Re: Argentina going home...

by harhar11 Sun Jul 17, 2011 2:59 am

Crimson wrote:
Doc wrote:Messi honestly had a good game today though...

Thats the thing though, he generally does have a good game, but never a "Messi-esque" game for Argentina. I have yet to see him play to the standard he plays for Barcelona with Argentina.

But theres a huge difference between going out on the pitch and having a "good game" in comparison to going out there and showing the world why you are the best in the world and why you do get compared to Maradona. A HUGE difference.

Ronaldo gets the same criticism for not scoring as much for Portugal and he plays as a winger there and in a much more defensive minded team without half the attacking talent Argentina has. Yet its ok to criticize him but not Messi who is supposedly so much better than him? And of course in a team that has alot better attacking talent and plays in an attack minded way?

oh you were serious Razz

It's seems that the majority of the poeple on this forum, thinks that cr7 plays as a god for portugal.. Atleast that's what they say when the messi - cristiano ronaldo comparison gets brought up...

by Guiltybystander Sun Jul 17, 2011 3:00 am

Milito also deserved red, before I forget.

Also, that Arevalo guy, he was a beast! And so was Lugano.

Suarez turned the match around in his own way, but he did. And he was good too, aside from the first half.

by Ganso Sun Jul 17, 2011 3:01 am

shinigami99 wrote:yea, this forum never surprises me lol.

Again I will say it. Messi didn't play badly. Uruguay is NOT an easy team to beat, they have a 10000000000000000000x better defense than we rhave.

Football is a TEAM game. It is NOT an individual game as it was during maradona or Pele's time. Defenders are a lot better trained and are much stronger these days. Sure a star player can make a big difference but in a non-coherant team, even the best will be bad.

Time for a new coach.

a commentary guy said something like this a couple of days ago:

"Ive seen Zico,Pele,Maradona,Laudrup,Zidaane,R9 and they were amazing,because they played amazing when their teammates played great and they won games by themselves when their teammates were nowhere to be found.Quite frankly,I do not think Messi should be compared to the greats like people often do,because hes not.Or at least for now."

by harhar11 Sun Jul 17, 2011 3:01 am

Andres Iniesta wrote:And like my uncle always told me. Messi can't do much against South American defenses. They're just so well coordinated

Then he is wrong Rolling Eyes

by Great Leader Sprucenuce Sun Jul 17, 2011 3:02 am

izzy26 wrote:
shinigami99 wrote:yea, this forum never surprises me lol.

Again I will say it. Messi didn't play badly. Uruguay is NOT an easy team to beat, they have a 10000000000000000000x better defense than we rhave.

Football is a TEAM game. It is NOT an individual game as it was during maradona or Pele's time. Defenders are a lot better trained and are much stronger these days. Sure a star player can make a big difference but in a non-coherant team, even the best will be bad.

Time for a new coach.

Hmmmmm.... Elaborate please.

I think he meant to say that its a lot harder now to do it all by yourself than it was then.....

Beside's its irrelevent, no excuses Messi needs Xaviesta to perform above an average level how can anyone not see this? scratch

by Guiltybystander Sun Jul 17, 2011 3:02 am

Ganso wrote:
shinigami99 wrote:yea, this forum never surprises me lol.

Again I will say it. Messi didn't play badly. Uruguay is NOT an easy team to beat, they have a 10000000000000000000x better defense than we rhave.

Football is a TEAM game. It is NOT an individual game as it was during maradona or Pele's time. Defenders are a lot better trained and are much stronger these days. Sure a star player can make a big difference but in a non-coherant team, even the best will be bad.

Time for a new coach.
a commentary guy said something like this a couple of days ago:

"Ive seen Zico,Pele,Maradona,Laudrup,Zidaane,R9 and they were amazing,because they played amazing when their teammates played great and they won games by themselves when their teammates were nowhere to be found.Quite frankly,I do not think Messi should be compared to the greats like people often do,because hes not.Or at least for now."

That is very true, again it shows that Messi can't turn the tide in his team on his own, when it goes badly.
Suarez and Forlan can, as they have proven again and again.

by izzy Sun Jul 17, 2011 3:03 am

Ganso wrote:a commentary guy said something like this a couple of days ago:

"Ive seen Zico,Pele,Maradona,Laudrup,Zidaane,R9 and they were amazing,because they played amazing when their teammates played great and they won games by themselves when their teammates were nowhere to be found.Quite frankly,I do not think Messi should be compared to the greats like people often do,because hes not.Or at least for now."

Oooooooooh, now that's gotta hurt.

Brace yourself.

by Yeezus Sun Jul 17, 2011 3:03 am

Messi can't perfrom very well against them. They grind his legs till he can't move.

South American defenses are 100% disciplined.

by Mr Nick09 Sun Jul 17, 2011 3:03 am

he needs pep Cool

by Guiltybystander Sun Jul 17, 2011 3:03 am

Andres Iniesta wrote:Messi can't perfrom very well against them. They grind his legs till he can't move.

South American defenses are 100% disciplined.

...Except for Argentina's.

by harhar11 Sun Jul 17, 2011 3:04 am

Ganso wrote:
shinigami99 wrote:yea, this forum never surprises me lol.

Again I will say it. Messi didn't play badly. Uruguay is NOT an easy team to beat, they have a 10000000000000000000x better defense than we rhave.

Football is a TEAM game. It is NOT an individual game as it was during maradona or Pele's time. Defenders are a lot better trained and are much stronger these days. Sure a star player can make a big difference but in a non-coherant team, even the best will be bad.

Time for a new coach.
a commentary guy said something like this a couple of days ago:

"Ive seen Zico,Pele,Maradona,Laudrup,Zidaane,R9 and they were amazing,because they played amazing when their teammates played great and they won games by themselves when their teammates were nowhere to be found.Quite frankly,I do not think Messi should be compared to the greats like people often do,because hes not.Or at least for now."

Messi has won games by himself when his teammates are nowhere to be found lots of times. You can't always do that, remember even zidane was shit against barca when we raped you 3-0 at the bernabeu

by Seppuku Sun Jul 17, 2011 3:04 am

The defenders of the yesterdays tried to break your legs ffs.

So yeah, that pretty much nullifies that argument.

by Doc Sun Jul 17, 2011 3:04 am

harhar11 wrote:
Crimson wrote:
Doc wrote:Messi honestly had a good game today though...

Thats the thing though, he generally does have a good game, but never a "Messi-esque" game for Argentina. I have yet to see him play to the standard he plays for Barcelona with Argentina.

But theres a huge difference between going out on the pitch and having a "good game" in comparison to going out there and showing the world why you are the best in the world and why you do get compared to Maradona. A HUGE difference.

Ronaldo gets the same criticism for not scoring as much for Portugal and he plays as a winger there and in a much more defensive minded team without half the attacking talent Argentina has. Yet its ok to criticize him but not Messi who is supposedly so much better than him? And of course in a team that has alot better attacking talent and plays in an attack minded way?

oh you were serious

It's seems that the majority of the poeple on this forum, thinks that cr7 plays as a god for portugal.. Atleast that's what they say when the messi - cristiano ronaldo comparison gets brought up...

Most of the time, it's a tit for tat scenario going on here but Cristiano gets criticised a lot for not producing his club form for Portugal. Always remember, they are other forums and media outlets that posters here probably read as well...

by Guest Sun Jul 17, 2011 3:04 am

St_Nick09_of_Goal wrote:he needs pep

but according to geniuses in this forum Pep is only a statue and my neighbour can do as good of a job managing Barca players :coffee:

by Great Leader Sprucenuce Sun Jul 17, 2011 3:05 am

St_Nick09_of_Goal wrote:he needs pep

Argentina going home... - Page 8 Images?q=tbn:ANd9GcS2w5WW5nIN5Hejr168hXL_5riryw-G5a1AwQixyBCTz0wRpzzj&t=1

by Ali Sun Jul 17, 2011 3:05 am

Ganso wrote:
shinigami99 wrote:yea, this forum never surprises me lol.

Again I will say it. Messi didn't play badly. Uruguay is NOT an easy team to beat, they have a 10000000000000000000x better defense than we rhave.

Football is a TEAM game. It is NOT an individual game as it was during maradona or Pele's time. Defenders are a lot better trained and are much stronger these days. Sure a star player can make a big difference but in a non-coherant team, even the best will be bad.

Time for a new coach.
a commentary guy said something like this a couple of days ago:

"Ive seen Zico,Pele,Maradona,Laudrup,Zidaane,R9 and they were amazing,because they played amazing when their teammates played great and they won by themselves when their teammates were nowhere to be found.Quite frankly,I do not think Messi should be compared to the greats like people often do,because hes not.Or at least for now."

Argentina going home... - Page 8 Shitstorm

by harhar11 Sun Jul 17, 2011 3:05 am

Andres Iniesta wrote:Messi can't perfrom very well against them. They grind his legs till he can't move.

South American defenses are 100% disciplined.

Really? Apart from a few fail run, when he tried to take on to many players, messi seemed to have no problem on getting past players..

by izzy Sun Jul 17, 2011 3:06 am

harhar11 wrote:Messi has won games by himself when his teammates are nowhere to be found lots of times. You can't always do that, remember even zidane was shit against barca when we raped you 3-0 at the bernabeu

I think he was focusing on internationals instead of club games.

by harhar11 Sun Jul 17, 2011 3:07 am

Doc wrote:
harhar11 wrote:
Crimson wrote:
Doc wrote:Messi honestly had a good game today though...

Thats the thing though, he generally does have a good game, but never a "Messi-esque" game for Argentina. I have yet to see him play to the standard he plays for Barcelona with Argentina.

But theres a huge difference between going out on the pitch and having a "good game" in comparison to going out there and showing the world why you are the best in the world and why you do get compared to Maradona. A HUGE difference.

Ronaldo gets the same criticism for not scoring as much for Portugal and he plays as a winger there and in a much more defensive minded team without half the attacking talent Argentina has. Yet its ok to criticize him but not Messi who is supposedly so much better than him? And of course in a team that has alot better attacking talent and plays in an attack minded way?

oh you were serious

It's seems that the majority of the poeple on this forum, thinks that cr7 plays as a god for portugal.. Atleast that's what they say when the messi - cristiano ronaldo comparison gets brought up...

Most of the time, it's a tit for tat scenario going on here but Cristiano gets criticised a lot for not producing his club form for Portugal. Always remember, they are other forums and media outlets that posters here probably read as well...

I atleast haven't noticed it, and he plays way worse for portugal than messi does for argentina..

by Guiltybystander Sun Jul 17, 2011 3:07 am

Seppuku wrote:The defenders of the yesterdays tried to break your legs ffs.

So yeah, that pretty much nullifies that argument.

This is a very good point. Stoke City would be the sissies of the sixties, defenders in the past didn't even need to have technique, as long as they were a meatmince-machine and could pass the ball back in the hands of the keeper (when that was still allowed). They had to jump for their lives, why do you think the Schwalbe got invented?

by harhar11 Sun Jul 17, 2011 3:08 am

izzy26 wrote:
harhar11 wrote:Messi has won games by himself when his teammates are nowhere to be found lots of times. You can't always do that, remember even zidane was shit against barca when we raped you 3-0 at the bernabeu

I think he was focusing on internationals instead of club games.

Yeah, zidane didn't win the game on his own against italy nor did zico against italy. And both of their teammates played 1000000000000x times better in those games than messi's teammate did today...

by Ganso Sun Jul 17, 2011 3:09 am

messi won games by himself?since when does his barca teammates not play well?

by shinigami99 Sun Jul 17, 2011 3:09 am

Okay, I can accept that "for now"
Right now, he is a wonder for club
but for country he is meh.
He doesn't have attitude YET to lead a team to glory.
He doesn't have the maturity YET to carry his team on his shoulders.
He doesn't have the skills and ability YET to take on South American defenses.
The "yet" is very important because you guys are comparing players who have completed over 10-15 years in their national senior team to a guy who has had probably 3-4 years of consistent starting

by Ganso Sun Jul 17, 2011 3:10 am

messi played 2 world cups and won 2 cls.hes not mature yet?please....

by Albiceleste Sun Jul 17, 2011 3:11 am

Andres Iniesta wrote:Messi can't perfrom very well against them. They grind his legs till he can't move.

South American defenses are 100% disciplined.

Messi danced through Uruguays defense more times than I can count tonight, the team overall couldn't break them enough, though

by Albiceleste Sun Jul 17, 2011 3:11 am

Ganso wrote:messi played 2 world cups and won 3 cls.hes not mature yet?please....

fixed that for you

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