Batista vs Menezes.

Adit wrote:menez atleast has his own fail ideas though, pep batista has pep's fail ideas lended lol

Immaculate_Mole wrote:

Adit wrote:menez atleast has his own fail ideas though, pep batista has pep's fail ideas lended lol

So we are giving Menez extra credit for failing all by himself?

Makes sense definitely.

sportsczy wrote:Batista is horrible. Mano is meh. Impressed by neither. They're being too drastic with their methods. There's no need with the talent and depth of these two countries.

rsinatra wrote:

St_Nick09_of_Goal wrote:getting the tactics wrong is a more punishable offense than getting the players wrong.

With a different set of players, Argentina would look much better, while Brazil doesnt have a clue of how they should go about attacking, it's a mess.

I think Batista at least has an idea of what the team should play like, and he is committed to it, while Menezes just after the 1st game was already changing the outlay.

Despite all of Mano's flaws, I think he does have a clear idea of what he is trying to do, the problem is that it isn't easy. In fact, he took the hardest road possible. He could be fielding a squad and using tactics similar to Dunga's, and in that he'd probably be getting better results, but he is trying to go for a team playing with the ball, passing, dominating possession and creating good chances. Playing like the bigger side - something Dunga didn't do.
It'll take a while for it to start functioning properly. But he has to try it, because if he didn't, then all of you would be here criticizing Brazil for winning with ugly football.

You can't compare him to Argentina's coach who changed nothing from the first game. Wasn't he the one who almost ruled Tevez out of the Copa América, only to give in to pressure and call him up in the end? No personality.

I'm going to say this now, and I hope you don't get me wrong: the Copa América is a practicing tournament for Brazil. It is simply not our primary objective. Our objective is to be ready for the 2014 WC, which we must win since it'll be in Brazil. Period. What is most important for us that we can at least get some good tests, real training, and hopefully some decent performances towards the end of the tournament. And even if we can't get them, it won't be the end of the world for Brazil, and it shouldn't be for Mano, because he simply hasn't had enough time to accomplish any realistic thing. I applaud him for taking Robinho out, somebody had to have the guts to do it, that guy is overrated and hasn't made a truly good performance for our country since the WC. I don't know if Jadson was our best option, but he is more experienced than Lucas, and despite not having a great game, he did score our first goal, so no one can argue there.

Mano is doing the right thing by investing in Ganso, Neymar, and Pato now. This is Ganso's and Neymar's first time with Brazil, and they need to learn to deal with the pressure now rather than later. I shouldn't even mention the fact that Neymar has just come from an exhaustive semester leading Santos to two titles (one of them the biggest in South America), or the fact that Ganso came back from injury a few days before departing for Argentina. But you just can't expect them to be like they are at Santos, because they don't know the seleção players as well as they know the Peixe players yet, particularly Ganso, who despite not being at his best, had a better performance last night and showed why he's so precious to us with some fine passing.

Mano needs to find the fourth man. Will it be Lucas? I don't know, but I'm not sure he's mature enough. He does bring in some personality, and if not now, then perhaps in a couple of years, Neymar-Ganso-Lucas-Pato could be a sight to behold. How about Hulk? That's one option he should really consider, and one I'd approve of. Would it work? It has to be tried after this Copa.

He cannot be expected to call up Kaká, Ronaldinho, Fabiano, etc, people who most likely won't be at the World Cup. Like I said, this is practicing for us, we need to get a good chemistry going, so we need to invest in the players that might be there.

He's making a risky move when investing in people like André Santos, who are irregular, and imo not good enough for the seleção. Marcelo should be there, but really he most likely wouldn't have helped our poor defending last night. At least Mano stood his ground, and by doing so he could be signing his own death certificate, or leading us to glory. A coach has to be firm.

Another thing I don't like is T. Silva sending those long balls to Pato. What is that? They keep trying it, but I think we should play with the ball on the ground. With patience, like Brasil should play. Those long balls work in 2 out of 5 attempts.

Anyway. everyone here's criticized Mano for calling up Jadson and Fred, so now we've all gotten a slap on our faces.

milanista99 wrote:

rsinatra wrote:

St_Nick09_of_Goal wrote:getting the tactics wrong is a more punishable offense than getting the players wrong.

With a different set of players, Argentina would look much better, while Brazil doesnt have a clue of how they should go about attacking, it's a mess.

I think Batista at least has an idea of what the team should play like, and he is committed to it, while Menezes just after the 1st game was already changing the outlay.

Despite all of Mano's flaws, I think he does have a clear idea of what he is trying to do, the problem is that it isn't easy. In fact, he took the hardest road possible. He could be fielding a squad and using tactics similar to Dunga's, and in that he'd probably be getting better results, but he is trying to go for a team playing with the ball, passing, dominating possession and creating good chances. Playing like the bigger side - something Dunga didn't do.
It'll take a while for it to start functioning properly. But he has to try it, because if he didn't, then all of you would be here criticizing Brazil for winning with ugly football.

You can't compare him to Argentina's coach who changed nothing from the first game. Wasn't he the one who almost ruled Tevez out of the Copa América, only to give in to pressure and call him up in the end? No personality.

I'm going to say this now, and I hope you don't get me wrong: the Copa América is a practicing tournament for Brazil. It is simply not our primary objective. Our objective is to be ready for the 2014 WC, which we must win since it'll be in Brazil. Period. What is most important for us that we can at least get some good tests, real training, and hopefully some decent performances towards the end of the tournament. And even if we can't get them, it won't be the end of the world for Brazil, and it shouldn't be for Mano, because he simply hasn't had enough time to accomplish any realistic thing. I applaud him for taking Robinho out, somebody had to have the guts to do it, that guy is overrated and hasn't made a truly good performance for our country since the WC. I don't know if Jadson was our best option, but he is more experienced than Lucas, and despite not having a great game, he did score our first goal, so no one can argue there.

Mano is doing the right thing by investing in Ganso, Neymar, and Pato now. This is Ganso's and Neymar's first time with Brazil, and they need to learn to deal with the pressure now rather than later. I shouldn't even mention the fact that Neymar has just come from an exhaustive semester leading Santos to two titles (one of them the biggest in South America), or the fact that Ganso came back from injury a few days before departing for Argentina. But you just can't expect them to be like they are at Santos, because they don't know the seleção players as well as they know the Peixe players yet, particularly Ganso, who despite not being at his best, had a better performance last night and showed why he's so precious to us with some fine passing.

Mano needs to find the fourth man. Will it be Lucas? I don't know, but I'm not sure he's mature enough. He does bring in some personality, and if not now, then perhaps in a couple of years, Neymar-Ganso-Lucas-Pato could be a sight to behold. How about Hulk? That's one option he should really consider, and one I'd approve of. Would it work? It has to be tried after this Copa.

He cannot be expected to call up Kaká, Ronaldinho, Fabiano, etc, people who most likely won't be at the World Cup. Like I said, this is practicing for us, we need to get a good chemistry going, so we need to invest in the players that might be there.

He's making a risky move when investing in people like André Santos, who are irregular, and imo not good enough for the seleção. Marcelo should be there, but really he most likely wouldn't have helped our poor defending last night. At least Mano stood his ground, and by doing so he could be signing his own death certificate, or leading us to glory. A coach has to be firm.

Another thing I don't like is T. Silva sending those long balls to Pato. What is that? They keep trying it, but I think we should play with the ball on the ground. With patience, like Brasil should play. Those long balls work in 2 out of 5 attempts.

Anyway. everyone here's criticized Mano for calling up Jadson and Fred, so now we've all gotten a slap on our faces.

Great post rsinatra , and about the fourth man I think I have an answer. The man who score 40 goals and led his team to a treble, HULK.

Sushi Master wrote:They're both very mediocre. Our "lesser" teams and coaches have made them look like utter shit, so it's really not an excuse 2 of the biggest sides in the world filled up the ass with star players can't perform.

Tactically and player choice wise both are clueless. Brazil's problems aren't just tactical, either. The emission of Hulk, Luiz Gustavo, Kaka and bringing in all these unknown players as starters is a strange one. I have no problem developing your local youth, but integrate them bit by bit, don't just throw them into the fray and expect them to develop.

I'm sorry, but Fred = Shit.

rsinatra wrote:There wasnt much Pato and Neymar could do? Come on, Neymar had a golden chance, and what did he do? He tried to dribble a defender and THEN shoot, which gave time for all of Paraguay's defenders to come and back the GK, so when the ball when past him, a defender took it. If he had just shot it right away, there was time to place it in nicely enough. Pato couldve done better too. But I am not trying to take any credit away from the keeper, he was good, but sometimes even a great goalkeeper cant help it when the striker is good enough.

Hulk is not a striker, he plays on the wing, so Mano had to choose, and he chose Robinho, Neymar, etc. Yes, Fred is mediocre, but he is a number 9. We don't have any world class #9.