Most controversial World Cup Golden Ball's since 1966

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Post by Harmonica Sat Jul 21, 2018 2:08 pm

For a Golden Ball performance Modric WC18 isn't good, for me it's the third worst performance. It's pretty equal to Charlton 66, maybe slightly better. Both were involved the same amount of team goals 45% vs 43%, both advanced the play same by dribbling 15 players, and although Modric created more chances, Charlton tackled more and were better round by round in four games to three.

This again gives additional perspective how good Messi WC14 performance really was, and how football journalist work for creating exaggerated headlines (mostly fake) to drive traffic to their sites, and how this then usually gets instilled on football fans memory. Messi scored twice the goals, was involved almost all the team goals 88% to 43%, created twice the great chances, was round by round better in 6 games, advanced the game by dribbling three times more and even had the same amount of tackles. Croatia even conceded two goals directly because Modric failed tackle on his man. Whole deluded football world shat on Messi WC14, and didn't bat an eye for Modric's WC18 Golden Ball, and that alone shows why football today is mostly fake on media level.

World Cup performance index, considering statistics, the best (and worst) plays, importance and relation of quality of opposition and own team. Color highlighted as golden, silver, bronze ball, or not in Top 3.

1.
Maradona 86
Messi 14

3.
Kempes 78
4.
Jairzinho 70

5.
Robben 14
Cruyff 74
7.
Forlan 10
8.
Romario 94
9.
Eusebio 66
Pele 70
Rossi 82

12.
G.Müller 70
Schillaci 90
Suker 98
15.
Ronaldo 02
Charlton 66
Modric 18
18.
Ronaldo 98
19.
Zidane 06

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Post by futbol Sat Jul 21, 2018 10:57 pm

Pretty much agree. Don't know where the Modric hype suddenly came from. Modric was more or less on par with Rakitic, shat the bed in both penalty shootouts and only had a great game against Argentina in the group stages. Ridiculous hype.

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Post by Harmonica Tue Jan 24, 2023 4:39 pm

Round 1 Messi vs. Saudi Arabia

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It wasn't that good of a performance. Scored Argentina's only goal from penalty, and created three great chances, but also missed three other great chances himself. Although one could argue that it was because of bad luck, that another goal and assist were called slight off-sides.

It's straight up better performance than Suker 98 vs. Jamaica, whos goal was better quality and who also created three great chances, but also missed even more and was only part of 1/3 team goals. I will put it in the next best group for now, as it's not good as Modric 18 vs. Nigeria.

World Cup Performance Index, considering statistics, the best (and worst) plays, importance and relation of quality of opposition and own team.

1.
Messi 14 vs Bosnia and Herzegovina
2.
Romario 94 vs Russia
3.
Maradona 86 vs South Korea
4.
Modric 18 vs Nigeria
5.
G.Müller 70 vs Morocco
Messi 22 vs Saudi Arabia
Jairzinho 70 vs Czechoslovakia
Robben 14 vs Spain
Ronaldo 02 vs Turkey
Schillaci 90 vs Austria
11.
Cruyff 74 vs Uruguay
Eusebio 66 vs Hungary
Kempes 78 vs Hungary
Pele 70 vs Czechoslovakia
Suker 98 vs Jamaica
16.
Charlton 66 vs Uruguay
Bebeto 94 vs Russia
Rossi 82 vs Poland
Zidane 06 vs Switzerland
20.
Forlan 10 vs France
21.
Ronaldo 98 vs Scotland

It's pretty long ago when I did this comparison, so I may not remember everything, although I've extensive data and media. If I miss something I may have to revisit the rating afterwards.
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Post by Harmonica Tue Jan 24, 2023 4:40 pm

Round 2 Messi vs. Mexico

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It's an important performance, being part of both Argentina's goals. Liberated Argentina by scoring an individual goal starting the move from midfield and finishing from outside the box, seven defenders in between. Assist was very simple pass to an another individual goal, but Messi deserves more credit from there as he said where Enzo should position himself before the goal.

Interestingly it's pretty much identical performance to Messi 14 vs. Iran, with almost the same goal, and creating one great chance.

World Cup Performance Index, considering statistics, the best (and worst) plays, importance and relation of quality of opposition and own team.

1.
Charlton 66 vs Mexico
Forlan 10 vs South Africa
Messi 14 vs Iran
Messi 22 vs Mexico
5.
Jairzinho 70 vs England
6.
Kempes 78 vs France
Modric 18 vs Argentina
Ronaldo 98 vs Morocco
9.
G.Müller vs Bulgaria
10.
Bebeto vs Cameroon
Romario 94 vs Cameroon
12.
Maradona 86 vs Italy
13.
Cruyff 74 vs Sweden
Robben 14 vs Australia
Ronaldo 02 vs China
16.
Pele 70 vs England
17.
Suker 98 vs Japan
18.
Eusebio 66 vs Bulgaria
Zidane 06 vs South Korea
20.
Rossi 82 vs Peru
21.
Schillaci 90 vs USA
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Post by Harmonica Tue Jan 24, 2023 4:40 pm

Round 3 Messi vs. Poland

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It's a match of two sides, on the other hand had 3 big misses when Argentina scored two goals without his involvement. But on the other hand also created 6 great chances too.

Compared to Modric 18 neither were involved in either team goals. Modric 18 didn't miss nor create any great chances, compared Messi missing probably the same quality as creating, I rank Messi's performance better being active rather than passive performance.

World Cup Performance Index, considering statistics, the best (and worst) plays, importance and relation of quality of opposition and own team.

1.
Messi 14 vs Nigeria
2.
Cruyff 74 vs Bulgaria
Jairzinho 70 vs Romania
Pele 70 vs Romania
Robben 14 vs Chile
6.
Eusebio 66 vs Brazil
G.Müller 70 vs Peru
8.
Romario 94 vs Sweden
Schillaci 90 vs Czechoslovakia
10.
Maradona 86 vs Bulgaria
11.
Forlan 10 vs Mexico
Rossi 82 vs Cameroon
13.
Charlton 66 vs France
14.
Kempes 78 vs Italy
Messi 22 vs Poland
Ronaldo 02 vs Costa Rica
Ronaldo 98 vs Norway
Suker 98 vs Argentina
19.
Modric 18 vs Iceland
20.
Zidane 06 (double yellow)
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Post by El Gunner Tue Jan 24, 2023 5:13 pm

i don't understand this thread... what are these rankings based upon?
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Post by Harmonica Tue Jan 24, 2023 6:08 pm

El Gunner wrote:i don't understand this thread... what are these rankings based upon?
It says it on the tin.

"World Cup Performance Index, considering statistics, the best (and worst) plays, importance and relation of quality of opposition and own team."

You can find all the above in this thread, stats and every important (goals, big misses and great chances created) action of all the players.
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Post by Harmonica Tue Jan 24, 2023 6:35 pm

Round 4 Messi vs. Australia

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Scored individual goal first forcing dispossession from midfield, and then starting the move that led to a good finnish. Wasn't part of the second Argentina goal, but created 4 additional great chances, and one of which eventually also led to a big miss.

It's not quite enough for the top places in this round, it's not quite Robben 14 who created additional chance and was part of both Netherlands goals. I think it's probably equal of Cruyff 74 vs Argentina, who was part of 3/4 goals, but also didn't create as much, and missed an additional big chance.

World Cup Performance Index
, considering statistics, the best (and worst) plays, importance and relation of quality of opposition and own team.

1.
Eusebio vs North Korea
2.
Messi 14 vs Switzerland
Kempes 78 vs Poland
4.
Robben 14 vs Mexico
5.
Cruyff 74 vs Argentina
Messi 22 vs Australia
7.
Forlan 10 vs South Korea
Jairzinho 70 vs Peru
Maradona 86 vs Uruguay
Zidane 06 vs Spain
11.
Romario 94 vs USA
Suker 98 vs Romania
13.
Modric 18 vs Denmark
14.
G.Müller 70 vs England
Pele 70 vs Peru
Ronaldo 98 vs Chile
Ronaldo 02 vs Belgium
Rossi 82 vs Argentina
Schillaci 90 vs Uruguay
20.
Charlton 66 vs Argentina
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Post by Harmonica Tue Jan 24, 2023 8:30 pm

Round 5 Messi vs. Netherlands

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Involved in both goals, the first one being a picture perfect throughball, and scored the penalty that Acuna earned. Also scored the most important penalty in SO.

I'm giving this as good as Charlton 66 vs. Portugal. Both involved in both team goals, Charlton scoring with two rather simple finishes. Charlton created an additional big chance, but Messi scored in SO.

World Cup Performance Index, considering statistics, the best (and worst) plays, importance and relation of quality of opposition and own team.

1.
Maradona 86 vs England
Rossi 82 vs Brazil
3.
Forlan 10 vs Ghana
4.
Charlton 66 vs Portugal
Messi 22 vs Netherlands
6.
Zidane 06 vs Brazil
7.
Suker 98 vs Germany
8.
Messi 14 vs Belgium
Robben 14 vs Costa Rica
Ronaldo 98 vs Denmark
11.
Eusebio 66 vs England
Jairzinho 70 vs Uruguay
13.
G.Müller 70 vs Italy
Schillaci 90 vs Ireland
15.
Modric 18 vs Belgium
16.
Pele 70 vs Uruguay
Romario 94 vs Netherlands
18.
Kempes 78 vs Brazil
19.
Cruyff 74 vs East Germany
20.
Ronaldo 02 vs England
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Post by Harmonica Tue Jan 24, 2023 9:41 pm

Round 6 Messi vs. Croatia

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Was involved in all three Argentina goals. Scored the first from penalty that Alvarez earned, although that was from the free space that Gvardiol left there marking Messi out. Provided crucial touch that allowed 2on2 counter that eventually resulted a goal. And lastly created all time great World Cup goal from middle of the pitch providing tap-in for Alvarez. Also created two other great chances, the other resulting to his own big miss.

It's a great performance. Considering the overall quality of all the big actions, I don't think it's quite as good as Maradona 86 vs. Belgium, but edges Ronaldo 02 vs. Turkey with additional great chance and the quality of the assist.

World Cup Performance Index, considering statistics, the best (and worst) plays, importance and relation of quality of opposition and own team.

1.
Maradona 86 vs Belgium
2.
Messi 22 vs Croatia
3.
Ronaldo 02 vs Turkey
4.
Rossi 82 vs Poland
Schillaci 90 vs Argentina
6.
Cruyff 74 vs Brazil
Kempes 78 vs Peru
8.
Suker 98 vs France
9.
Jairzinho 70 vs Italy
Pele 70 vs Italy
11.
G.Müller 70 vs Uruguay
Romario 94 vs Sweden
13.
Forlan 10 vs Netherlands
Messi 14 vs Netherlands
Ronaldo 98 vs Netherlands
16.
Robben 14 vs Argentina
Zidane 06 vs Portugal
18.
Eusebio 66 vs Soviet Union
19.
Modric 18 vs England
20.
Charlton 66 vs West Germany
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Post by Harmonica Tue Jan 24, 2023 11:56 pm

Round 7 Messi vs. France

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Was involved in all the three goals and also scored in the SO. Created two additional great chances and had one big miss.

Messi's performance is pretty much bang on equal with Kempes 78 vs. Netherlands, as the best performance in the final round. Both involved in all three goals, and although Kempes had slightly more quality in them overall, Messi also provided better chances and scored the hardest penalty in the SO.

World Cup Performance Index, considering statistics, the best (and worst) plays, importance and relation of quality of opposition and own team.

1.
Kempes 78 vs Netherlands
Messi 22 vs France
3.
Cruyff 74 vs West Germany
Robben 14 vs Brazil
Schillaci 90 vs England
Suker 98 vs Netherlands
7.
Forlan 10 vs Germany
Ronaldo 02 vs Germany
9.
Modric 18 vs France
10.
Rossi 82 vs West Germany
11.
Maradona 86 vs West Germany
12.
Messi 14 vs Germany
13.
Ronaldo 98 vs France
14.
Romario 94 vs Italy
15.
Zidane 06 vs Italy
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Post by Myesyats Wed Jan 25, 2023 1:04 am

His penalties were so good this tournament. Shame about that one miss but it was when it mattered the least

Also thank god for Julian Alvarez
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Post by El Gunner Wed Jan 25, 2023 7:28 am

as i said i really don't understand what is going on here...

Zidane '98 is the best WC finals performance of all-time imo
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Post by Harmonica Wed Jan 25, 2023 10:26 am

Myesyats wrote:His penalties were so good this tournament. Shame about that one miss but it was when it mattered the least

Also thank god for Julian Alvarez
True, would've been nice feat to score in every game, although Messi is the only one to score in every phase of the modern format. Jairzinho is the only one scoring in every game I think, back when it was 6 game format.
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Post by Harmonica Wed Jan 25, 2023 10:29 am

El Gunner wrote:as i said i really don't understand what is going on here...

Zidane '98 is the best WC finals performance of all-time imo
I might go through Zidane WC98 too. He wasn't chosen as top 3 performers in WC98, but back then PotT was chosen before the final. Although it might not change the result, Jairzinho WC70 wasn't in top 3 PotT either, but I rank him top 4 of the notable World Cup performances.
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Post by Harmonica Wed Jan 25, 2023 10:40 am

Messi WC22

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7 goals from 14 great scoring chances
22 great scoring chances created
15 players beaten by dribble (OPTA)
5 tackles (OPTA)

Goals (Scored + Assisted + Involved)
12 (7(5p) + 3 + 2) out of 15 team goals = 80% importance (+ 2 SO Goals)

Goals Scored

Saudi Arabia 1
Mexico 1
Australia 1
Netherlands 1
Croatia 1
France 1
France 2

Great Chances Missed

Saudi Arabia 1
Saudi Arabia 2
Saudi Arabia 3
Poland 1
Poland 2
Poland 3
Australia 1
Croatia 1
France 1

Great Chances Created

Saudi Arabia 1
Saudi Arabia 2
Saudi Arabia 3
Mexico 1
Poland 1
Poland 2
Poland 3
Poland 4
Poland 5
Poland 6
Australia 1
Australia 2
Australia 3
Australia 4
Netherlands 1
Croatia 1
Croatia 2
Croatia 3
Croatia 4
France 1
France 2
France 3
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Post by Harmonica Wed Jan 25, 2023 1:58 pm

For me Messi WC22 is another all time great World Cup performance. It's not quite Maradona WC86 nor Messi WC14, even though similar in importance and overall round by round performance. Messi WC22 falls little behind in scoring efficiency, playmaking and defending. Funnily enough it's probably the best ever KO performance, which Messi WC14 got criticism of.

I think it correlates nicely with Kempes WC78, equal in defending, slight differences in importance and playmaking. Kempes was more efficient from his scoring chances, but Messi performed better in four rounds to one.
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World Cup performance index
, considering statistics, the best (and worst) plays, importance and relation of quality of opposition and own team. Color highlighted as golden, silver, bronze ball, or not in Top 3.

1.
Maradona 86
Messi 14

3.
Kempes 78
Messi 22

5.
Jairzinho 70

6.
Cruyff 74
Robben 14
8.
Forlan 10
9.
Romario 94
10.
Eusebio 66
Pele 70
Rossi 82

13.
G.Müller 70
Schillaci 90
Suker 98
16.
Charlton 66
Modric 18

Ronaldo 02
19.
Ronaldo 98
20.
Zidane 06
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Post by Harmonica Today at 2:04 pm

Going to post Mbappe WC22 too as I think it's also an all-time WC-performance.

Round 1 Mbappe vs Australia

Spoiler:

Very eventful game, part of 3 goals of 4 the assist being most individual quality, created 4 big chances, and had 6 big misses. It would be great individual performance, without all of those misses which point to a great team performance.

Kind of hard to position this performance, as there isn't really similar in here. Now it's important performance (3/4 goals), but he also missed more quality than he created. It's better than Messi vs. Saudi Arabia I think, and I'm going to put him with Modric, who had kind of neutral performance, but was part of both goals.

Also after watching back Pele vs Czechoslovakia, I'm repositioning it above Mbappe as it has less big misses, but similar importance.

World Cup Performance Index, considering statistics, the best (and worst) plays, importance and relation of quality of opposition and own team.

1.
Messi 14 vs Bosnia and Herzegovina
2.
Romario 94 vs Russia
3.
Maradona 86 vs South Korea
4.
Pele 70 vs Czechoslovakia
5.
Modric 18 vs Nigeria
Mbappe 22 vs Australia
7.
G.Müller 70 vs Morocco
Messi 22 vs Saudi Arabia
Jairzinho 70 vs Czechoslovakia
Robben 14 vs Spain
Ronaldo 02 vs Turkey
Schillaci 90 vs Austria
13.
Cruyff 74 vs Uruguay
Eusebio 66 vs Hungary
Kempes 78 vs Hungary
Suker 98 vs Jamaica
17.
Charlton 66 vs Uruguay
Bebeto 94 vs Russia
Rossi 82 vs Poland
Zidane 06 vs Switzerland
20.
Forlan 10 vs France
21.
Ronaldo 98 vs Scotland
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Post by Harmonica Today at 2:19 pm

Round 2 Mbappe vs. Denmark

Spoiler:
Great performance, scoring both goals and creating one additional chance. Only had one big miss.

It's kind of similar level performance to Messi vs. Mexico, part of 2/2 goals, and having neutral impact of quality otherwise. Now Messi had more quality in the goal clearly, and Mbappe tap-in probably doesn't have that much more quality than Messi's assist, I'm still going to put them in the same category for now.

World Cup Performance Index, considering statistics, the best (and worst) plays, importance and relation of quality of opposition and own team.

1.
Charlton 66 vs Mexico
Forlan 10 vs South Africa
Messi 14 vs Iran
Messi 22 vs Mexico
Mbappe 22 vs Denmark
6.
Jairzinho 70 vs England
7.
Kempes 78 vs France
Modric 18 vs Argentina
Ronaldo 98 vs Morocco
10.
G.Müller vs Bulgaria
11.
Bebeto vs Cameroon
Romario 94 vs Cameroon
13.
Maradona 86 vs Italy
14.
Cruyff 74 vs Sweden
Robben 14 vs Australia
Ronaldo 02 vs China
17.
Pele 70 vs England
18.
Suker 98 vs Japan
19.
Eusebio 66 vs Bulgaria
Zidane 06 vs South Korea
21.
Rossi 82 vs Peru
22.
Schillaci 90 vs USA
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Post by Harmonica Today at 2:28 pm

Round 3 Mbappe vs. Tunisia

Spoiler:

27 minutes of neutral performance, I could categorize one event as big chance that led to a big miss.

Going to rate it between Messi vs Poland and Modric vs Iceland. It's passive performance like Modric, but also France didn't score a goal either.

World Cup Performance Index, considering statistics, the best (and worst) plays, importance and relation of quality of opposition and own team.

1.
Messi 14 vs Nigeria
2.
Cruyff 74 vs Bulgaria
Jairzinho 70 vs Romania
Pele 70 vs Romania
Robben 14 vs Chile
6.
Eusebio 66 vs Brazil
G.Müller 70 vs Peru
8.
Romario 94 vs Sweden
Schillaci 90 vs Czechoslovakia
10.
Maradona 86 vs Bulgaria
11.
Forlan 10 vs Mexico
Rossi 82 vs Cameroon
13.
Charlton 66 vs France
14.
Kempes 78 vs Italy
Messi 22 vs Poland
Ronaldo 02 vs Costa Rica
Ronaldo 98 vs Norway
Suker 98 vs Argentina
19.
Mbappe 22 vs Tunisia
20.
Modric 18 vs Iceland
21.
Zidane 06 (double yellow)
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Post by Harmonica Today at 4:00 pm

Round 4 Mbappe vs. Poland

Spoiler:

Giving this the best performance in Round 4. Involved in all three goals by scoring two and assisting one, and also created 2 other chances. Even though Eusebio was also part of all 5 goals against North Korea and created 3 other chances, in relation he missed more big chances 4/8.

World Cup Performance Index, considering statistics, the best (and worst) plays, importance and relation of quality of opposition and own team.

1.
Mbappe 22 vs Poland
2.
Eusebio
vs North Korea
3.
Messi 14 vs Switzerland
Kempes 78 vs Poland
5.
Robben 14 vs Mexico
6.
Cruyff 74 vs Argentina
Messi 22 vs Australia
8.
Forlan 10 vs South Korea
Jairzinho 70 vs Peru
Maradona 86 vs Uruguay
Zidane 06 vs Spain
12.
Romario 94 vs USA
Suker 98 vs Romania
14.
Modric 18 vs Denmark
15.
G.Müller 70 vs England
Pele 70 vs Peru
Ronaldo 98 vs Chile
Ronaldo 02 vs Belgium
Rossi 82 vs Argentina
Schillaci 90 vs Uruguay
21.
Charlton 66 vs Argentina
Harmonica
Harmonica
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