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Arquitescu wrote:If anyone actually watched Ander for an extended period of time and what he has done for Athletic, they'd know he is certainly worth 36m given the price players are going for now. All this hype behind Thiago who despite all his talent done *bleep* all in club football yet Ander goes under the radar despite performing for 3 years now on a consistent basis.

At the moment worth 30m at least yet it definitely isn't a baffling price.

Would be the best midfielder in United.

*cough* Carrick *cough* Kagawa *cough*

He might well be their most effective wide-midfielder, but I rate Carrick very highly. Shinji had a tough first season with Ferguson often choosing to deploy a striker such as Rooney and Welbeck in that AM/SS position. Under Moyes, Kagawa doesn't appear to be getting a sniff of the starting XI, with Moyes' typically british 442's, 4411's and 451's. He is a top-class player, and it's absolutely criminal what Moyes is doing to him by oscillating between an all-out attack (442/424) and parking the bus (451).

Herrera could be a very good signing for United, but does he really produce enough to justify that price tag? You could claim his stats last season were a aberration due to a lack of a quality striker to supply. However, his best season (10/11 Real Zaragoza) he still only scored 2 and assisted 3. I'm sorry, but that doesn't quite warrant the sticker price on this transfer. Bilbao are driving up the price as always, but United seem just desperate enough to pay it.

donttreadonred wrote:

Arquitescu wrote:If anyone actually watched Ander for an extended period of time and what he has done for Athletic, they'd know he is certainly worth 36m given the price players are going for now. All this hype behind Thiago who despite all his talent done *bleep* all in club football yet Ander goes under the radar despite performing for 3 years now on a consistent basis.

At the moment worth 30m at least yet it definitely isn't a baffling price.

Would be the best midfielder in United.

*cough* Carrick *cough* Kagawa *cough*

He might well be their most effective wide-midfielder, but I rate Carrick very highly. Shinji had a tough first season with Ferguson often choosing to deploy a striker such as Rooney and Welbeck in that AM/SS position. Under Moyes, Kagawa doesn't appear to be getting a sniff of the starting XI, with Moyes' typically british 442's, 4411's and 451's. He is a top-class player, and it's absolutely criminal what Moyes is doing to him by oscillating between an all-out attack (442/424) and parking the bus (451).  

Herrera could be a very good signing for United, but does he really produce enough to justify that price tag? You could claim his stats last season were a aberration due to a lack of a quality striker to supply. However, his best season (10/11 Real Zaragoza) he still only scored 2 and assisted 3. I'm sorry, but that doesn't quite warrant the sticker price on this transfer.  Bilbao are driving up the price as always, but United seem just desperate enough to pay it.

Kagawa is arguable as I say that due to his limits compared to a far more complete Ander. Yet on the current basis of last year he has yet to replicate his form to justify what was paid for him, to which he hasn't.

Carrick? On the basis of what? Before last year we saw a Carrick who was merely a tactical slot-in for United & merely a piece of the system. Press Carrick, or mark him closely and he phases out of the game.

Are we using stats to justify Ander? This is a player who has played ranging from a deep position ahead of the CBs to an advanced #10 role. His best role is a Xavi (for Espana) role to which he roams deep & advanced depending on the space of the play. He is the possession holder, playmaker etc for Athletic Susaeta, De Marcos & Muniain were responsible for final balls. You hardly see Ander attempting through balls mostly due to his role. Stats do not quantify his play at all.

Based on what he has shown and replicated on the basis of 4 years, the price can be justified, as did Javi Martinez, as will Illaramendi for Real Madrid, and if Moyes uses Ander properly, he'll justify his price, as well.

Im guessing Ander will start instead of Cleverley.Cleverley does his job pretty well most of the time though,United should be going for players on tha wings.

Arquitescu wrote:

halamadrid2 wrote:United buying hererra for more than we bought Illaramendi.  gtfi Moyes

Don't see what is wrong with that.

Illaramendi performed wonderfully for 1 year. Ander has been doing it for 4+ years now (Zaragoza & Athletic).

i am hearing that if united loan Herrera the money to pay his clauses, there will be no tax involved.

Arq, why has Herrera fallen off the u21 radar?

Arq

defending us against dem haters

How many young all round midfielders are there that can dictate play from deep and stuck his foot in? Honest to god people.. If he stays for 6/7 years the 30m will look like a bargin.

cyberman

cyberman wrote:How many young all round midfielders are there that can dictate play from deep and stuck his foot in? Honest to god people.. If he stays for 6/7 years the 30m will look like a bargin.

but you already have cleverley....

Arq jinxing Herrera so he'll flop at United

Mr Nick09 wrote:

cyberman wrote:How many young all round midfielders are there that can dictate play from deep and stuck his foot in? Honest to god people.. If he stays for 6/7 years the 30m will look like a bargin.

but you already have cleverley....

what is wrong with depth?....outside of Carrick and Cleverley we have Giggs and Anderson....Anderson who can't get in the team because of a 40 year old ffs

cyberman wrote:How many young all round midfielders are there that can dictate play from deep and stuck his foot in? Honest to god people.. If he stays for 6/7 years the 30m will look like a bargin.

I don't know much about Ander but I can't help but be reminded of your classic "pogba leaving is no loss, morrison is way better anyway" line here

Well, Utd would be getting Felliani apparently so that should be under the "do something ffs" category...

fellaini and ander would fit nicely into a 4-4-2 tbh

Here's Sid Lowe:

Athletic Bilbao remain steadfast in their refusal to voluntarily sell Ander Herrera. Manchester United’s ability to sign the midfielder will depend on their resolve to test the rules governing buy-out clauses in Spain and the response of the league and the tax authorities to their actions.
Here, it becomes very complicated in theory.
Every player in Spain has a formal rescission clause, registered with the league which fixes the amount at which a player can unilaterally end his contract and move to another club. That player deposits the amount stipulated in his clause (in Herrera’s case, €36m) with the league and is then free to move.
Clubs agreed in principle that if another club pays the buy-out clause they will sell at that total price, meaning that the player does not actually pay the money: it effectively becomes a transfer like any other. But when it is a hostile bid, two other scenarios open up: one, that the club accepts the buy-out fee but, as all Spanish companies do, adds VAT (at 21%). And two, when the club does not accept the fee at all, the player deposits the money at the league himself.
Of course, in practice Herrera does not have €36m lying around, so United could in theory pay the money on his behalf. Yet that could be challenge by both the tax authorities and the league itself as the player would strictly be liable for 50% income tax.
None of this has been tested and some experts believe United would face no legal challenge. And yet the whole transfer is complicated enough to cause a few headaches on both sides.

Swanhends wrote:

cyberman wrote:How many young all round midfielders are there that can dictate play from deep and stuck his foot in? Honest to god people.. If he stays for 6/7 years the 30m will look like a bargin.

I don't know much about Ander but I can't help but be reminded of your classic "pogba leaving is no loss, morrison is way better anyway" line here

Morrison has had a great start to season with West Ham.....wouldn't be surprised if he has a break out year tbh.

it was always mental with Morrison talent was never in doubt, not all players are superstars by 20/21

B-Mac wrote:

Swanhends wrote:

cyberman wrote:How many young all round midfielders are there that can dictate play from deep and stuck his foot in? Honest to god people.. If he stays for 6/7 years the 30m will look like a bargin.

I don't know much about Ander but I can't help but be reminded of your classic "pogba leaving is no loss, morrison is way better anyway" line here

Morrison has had a great start to season with West Ham.....wouldn't be surprised if he has a break out year tbh.

it was always mental with Morrison talent was never in doubt, not all players are superstars by 20/21

You're not getting the point

Pogba leaves
GL: huge loss for United
Cyber: Unimportant, Morrison is way better

Morrison leaves
GL: That's surprising
Cyber: Terrible attitude, was never going to get playing time with Cleverley here

United signing Ander
GL: Overpriced, and not sure he's what United need
Cyber: All around midfielder who will be around for 6-7 years


Cyber will polish anything if you throw a United uniform on it

Swanhends wrote:

B-Mac wrote:

Swanhends wrote:I don't know much about Ander but I can't help but be reminded of your classic "pogba leaving is no loss, morrison is way better anyway" line here

Morrison has had a great start to season with West Ham.....wouldn't be surprised if he has a break out year tbh.

it was always mental with Morrison talent was never in doubt, not all players are superstars by 20/21

You're not getting the point

Pogba leaves
GL: huge loss for United
Cyber: Unimportant, Morrison is way better

Morrison leaves
GL: That's surprising
Cyber: Terrible attitude, was never going to get playing time with Cleverley here

United signing Ander
GL: Overpriced, and not sure he's what United need
Cyber: All around midfielder who will be around for 6-7 years


Cyber will polish anything if you throw a United uniform on it

your GL opinions are slightly off, Most of GL didn't even rate Pogba when he was a United youth, in fact most Juve fans had no clue what kind of player he was till he arrived. so doubt the general consensus at the time was "huge loss" by all of GL, considering the only people who rated him at the time were mostly United fans.

and most of GL is currently saying Ander is exactly what we need.

Usain Bolt just spoke for every United fan in the world. We're all frustrated atm.

It's ridiculous. We have 5 hours left to get in vital players, but in all honesty, we shouldn't have left it this late.

There has not been a plan at all. Just throwing random bids to top players we had a minimal chance of getting.

Frustrating.

Moyes' that small time British hillbilly

well now you lots know what we have been going through for the last few years  

B-Mac wrote:your GL opinions are slightly off, Most of GL didn't even rate Pogba when he was a United youth, in fact most Juve fans had no clue what kind of player he was till he arrived. so doubt the general consensus at the time was "huge loss" by all of GL, considering the only people who rated him at the time were mostly United fans.

The great cyberman when Pogba was beasting for Juve last year :

cyberman wrote:Cleverley is having a better season than Pogba, cleverley is exactly what we need while Pogba isn't.
Daelhi in the reserves is better than Pogba, he will have taken that mercenaries spot anyway.

S wrote:

B-Mac wrote:your GL opinions are slightly off, Most of GL didn't even rate Pogba when he was a United youth, in fact most Juve fans had no clue what kind of player he was till he arrived. so doubt the general consensus at the time was "huge loss" by all of GL, considering the only people who rated him at the time were mostly United fans.

The great cyberman when Pogba was beasting for Juve last year :

cyberman wrote:Cleverley is having a better season than Pogba, cleverley is exactly what we need while Pogba isn't.
Daelhi in the reserves is better than Pogba, he will have taken that mercenaries spot anyway.

I don't see what relevance that has to my post, they are his opinions in comparing 2 players.

but for the record Daelhi a 18 year old Norwegian attacking midfielder was sold to Solksjaer's team in Norway Molde at the beginning of the summer as he was home sick, there is believed to be some sort of buy back agreement tho, he is a great talent.

Andreas Pereira is the next big thing coming from the academy currently, 17 year old Belgian attacking midfielder

Nick, Ander is 23 at the moment and chose not to participate within the U-21 tournaments out of recovery from his frequent injuries.

Fact is, Del Bosque post-2010 has completely STOPPED scouting any team outside Real Madrid & Barcelona. He used to scout Atletico yet ceased within that area as well. He wants to create a firm nucleus based out of the Classico contingent out of harmony and the already chemistry established. You can forget about VDB scouting foreign teams with Spaniards in them outside Manchester City, since he is in excellent relations with Txiki.


& to be fair, Cyber is literally the 1st one on this forum who hyped up Paul Pogba. Yes, when he left he played off his talent yet during Morrison and Pogba's rising in United, Cyber hyped them to the stratosphere.

And one of them, he was right about all along. Don't know about Ravel.

& I am not defending United. Quite frankly I am despondent that he will be a United player as your *bleep* shit manager Moyes & his system will ruin him as a DM or winger or whatever the hell you do to any playmaker

Arquitescu wrote:Nick, Ander is 23 at the moment and chose not to participate within the U-21 tournaments out of recovery from his frequent injuries.

Fact is, Del Bosque post-2010 has completely STOPPED scouting any team outside Real Madrid & Barcelona. He used to scout Atletico yet ceased within that area as well. He wants to create a firm nucleus based out of the Classico contingent out of harmony and the already chemistry established. You can forget about VDB scouting foreign teams with Spaniards in them outside Manchester City, since he is in excellent relations with Txiki.


& to be fair, Cyber is literally the 1st one on this forum who hyped up Paul Pogba. Yes, when he left he played off his talent yet during Morrison and Pogba's rising in United, Cyber hyped them to the stratosphere.

And one of them, he was right about all along. Don't know about Ravel.

& I am not defending United. Quite frankly I am despondent that he will be a United player as your *bleep* shit manager Moyes & his system will ruin him as a DM or winger or whatever the hell you do to any playmaker

we have been attempting to play 4-3-3 when Rooney is not in the starting XI, so Ander will be used in a 3 man midfield to some extent it seems, replacing Giggs who has played there twice now vs Swansea and Liverpool

Swanhends wrote:

B-Mac wrote:

Swanhends wrote:I don't know much about Ander but I can't help but be reminded of your classic "pogba leaving is no loss, morrison is way better anyway" line here

Morrison has had a great start to season with West Ham.....wouldn't be surprised if he has a break out year tbh.

it was always mental with Morrison talent was never in doubt, not all players are superstars by 20/21

You're not getting the point

Pogba leaves
GL: huge loss for United
Cyber: Unimportant, Morrison is way better

Morrison leaves
GL: That's surprising
Cyber: Terrible attitude, was never going to get playing time with Cleverley here

United signing Ander
GL: Overpriced, and not sure he's what United need
Cyber: All around midfielder who will be around for 6-7 years


Cyber will polish anything if you throw a United uniform on it

LOL.