I must have imagined the 3 headers Chiellini won then

Also, there was more than 3 duels in the air.

juventus101 wrote:18/25 passes is good. As i said he passed the ball well. He assiated a goal by being offside and it wasnt close. He "drew" 4 fouls by diving as i said. And interceptions and tackles are a defenders job. Youre telling me a striker had a good game with one of the reasons being he excelled doing a defenders work. And he only got one shot on target out of 3, with that one being straight at Buffon. And i dont remember him creating any chances, so maybe you can clarify which ones?

Also, dont care what the stats say, they had way more than 3 aerial duels, and hd lost every one, thd only time he "won" was when Chiellini put an elbow into him so he fell down crying.

Does it really matter? Heynckes said he was extremely happy with Mandzukic's performance. So i guess it's safe to say that he did what's expected from him very well, in the context of Bayerns overall tactic system, that is.

Bayern will go to the final

juventus101 wrote:18/25 passes is good. As i said he passed the ball well. He assiated a goal by being offside and it wasnt close. He "drew" 4 fouls by diving as i said. And interceptions and tackles are a defenders job. Youre telling me a striker had a good game with one of the reasons being he excelled doing a defenders work. And he only got one shot on target out of 3, with that one being straight at Buffon. And i dont remember him creating any chances, so maybe you can clarify which ones?

Also, dont care what the stats say, they had way more than 3 aerial duels, and hd lost every one, thd only time he "won" was when Chiellini put an elbow into him so he fell down crying.

You said he lost every aerial duel (False)
You said he only made short passes backward (False)
2/3 of his tackles were at the halfway line
Both of his interceptions were in the attacking half
Chances: 1 was the assist. I believe the others were his pullback to Muller that was saved, and his pass to Alaba at the top of the 18 that was saved

Not sure I'd say WC, but he had a pretty good all-around game - active in all different phases

Tough to argue otherwise unless goals are all that matter to you

Abrakewhocares wrote:Also, there was more than 3 duels in the air.

2/3 were Mandzukic's duels. 2 won. 1 lost.

All told there were 18 aerial duels in the game.

Yes I know that, but I definitely seen more than 3 instances where Mandzukic was involved in an air challenge.

and, btw if you watched the game carefully you would notice it really wasn't the CBs fault. Peluso and Lichtsteiner were absolutely woeful. Muller, Ribery, and Robben basically did whatever they wanted. Im watching the match again right now without by biased cap on. Bayern were dominant, but the tie is still within reach for Juventus.

Vucinic needs to start the next game, Quagliarella and Matri were dreadful. But maybe that was due to the fact that Marchisio, Pirlo, and Vidal didn't really do anything.

#saveuspogba

McLewis wrote:Juve looked straight up intimidated. Bayern were made to look better because of it. The Juventus who has been beasting for the past 2 seasons was nowhere to be found today.

Tie's not over yet though. They are still fantastic at home.

agreed, but the problem is that Bayern are fantastic away

AbraKebabra Alacalamb wrote:Yes I know that, but I definitely seen more than 3 instances where Mandzukic was involved in an air challenge.

Fair enough, but if you want to challenge Opta's definition of an aerial duel, take that up with them

Where are people are getting the notion that Mandzukic played poorly?

I think that this shows that even though Matri-Quag are capable in serie A, they're not good enough for this level.

It's about more than being able to finish, you need to be able to hold the ball up and link up with the midfield in games where you're not playing for a team which is superior to the other team.

If we had Vucinic - Llorente I imagine the outlook of the game would have been much better.

And please don't take this as an excuse I'm not looking for 'Ifs and buts' there is no excuse. I'm just making a point that upfront we're not good enough.

The strikers want better service? It's up to them to keep the ball and let the service providers get up the pitch.

Tbh individuals won't do anything if Conte doesn't change things tactically.

That is the brunt of the issue for Juventus today and unless it changes they are going out with a whimper tbh.

Its especially important because as far as i'm concerned pound for pound Bayern are superior in most departments. So Juventus have to beat them in other ways like tactically and even in that department Bayern were vastly superior today.

[quote="AbraKebabra Alacalamb"]I think that this shows that even though Matri-Quag are capable in serie A, they're not good enough for this level.

It's about more than being able to finish, you need to be able to hold the ball up and link up with the midfield in games where you're not playing for a team which is superior to the other team.

If we had Vucinic - Llorente I imagine the outlook of the game would have been much better.

And please don't take this as an excuse I'm not looking for 'Ifs and buts' there is no excuse. I'm just making a point that upfront we're not good enough.

The strikers want better service? It's up to them to keep the ball and let the service providers get up the pitch.[/quote]

Matri was found complaining a few times, and TBH I did sympathize with him to an extent. The MF didn't really do much tonight

The midfield was worse but if our strikers kept the ball when they had it then the midfield could have spent more time with the ball going towards Bayerns half.

No matter how good Pirlo is, if he's facing our goal with 2 athletic midfielders pressing him, he might aswell not play.

AbraKebabra Alacalamb wrote:I think that this shows that even though Matri-Quag are capable in serie A, they're not good enough for this level.

It's about more than being able to finish, you need to be able to hold the ball up and link up with the midfield in games where you're not playing for a team which is superior to the other team.

If we had Vucinic - Llorente I imagine the outlook of the game would have been much better.

And please don't take this as an excuse I'm not looking for 'Ifs and buts' there is no excuse. I'm just making a point that upfront we're not good enough.

The strikers want better service? It's up to them to keep the ball and let the service providers get up the pitch.

It had little to do with Matri or Quags. Forget that Conte shot the midfield to shit with his plan of having MVP perform in a system to which they rather shot themselves with.

With Matri and Quagliarella, you have two strikers who do not compliment and blend with each other. Matri spends time using intelligent movement to create channels of open space to draw defenders out like Fernando Torres while Quags likes to sit deep and use the channels to take shots from angles or straight on. Works on paper but in the game what will happen and DID happen was two players using the same channels of play to which the Bayern defence found easy to exploit. Its the reason Quags and Vucinic works. Its the reason why Vucinic and Giovinco works. Hell, Vucinic' importance is severely understated for Juve in holding the ball and creating for the the forward ahead in his SS role.

So in essence and hypothetically, Matri-Quags made it harder for the midfield by their incongruently fixed movement to which would make it hard for anyone, even if the sole system nullifies the midfield itself. Crucial mistake. Quags is good enough for CL, don't know about Matri

i am still ed from what happened tonight, expected Juve to at least put up a fight, it was a performance i am still ing. That first goal would have expected much more form a keeper trying to claim his spot among the best in his position, and that pirlo clearance was

Fantastic display from Bayern! They deserved to win by at least 6 goals. They were superior in every way.

Quags and especially Matri were just awful. They couldnt hold the ball up at all, instead trying flick ons to each other and hoping they get through on goal. And when they did try to hold the ball up, they were either outmuscled or stood fhdre waiting for the ball while the defender ran in front of them and took it. The midfield simply had no dorwadd passing options because of this, so they had to try and do evdrything themself and obviously thats impossible. We all saw how much better our passing was once Vucinic and Gio got on and Vucinic dropped back to supply a passing outlet. Stull wasnt up to our usual par at all, but being down 2 goals, we had to rush it, plus we just were having a very off day. And Marchisio shouldnt get hated on. Hes stuck on the left side literally by himself against Lahm, Gustavo/Schweinsteiger, and Robben tracked back alot too. Peluso was really at fault, hes just not at this level, we shouldve played Asamoah. In the second half though Marchisio was still better.

And there were alot more than 3 aerial duels between Mandzukic and Chiellini, so that right there shows that those stats are false. Chiellini won every single one, whether he elbowed Mandzukc or jot really doesnt matter here. Alabas shot was on his own. Just cuz Mandzukic passed him the ball doesnt mean he created the chance. And the second goal was offside, so yea he created it, but it shouldnt have been given. Okay, so he wasnt garbage as i said before, but to say he was anything close to MOTM is just laughable.

We're not out of this yet though. 2 goals is not insurmountable by any means. If we show up in Turin instead of putting in another Inter(1rst 1/2 season)/Bayern 1rst leg performance, we can definitely pull this off. Start Giovinco, Vucinic, Asamoah, go for an early goal which we are basically specialists at, and then this game is wide open. The most important thing is just not to concede, but i still believe in us. Today was an off day, just like the Inter game in the first half of the season. Every team has them, even Barcelona (Milan) and Bayern themselves (BATE).

I think this referee was hand picked by Marotta. Every decision went Juve's way. Vidal should of been sent off for dangerous play. Perhaps even Chiellini.

I'm surprised that Juve looked so poor. they've been so dominant in Italy.

Great Leader Sprucenuce wrote:Tbh individuals won't do anything if Conte doesn't change things tactically.

That is the brunt of the issue for Juventus today and unless it changes they are going out with a whimper tbh.

Its especially important because as far as i'm concerned pound for pound Bayern are superior in most departments. So Juventus have to beat them in other ways like tactically and even in that department Bayern were vastly superior today.

when did u go to India Mole?

Rossonero23 wrote:I think this referee was hand picked by Marotta. Every decision went Juve's way. Vidal should of been sent off for dangerous play. Perhaps even Chiellini.

I'm surprised that Juve looked so poor. they've been so dominant in Italy.

am sure Marotta also told them to allow a glaring offside goal against his own team


Juve101, please stop with your Mandzukic sucked nonsense, the dude played exactly to his team's plan, he intimidated our defense, and would have scored had it not been for Buffon...

elmystique wrote:

Rossonero23 wrote:I think this referee was hand picked by Marotta. Every decision went Juve's way. Vidal should of been sent off for dangerous play. Perhaps even Chiellini.

I'm surprised that Juve looked so poor. they've been so dominant in Italy.

am sure Marotta also told them to allow a glaring offside goal against his own team


Juve101, please stop with your Mandzukic sucked nonsense, the dude played exactly to his team's plan, he intimidated our defense, and would have scored had it not been for Buffon...

That was brilliant. Juve got a taste of their own medicine!

Cheers to Bayern! I'll be rooting for them next week!

FORZA BAYERN ALE ALE ALE ALE FORZA BAYERN ALE ALE ALE!!!

Rossonero23 wrote:I think this referee was hand picked by Marotta. Every decision went Juve's way. Vidal should of been sent off for dangerous play. Perhaps even Chiellini.

I'm surprised that Juve looked so poor. they've been so dominant in Italy.

Are you kidding?

-Ribery shouldve been sent off.
-Lichsteiner shouldve won a penalty, or it was at least arguable, but by no means a yellow for Lichsteiner for supposed diving.
-Their second goal was offside.

Im not complaining about the ref, but Bayern clearly got some more favorable decisions.

juventus101 wrote:

Rossonero23 wrote:I think this referee was hand picked by Marotta. Every decision went Juve's way. Vidal should of been sent off for dangerous play. Perhaps even Chiellini.

I'm surprised that Juve looked so poor. they've been so dominant in Italy.

Are you kidding?

-Ribery shouldve been sent off.
-Lichsteiner shouldve won a penalty, or it was at least arguable, but by no means a yellow for Lichsteiner for supposed diving.
-Their second goal was offside.

Im not complaining about the ref, but Bayern clearly got some more favorable decisions.

From a neutral point of view, every call went Juve's way. Vidal should of been booked in the 1st half at least...it took the ref so long to finally show him a card. Lichsteiner is a notorious dirty player, he dived and was properly booked same with Gustavo from Munich.

i dont think the 2nd goal was offside, tough call for linesman.

Rossonero23 wrote:

juventus101 wrote:

Rossonero23 wrote:I think this referee was hand picked by Marotta. Every decision went Juve's way. Vidal should of been sent off for dangerous play. Perhaps even Chiellini.

I'm surprised that Juve looked so poor. they've been so dominant in Italy.

Are you kidding?

-Ribery shouldve been sent off.
-Lichsteiner shouldve won a penalty, or it was at least arguable, but by no means a yellow for Lichsteiner for supposed diving.
-Their second goal was offside.

Im not complaining about the ref, but Bayern clearly got some more favorable decisions.

From a neutral point of view, every call went Juve's way. Vidal should of been booked in the 1st half at least...it took the ref so long to finally show him a card. Lichsteiner is a notorious dirty player, he dived and was properly booked same with Gustavo from Munich.

i dont think the 2nd goal was offside, tough call for linesman.

its funny how you and baleji_the_goat, always come of age whenever Juve loses, it must have been very frustrating last season, was there ever any urge to wank or you weren't able to mature fast enough for that?

...

You have no clue what youre talking about.