Italian National Team Thread

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Post by zarola Thu Jun 06, 2013 9:07 pm

am I the only one who still hates montolivo?

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Post by Tomwin Lannister Thu Jun 06, 2013 9:09 pm

Tbh Amauri is better than most strikers Italy call up out of nowhere Laughing


Amauri - Luca Toni physical prescence >>>>>>
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Post by Milantildeath Thu Jun 06, 2013 9:40 pm

zarola wrote:am I the only one who still hates montolivo?

Think so mate. From the looks of it you're the only one who still likes Cassano as well.
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Post by Luca Thu Jun 06, 2013 10:33 pm

zarola wrote:am I the only one who still hates montolivo?

No Proud

Although, I wouldn't go so far to say that I hate him, he's certainly not a proper trequartista- but Italy doesn't exactly have one at the moment, I blame Prandelli for his love affair with this formation and with Montolivo.

To be fair, Montolivo is playing about as good as he could be at the moment, I just don't rate him too highly.

Not a fan of Chiellini as the LB
Really narrow formation from Prandelli, I hope the team can create a good amount of chances and prove me wrong though

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Post by Tomwin Lannister Thu Jun 06, 2013 10:42 pm

We have 3 top CB's and no TQ.

Solution? A back 4 and a TQ position to fill. Proud

Also, yeah Luca it's a narrow formation. Then take into account Chiellini isn't going to provide any real width being a CENTRE BACK and all.


Too narrow.
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Post by Kaladin Thu Jun 06, 2013 10:57 pm

With Chiellini's attacking threat and Abate's world class crosses, who needs width Proud
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Post by Luca Thu Jun 06, 2013 11:25 pm

El Shaarawy wrote:With Chiellini's attacking threat and Abate's world class crosses, who needs width Proud

Proud

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Post by Juveman17 Thu Jun 06, 2013 11:29 pm

AbraKebabra Alacalamb wrote:Tbh Amauri is better than most strikers Italy call up out of nowhere Laughing


Amauri - Luca Toni physical prescence >>>>>>

Would thrash England everyday Proud
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Post by Arquitecto Thu Jun 06, 2013 11:30 pm

Chiellini's attacking threat was never in doubt as its why he is placed as LB at times. His problem is that he doesn't have the needed balance and pace to run up and down the flank.

His skill is excellent as 2008 Confed Cup was merely an example. Its how he cemented his place in the back initially through his passing from the back, ability to dribble it out from that position and showing some outrageous volley attempts during the tourney. Definitely a ball playing CB.

Abate somehow is a better crosser for Azzuri than he is for Milan. Even without he has been nothing short of world class when playing for Italia.
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Post by Tomwin Lannister Thu Jun 06, 2013 11:33 pm

Abate is defensively brilliant. However, if he added crosses to his game he would be so much better off.


Chiellini actually has fantastic passing statistics, but he looks pretty rusty for as a LB and he himself isn't a fan of going back to LB.
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Post by Casciavit Fri Jun 07, 2013 1:02 am

Montolivo as a TQ for Italy..meh

I'm a big fan of him, but honestly I don't think he's that good as a TQ.

Italy are better off playing 3-5-2 than 4-3-1-2 imo.

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Post by zarola Fri Jun 07, 2013 7:02 am

I feel like if we played a 3-5-2 that would mean seeing Giaccherini...

I say if you're going to throw anyone at left back, throw ogbonna there.

Chiellini can play in the middle but I would not want to see him at LB again :S just makes no sense.

If we're going to resort to a formation like this then we should play De Sciglio, yes he's a kid blablabla, but he's still one of the best we got.

Cassano is still fantastic, to all of the haters. The statistics speak for themselves, despite all the troubles inter has been having too, he's still done well.

Montolivo has always done poorly as a trequartista and his long range attempts continually frustrate me.

Not saying Diamanti is amazing blablabla, but I think if we're going to trequartista it, it seems like he's the best we got for there :S Marchisio hasn't done well there either.
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Post by juventus101 Fri Jun 07, 2013 2:38 pm

We should play very simply like this:

--Buffon--
--Barzagli-- --Bonucci-- --Chiellini--
--Abate-- --De Rossi-- --Pirlo-- --Marchisio-- --De Sciglio--
--El Shaarawy-- --Balotelli--

Or at least a 4-3-3:

--Buffon--
--Abate-- --Barzagli-- --Bonucci-- --Chiellini--
--De Rossi-- --Pirlo-- --Marchisio--
--Giovinco-- --Balotelli-- --El Shaarawy--

But please anything but the 4-3-1-2.
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Post by dostoevsky Fri Jun 07, 2013 3:22 pm

I'm curious as to whether the criticism of Montolivo remains as being of him as a player as it used to be in the national set-up or his use under Prandelli. Prandelli's system has attempted to find a place for the best midfielders on the team rather than to select a midfield in which the qualities represented are well balanced. Montolivo's use as a trequartista is particularly unfair to his talents as it forces him into a position that he does not regularly play at club level, which is effectively a prerequisite for success at international level in which little time is given to find chemistry and consistency as a team.

This being said, when we have shown motivation and energy on the pitch, the 4-3-1-2 has provided in general control and defensive stability, however the team remains in need of a true trequartista if we are to persist with such a system, whilst it forces us into the uncomfortable position of choosing a central defensive partnership from three excellent central defenders. Whilst I am in agreement with Arq that Chiellini is an excellent fullback, he does lack the ability to go up and down his flank all day. He can be expected to provide quality in both defence and offence, however the regularity with which he can get involved is the issue.

Also I agree with zarola entirely about Cassano, however if he wants to come to the World Cup, I want to see a season of dedication from him in which he is running out a full 90 minutes regularly. At the Euros, he had the excuse of having recently returned from surgery, however we can't afford to be wasting a substitution every single game on resting him after the hour mark. I believe that if Cassano is fit, Prandelli should definitely take him. One of the best final passers in Europe, it would be madness to leave such talent behind.

On the note of our forward selection, we have no crisis up top in Italian football, merely in the squad selected. With Balotelli, Osvaldo and Destro up top we have incredible depth at centre forward, with El Shaarawy and Cassano available. It's a pity that elder statesmen such as Totti and Di Natale are too old to be called up, however this is the right decision for the future whilst Quagliarella is unfortunately overlooked. I expect Benitez to take a huge leap under Benitez and break into the side before the World Cup, however if this doesn't happen, Giuseppe Rossi will have a season at Fiorentina to play himself into form whilst there are a few other names who could potentially break out. Not all will, some will experience dips in form, others injuries, but we have the depth up top - due in part to the three centre forwards we can call on as the spine of our forward structure - to make an impact at the World Cup. It's not the flashiest line-up, however there is the quality required to complement a team that is built from the back.

Finally, Giaccherini isn't a team player, he's the team mascot. Prandelli assumed that no player of his height could possibly be a footballer and came to the conclusion that he was a magical leprechaun and Prandelli has been trying to seduce him with regular game time ever since this discovery in order to win the World Cup. His presence ahead of a midfielder such as Poli, Alberto 'What's a tackle?' Aquilani or even Florenzi for experience is ridiculous. The sort of depth Giaccherini provides for the forward line is the sort we can do without.

Also the next person to mention Amauri as a serious call-up is getting their warning level knocked down for trolling. Laughing
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Post by TonyDaBeast Fri Jun 07, 2013 4:18 pm

juventus101 wrote:We should play very simply like this:

--Buffon--
--Barzagli-- --Bonucci-- --Chiellini--
--Abate-- --De Rossi-- --Pirlo-- --Marchisio-- --De Sciglio--
--El Shaarawy-- --Balotelli--

Or at least a 4-3-3:

--Buffon--
--Abate-- --Barzagli-- --Bonucci-- --Chiellini--
--De Rossi-- --Pirlo-- --Marchisio--
--Giovinco-- --Balotelli-- --El Shaarawy--

But please anything but the 4-3-1-2.


good God that 3-5-2 is one powerhouse of a lineup :bow:

y is it that my favourite teams have coaches who are at times just stubborn lol. i mean just look at that lineup, its so crispy lol.
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Post by Tomwin Lannister Fri Jun 07, 2013 4:21 pm

Insisting on playing 2 CB's and a TQ when you have 3 CB's and no actual TQ in your starting line-up. Proud

Prandelli is a great coach.

However, he is too stubborn.

3-5-2 got Italy a draw with Spain and agonisingly close to a win, we then ditch it for no good reason.


3 of the top 4 teams in Italy play 3 at the back, most players in the team play in a back 3 for their club. Yet we revert to 4-3-1-2 time and time again ffs.
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Post by Kaladin Fri Jun 07, 2013 4:34 pm

Dat Spain match where DDR was a beast at the back Proud

And dat Di Natale finish Proud

Im all in for trying that 3-5-2 formation
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Post by zarola Fri Jun 07, 2013 5:40 pm

juventus101 wrote:We should play very simply like this:

--Buffon--
--Barzagli-- --Bonucci-- --Chiellini--
--Abate-- --De Rossi-- --Pirlo-- --Marchisio-- --De Sciglio--
--El Shaarawy-- --Balotelli--

Or at least a 4-3-3:

--Buffon--
--Abate-- --Barzagli-- --Bonucci-- --Chiellini--
--De Rossi-- --Pirlo-- --Marchisio--
--Giovinco-- --Balotelli-- --El Shaarawy--

But please anything but the 4-3-1-2.

Both of those lineups are actually perfect, maybe Giovinco is replaceable though Razz

I agree with everything dost said pretty much word for word, it was a nice read.
I really hope we can get Giuseppe Rossi back into great form. Oooomg a 4-3-3 with him balotelli and el shaarawy would just be craaazy, cassano there as a sub even, we can potentially be set or we can potentially be screwed.

I really think the 4-3-1-2 boils down to how it works from a defensive stand-point, and Prandelli's admiration for Montolivo. With three midfielders like that, he's forced to fit in montolivo one way or another, and we see him tossed up as a TQ. :\ As you notice, with the other formations we mentioned, we don't see a chance for montolivo there. Prandelli must also really like how Marchisio is doing for him to not drop him there.
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Post by vivabarca38 Fri Jun 07, 2013 7:46 pm

Italiaz playing Czech now.Finally the players have learned the national anthem.
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Post by Tomwin Lannister Fri Jun 07, 2013 7:54 pm

Buffon great save.

Juventus and Italy defend set peices so fkn horribly, gives me no confidence at all.


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Post by Tomwin Lannister Fri Jun 07, 2013 7:56 pm

Maybe i'm a bit drunk but Jiracek looks like Liam Neeson when I look at him sometimes Laughing
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Post by Kaladin Fri Jun 07, 2013 7:57 pm

Good to see Balo leaving the mohawk behind, looks much better now
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Post by Kaladin Fri Jun 07, 2013 7:57 pm

DAT ABATE CLEARANCE rofl
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Post by Kaladin Fri Jun 07, 2013 7:59 pm

Balo No
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Post by Tomwin Lannister Fri Jun 07, 2013 7:59 pm

Lmfao Abate this isn't Milan V Juve.


Yeah Balotelli has gained more respect from me with that.


Gigi Proud

3-5-2 would be so much better if we stuck with it (Not just gave it 30 minutes when we're 1-0 down then scrap it again)
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Post by Tomwin Lannister Fri Jun 07, 2013 8:04 pm

SES still in wing-back mode. DDR pointing him towards the left striker spot Laughing
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