right now.

Regarding Europa league,i think they're doing fine IMO.Though i think they've suffered a bit in this competition because they've sent teams like Birmingham,Wigan,Swansea etc who qualified in Europe by winning the Capital One Cup,so i think its taken a bit of a dent on their EL performances.
But the others who qualified via their league position are doing alright though.

by ExtremistEnigma Mon 03 Mar 2014, 06:33

England is lacking its most successful team in Europe in CL. Don't worry, everything will be alright from next season. Wink

by Gil Mon 03 Mar 2014, 06:37

Terrible thread. An English team won a major European trophy the last 2 years.

Ban OP.

by S Mon 03 Mar 2014, 06:38

Gil wrote:Terrible thread. An English team won a major European trophy the last 2 years.

Ban OP.

Its not a terrible thread.Its definitely worth discussing.

by Gil Mon 03 Mar 2014, 06:41

S wrote:
Gil wrote:Terrible thread. An English team won a major European trophy the last 2 years.

Ban OP.

Its not a terrible thread.Its definitely worth discussing.

Obvious bait thread.

Out.

by Ruben Pardo Mon 03 Mar 2014, 06:49

Gil wrote:
S wrote:
Gil wrote:Terrible thread. An English team won a major European trophy the last 2 years.

Ban OP.

Its not a terrible thread.Its definitely worth discussing.

Obvious bait thread.

Out.

This isn't just about one team though is it? all things considered, the premier league has loads of TV money, in addition to oil money teams like Chelsea and City.

I'd rather my team not win the champions league at all, if it required my team to play like Chelsea did against Bayern in 2012...worst ever winners of the champions league with help from lady luck i must add

by BarcaLearning Mon 03 Mar 2014, 07:01

Man U is out first of all cos they are in decline rapidly Very Happy

So thats one team out.

Man C u can say were unlucky to draw Barca.

Arsenal is Arsenal never expect too much from them I think Razz

Swansea also unlucky to draw a top Napoli side.

So these things happen naturally and these discussions naturally come up also.

by Bellabong Mon 03 Mar 2014, 10:02

Arsenal needs to start winning the group stage, how many times now have they been drawn early against the future champion?

by Highburied Mon 03 Mar 2014, 10:15

I can only speak about Arsenal.

Wenger is not tactically consistent.

End/

by rwo power Mon 03 Mar 2014, 10:49

S wrote:Man City have a good squad but they are not cut out for Europe yet.By getting more CL experience ,it would improve i suppose.

This is their third consecutive CL year. With their expensive squad which contains quite some players with individual CL experience, how much more experience do they need?

by S Mon 03 Mar 2014, 11:13

rwo power wrote:
S wrote:Man City have a good squad but they are not cut out for Europe yet.By getting more CL experience ,it would improve i suppose.
This is their third consecutive CL year. With their expensive squad which contains quite some players with individual CL experience, how much more experience do they need?

I dint mean that City's players lack CL experience rather the club as a whole.They are not a traditional CL team and its only after the massive spending that they've been experiencing Champions League football.

And we all know it just doesnt come down to squad quality alone to perform in Europe.Team chemistry and good coaching is as important too.This season they've got a better coach than the previous one and the chemistry between City players have improved,there's noticeable difference atleast.

Wouldnt exactly say Man City flopped this year if they were to go out against Barca(which looks likely) but there's considerable improvement and i guess they can hope for better as the seasons go by.

by Art Morte Mon 03 Mar 2014, 11:21

All four PL teams are in the last-16, so it's not that bad, imo. Only one (Chelsea) seem likely to make it to the last-8, but then again two others faced Bayern Munich and Barcelona.

Having Wigan and Swansea in the Europa League was never going to be a great footballing success for the Premiership, but sweet that such teams were able to make it there anyway. Well, in fact, Wigan are a Championship team, so strictly sticking to the thread title, they shouldn't be mentioned.

Anyway, it will probably be a disappointing CL & EL season for the Premier League, but it's not exactly awful, either.

by Helmer Mon 03 Mar 2014, 12:08

rwo power wrote:
S wrote:Man City have a good squad but they are not cut out for Europe yet.By getting more CL experience ,it would improve i suppose.
This is their third consecutive CL year. With their expensive squad which contains quite some players with individual CL experience, how much more experience do they need?

same question
I think few players in their team have already experience the Europe but where as teams like Dortmund who had (imo) not a single player with a real CL experience before did good in the last season and doing just fine in this season too

by Great Leader Sprucenuce Mon 03 Mar 2014, 13:38

Swansea are a mid table team who won the cup and they faced Napoli who are far superior to them and lets be honest were very unlucky to be knocked out.

Man City faced Barca a team which has dominated the CL scene for a long time now and at the very least is a top 3 in the world team.

Arsenal faced Bayern who everyone accepts as the clear favorite for the trophy and yet Arsenal had them on the ropes before the red card.

Man Yoo is just the Moyes factor lol.

People like to over analyse things constantly but fact of the matter is that this time its simply down to one thing.... luck of the draw.

by Lex Mon 03 Mar 2014, 13:42

Arsenal played the BUli champions
City played the Liga champions
Manchester United hired David Moyes
Chelsea will most likely go through

/thread

by The_Badger Mon 03 Mar 2014, 15:24

Lex wrote:Arsenal played the BUli champions
City played the Liga champions
Manchester United hired David Moyes
Chelsea will most likely go through

/thread

That's pretty much how I see it too. Man City and Arsenal got unfortunate draws.

Also, two of the three teams in the EL are pretty poor, one of which currently plays in The Championship.

by M99 Mon 03 Mar 2014, 16:50

Lex wrote:Arsenal played the BUli champions
City played the Liga champions
Manchester United hired David Moyes
Chelsea will most likely go through

/thread

by Tomwin Lannister Mon 03 Mar 2014, 17:16

Like Mole said, it's all about the draw

People neglect to mention that unless you're the outright winner of the cup, the draw decides everything.

by S Mon 03 Mar 2014, 17:26

HEIL MEIN REDS wrote:
rwo power wrote:
S wrote:Man City have a good squad but they are not cut out for Europe yet.By getting more CL experience ,it would improve i suppose.
This is their third consecutive CL year. With their expensive squad which contains quite some players with individual CL experience, how much more experience do they need?
same question
I think few players in their team have already experience the Europe but where as teams like Dortmund who had (imo) not a single player with a real CL experience before did good in the last season and doing just fine in this season too

Clearly they're a product of great coaching backed by some good young players and smart buys in the transfer market.The coach has been with them for like what,5 years already ? When you're there for that long,its easier to implement his ideas and values and get the team to play very well.

I know people love to rave about Dortmund now but lets not forget they got dumped out of the groups in European competitions for two years in a row.So clearly they've faced lows too before they became really good.

by BORUSSIA!! Mon 03 Mar 2014, 17:29

unfortunate draws for man city and arsenal?

they got those draws cause they came second in their group.

of course the OP has a point. This is the 3rd year running EPL teams have performed poorly. No team in the last 8 last season and only 1 in the season before.

by Tomwin Lannister Mon 03 Mar 2014, 17:30

2nd in their group to last years CL finalist and last years CL Winners

Nobody's saying they deserved an easy draw, but the point is if you come up against the eventual winners in the R16 or the Semi final. It makes no odds. You just get knocked out earlier depending on the draw. Which in turn makes the leauge look worse.

by sportsczy Mon 03 Mar 2014, 17:31

Arsenal and City have both had tough groups the past 2 years. Chelsea got knocked in a tough group last year.

That said, if EPL teams cannot win tough groups with the better teams of other top leagues, it probably means that EPL teams are not as good. It's happened enough now that you can make a solid case for that.

by BeautifulGame Mon 03 Mar 2014, 17:43

City - Still inexperienced and struggling with tough draws due to lack of UEFA co-eff points. Still beat Bayern Away from home this season.So they are definitely improving since Pellegrini came .

Chelsea - Definitely look the strongest .But have gone transition since winning the CL years ago.Still will progress deep into the CL imo

Arsenal - Think the problem is Wenger. Dont think he is as good a manager for Europe as he is for League.Even at their peak(early 2000s) struggled in ENurope under Wenger

United - Moyesification

by Robespierre Mon 03 Mar 2014, 18:04

BeautifulGame wrote:City - Still inexperienced and struggling with tough draws due to lack of UEFA co-eff points. Still beat Bayern Away from home this season.So they are definitely improving since Pellegrini came .

Chelsea - Definitely look the strongest .But have gone transition since winning the CL years ago.Still will progress deep into the CL imo

Arsenal - Think the problem is Wenger. Dont think he is as good a manager for Europe as he is for League.Even at their peak(early 2000s) struggled in ENurope under Wenger

United - Moyesification

Agreed

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