Re: Has any team depended/been built round one player as much as Barcelona/Messi

by billy_gr Thu Sep 20, 2012 8:33 am

I take Zeal seriously... Haters gonna hate Twisted Evil

Plus, in the spirit of things, will Madrid fans be more scared if we will not field Messi in the next classico?

by guest7 Thu Sep 20, 2012 10:01 am

Long gone are the days we fear Messi

Nowaday we only fear his freekicks and penelties Twisted Evil

by jibers Thu Sep 20, 2012 10:06 am

Se7en wrote:Long gone are the days we fear Messi

Nowaday we only fear his freekicks and penelties

by pewpew Thu Sep 20, 2012 11:12 am

messi is the new ronaldo guys Im telling you. Does nothing all game but get all the tap ins + penalies. No more tracking back declined dribbling. Soon the hair gel will come aswell.

by Harmonica Thu Sep 20, 2012 11:28 am

by jibers Thu Sep 20, 2012 12:05 pm

jiopsi wrote:

#saveusJio

by billionmillion Thu Sep 20, 2012 12:07 pm

Maybe he is in decline. but what you expect, did any player perform in his level more than 4 season? Now him playing doesnt even make sense. he can easily retire
these things make you decline. Find me a player who improved his game after winning 3 ballon dor and 3 CL

by Harmonica Thu Sep 20, 2012 12:16 pm

He isn't in decline lol, he has been marked more heavily than ever before.In almost every game this season, before he gets the ball, he gets crowded by opposition. There is no space to do the patented dribbling.

But that leaves space for the wings, and players in there has to make it count. Like last game.

This is just evolution process in Messi's game, he has just added another dimension to it, the poacher. And it just speaks volumes of his transformation ability. He really can do anything.

by Zealous Thu Sep 20, 2012 12:32 pm

Arquitecto wrote:
Albiceleste wrote:
Zealous wrote:Messi reduced to being a flat track bully stat padder. Long gone are his days where he would be stepping up when it mattered.

History will not remember Leverkusen, Plezen and Spartak sadly.
you seem unhealthily obsessed with Ronaldo and Messi mate.

No need for that Albi. Most of his posts iare tongue in cheek anyway.

Anything I post regarding Cristiano/Messi is tounge in cheek lol

Everything else is usually fair game.

by Onyx Thu Sep 20, 2012 12:33 pm

jiopsi wrote:

by Forza Thu Sep 20, 2012 12:47 pm

"Has any team depended/been built round one player as much as Barcelona/Messi"

Double barrelled question. There are two distinct queries in the thread title:

1. Has any team been built around one player as much as Barcelona is built around Messi?

2. Has any team depended one player as much as Barcelona depends on Messi?

The answers:

1. Firstly, no team is ever built around one player. An attack may be built around one player, but never a whole team - you can't say that a team chooses it's centre-backs, goalkeeper or defensive tactics based on Messi's presence. So is their attack built around Messi? Yes. However, there have been many teams in the past and even currently that are built around one player. I don't know how you would go about comparing which team builds more around one player - if you were comparing Milan in the Ibra era, for example. Both Barca and Milan depended heavily on those players in attack. Perhaps time to move onto that second question...

2. Does Barca depend on Messi more than any other team has ever depended on any one player? No. They have several other brilliant players in their attack who are very talented individuals. More so than Milan had last season.

In a way, the title predicts its own answer. Barca is inherently dependent on Messi to a great extent because their team is built around him.

:coffee:

by Onyx Thu Sep 20, 2012 12:49 pm

I wouldn't say it's built around Messi. Messi is just one part of the building. The others being Xavi and Iniesta.

by jibers Thu Sep 20, 2012 12:54 pm

Yohan Modric wrote:I wouldn't say it's built around Messi. Messi is just one part of the building. The others being Xavi and Iniesta.

Iniesta is injured half the time and Xavi just controls the mf now, messi it eh judge, jury and executioner of Barceloa. All the balls go through him, he drops so deep into mf now i swear sometimes he is a regista. Taking more touches than ever before alll the final balls, all teh goals etc. Barcelona is Messi. Take him out and there isnt a big gap between barfca and oher teams, and maqdrid would be superior as well.

by The Messiah Thu Sep 20, 2012 1:22 pm

jibers wrote:
Yohan Modric wrote:I wouldn't say it's built around Messi. Messi is just one part of the building. The others being Xavi and Iniesta.

Iniesta is injured half the time and Xavi just controls the mf now, messi it eh judge, jury and executioner of Barceloa. All the balls go through him, he drops so deep into mf now i swear sometimes he is a regista. Taking more touches than ever before alll the final balls, all teh goals etc. Barcelona is Messi. Take him out and there isnt a big gap between barfca and oher teams, and maqdrid would be superior as well.

Lets take C.Ronaldo out of Madrid and lets see what happens, Bayern is probably the only top team in the world who do not rely on individual player

by gondov Thu Sep 20, 2012 1:40 pm

jibers wrote:
Yohan Modric wrote:I wouldn't say it's built around Messi. Messi is just one part of the building. The others being Xavi and Iniesta.

Iniesta is injured half the time and Xavi just controls the mf now, messi it eh judge, jury and executioner of Barceloa. All the balls go through him, he drops so deep into mf now i swear sometimes he is a regista. Taking more touches than ever before alll the final balls, all teh goals etc. Barcelona is Messi. Take him out and there isnt a big gap between barfca and oher teams, and maqdrid would be superior as well.

Gross exaggeration!!

You dont watch many barca games, do you.? I bet u just wait for the highlights and results news.

Just from yesterday's game alone, Messi in the 1st half was so tightly marked, most of the attack was through tello. Messi hardly had a sniff at the ball. Cesc, tello, alves, villa were all attacking , they all had chances to score, and werent clinical enough.

And all xavi does is control the mf :facepalm:

Watch his pass to cesc yesterday or the 2 recent classicos.

Alexis and tello (who dribbled his way into the area, btw-nothing to do with messi!!) werent obliged to assist messi, he simply moved into good scoring positions, instinctively and tapped the goals home

This thread is mainly aimed at discounting the efforts of many barca players such as tello, alves, xavi, busquets, pedro etc.

However anyone with 2 cents will know football is a team sport and despite the headlines, barcas goals are the result of good work from all their players, starting from the back!!

Messi is usually the scorer, but even before he gets the ball, the movement, technique, understanding is still far from anything I see any current top team do, be it dribbling their way out of defence, alves overlapping runs, xavi's 180 turns, busquets' dummy passes, iniesta's laundrup shuffles, tello's blistering pace, u name it!!!

A lot of effort goes into barca's goals than meets the eye!!

If messi is taken out of the picture (and replaced with cesc) , barca will simply become even more possession based, they will be very hard to beat and I doubt many wont still count them as a top 3 side!!!!

by Mamad Thu Sep 20, 2012 1:43 pm

They can play without Xavi or Iniesta. yes they miss a great player in one of the two but if they play without Messi they will lose half of their power.

And don't show me a game in Liga against Osusuna or some mid table team. In a hard match for Example against us imagine how the game will change if Messi doesn't play.

by gondov Thu Sep 20, 2012 1:46 pm

^ Take both ronaldo and messi out, then imagine how the game will change. You cant just take our star player out and live yours on.Thats a bad argument!

I can make this argument for many top sides.

Take rooney/ RVP and messi out.

Take carzola and messi out

Take ibra and messi out

Take pirlo and messi out

Take hazard/ Torres out and messi out

Take yaya and messi out

I can go on and on..............

Barca aren't that weak without messi u know - villa, iniesta (best player in EU Very Happy

), cesc, busquets, xavi (5th best player in EU, official Very Happy

) alves, pedro are still WC.

by billionmillion Thu Sep 20, 2012 1:58 pm

The Messiah wrote:
jibers wrote:
Yohan Modric wrote:I wouldn't say it's built around Messi. Messi is just one part of the building. The others being Xavi and Iniesta.

Iniesta is injured half the time and Xavi just controls the mf now, messi it eh judge, jury and executioner of Barceloa. All the balls go through him, he drops so deep into mf now i swear sometimes he is a regista. Taking more touches than ever before alll the final balls, all teh goals etc. Barcelona is Messi. Take him out and there isnt a big gap between barfca and oher teams, and maqdrid would be superior as well.

Lets take C.Ronaldo out of Madrid and lets see what happens, Bayern is probably the only top team in the world who do not rely on individual player

Are you telling me that in R.Madrid every attack goes through Ronaldo?

the thing is that messi involves in 80% barcelona goals. He scores, assists, creates or just participates in it. attack goes through him (this season is not good example). I think nobody in history involved in his teams goals as much as messi. you say everybody passes to him but they pass to him because he is the best option in attack

sometimes you can ignore ibrahimovic (if you need a player who will run with the ball after your pass), sometimes you can ignore others for their weak dribbling or passing in certain situations. But you can not ignore Messi ,because he has everything. so all players will pass to him no matter what situation is

by Zealous Thu Sep 20, 2012 1:59 pm

No they're not lol at least not all the ones you listed.

by gondov Thu Sep 20, 2012 2:50 pm

Barca have been consistently on top for so long now, its getting onto peoples' "cough" haters' "cough", nerves. tongue

by vivabarca38 Thu Sep 20, 2012 3:06 pm

If we have our full starting team for one bloody match we will be much less dependent on him.Which is:Valdes-Alves-Puyol-Pique-Abidal/Alba/Adriano-Xavi-Busquets-Iniesta-Pedro-Messi-Villa.

by VanDeezNuts Thu Sep 20, 2012 4:13 pm

The Messiah wrote:
jibers wrote:
Yohan Modric wrote:I wouldn't say it's built around Messi. Messi is just one part of the building. The others being Xavi and Iniesta.

Iniesta is injured half the time and Xavi just controls the mf now, messi it eh judge, jury and executioner of Barceloa. All the balls go through him, he drops so deep into mf now i swear sometimes he is a regista. Taking more touches than ever before alll the final balls, all teh goals etc. Barcelona is Messi. Take him out and there isnt a big gap between barfca and oher teams, and maqdrid would be superior as well.

Lets take C.Ronaldo out of Madrid and lets see what happens, Bayern is probably the only top team in the world who do not rely on individual player

first season at madrid ronaldo was injured for about 2-3 months, statistically we did better.

by harhar11 Thu Sep 20, 2012 5:32 pm

jiopsi wrote:

For last nights game, you should remove Messi and add Tello :bow:

And honestly, while Messi started his goalscoring this season where he left them last season, his performances so far has not been out of this world.. IMO our best players so far have been Pedro and Xavi..

by billy_gr Fri Sep 21, 2012 9:09 am

so bottom line Madrid fans are now not concerned about Messi.
Good... albino

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