Defenders - they don't make 'em anymore like in the past

Franz Beckenbauer. Bobby Moore. Gaetano Scirea. Lothar Matthäus. Paolo Maldini. Franco Baresi. I could continue listing really great names of the past who made sure that the opposing attackers got frustrated ever so often, and you can sure add more scintillating names.

But I wonder how they would fare in the modern game, where referees are much faster booking defenders for tackles while attackers are much faster going down, no matter whether there was contact or not.

In my opinion, the classic style of defenders wouldn't stand much chance nowadays, as many kinds of tackles that were nodded on by the past refs, would nowadays resort in a direct booking. This lead to the fact that defenders need to be far more careful nowadays how they try to part attackers from the ball, especially when close to the penalty area.

So can you really say that modern defenders are worse than the past ones, or is it more that the style of play itself and the way the referees whistle nowadays has changed?

It was the evolution of attacking football.

The game has changed and it's "softer" if you compare the way teams defended in Serie A back in the 80's through to the 90's.

Vidic, Adams, Terry, Carragher, Campbell are great

Dutti wrote:The game has changed and it's "softer" if you compare the way teams defended in Serie A back in the 80's through to the 90's.

Yeah, that's my point - the game got "softer" and less physical - but does that make past defenders "better"? I mean, if you look at some threads, it sounds as if the modern defenders don't know their trade if they try to figure out different measures to prevent an attacker from scoring, for example by using positioning instead of going into dangerous tackles.

IMO there are not many defenders that can usually risk tackling without the fear of getting booked (Philipp Lahm comes to my mind there first - although he has the advantage of his small size - he could never really rely on being stronger than an often one head taller attacker, so he has to rely on technique instead), so it seems the trend goes to positioning an thus intercepting passes early - but that simply doesn't look as spectacular than a heavy tackle and so people might wrongly assume the old defenders were "better".

rwo power wrote:

Dutti wrote:The game has changed and it's "softer" if you compare the way teams defended in Serie A back in the 80's through to the 90's.

Yeah, that's my point - the game got "softer" and less physical - but does that make past defenders "better"? I mean, if you look at some threads, it sounds as if the modern defenders don't know their trade if they try to figure out different measures to prevent an attacker from scoring, for example by using positioning instead of going into dangerous tackles.

IMO there are not many defenders that can usually risk tackling without the fear of getting booked (Philipp Lahm comes to my mind there first - although he has the advantage of his small size - he could never really rely on being stronger than an often one head taller attacker, so he has to rely on technique instead), so it seems the trend goes to positioning an thus intercepting passes early - but that simply doesn't look as spectacular than a heavy tackle and so people might wrongly assume the old defenders were "better".

I think it's a little about how people don't want to admit players that are on their rivals team or team that they dislike will be remembered as greats (Ex: Carlos Puyol and Real Madrid, or Sol Campbell and Tottencrap)

Um, this is not going to become another Real vs Barca thread, yes? This is about past and modern defenders and the way the game changed along the time

the days when you can pull a ruthless tackle are gone
the refs are overprotective

when there the ones that need protection and not the players

halamadrid2 wrote:but ali said since youre from rival teams its hard to admit the other teams player(in this case defender) being one of the greatest... i just gave him examples of when thats not the case

I didn't want to attack you, I just saw the way quite some innocuous threads went here at GL. So I thought I'd follow the motto "obsta principiis"*)

*) "obsta principiis" - "resist the beginnings"

When you say Bobby Moore, Franz Beckenbauer and Paolo Maldini. You do realise Moore's career started in 1958 and Maldini's finished in 2009. You are comparing 50 years of football past legendary players to one years worth of football players.

Include the players in the last 5-10 years if you're gonna go back as far as Bobby Moore

BiasedMilanFan3 wrote:When you say Bobby Moore, Franz Beckenbauer and Paolo Maldini. You do realise Moore's career started in 1958 and Maldini's finished in 2009. You are comparing 50 years of football past legendary players to one years worth of football players.

Include the players in the last 5-10 years if you're gonna go back as far as Bobby Moore

I know I started from rather early and went up to Maldini. I guess one additionally needs to discern between the different leagues, if one wants to be really precise as the Spanish refs seems to be even more strict about non-physical play than for example English refs that wave on after tackles that might get a La Liga player sent off.

I just wanted to point out a general trend here - away from tackles and towards the better positioning and more intelligent play, although the latter is still often not appreciated enough in my opinion.

halamadrid2 wrote:

rwo power wrote:

halamadrid2 wrote:but ali said since youre from rival teams its hard to admit the other teams player(in this case defender) being one of the greatest... i just gave him examples of when thats not the case

I didn't want to attack you, I just saw the way quite some innocuous threads went here at GL. So I thought I'd follow the motto "obsta principiis"*)

*) "obsta principiis" - "resist the beginnings"

lol, quite right there... well played

See. Modern defending. Anticipation and deflection

Yeah, pretty much. It's more a dive contest than anything. Defenders are only big nowadays because of aerial supremacy, not because of the usual strength associated with large size. In La Liga it's horrible, although you can find diving in any league. It's why I'm for video technology to help out in ref decisions.

If you clear the ball without any contact, whatever happens next is all fair, FFS! I'm seen plenty of great tackles called as fouls because the ref thought the opposing player might break a nail or something.

The oldies are remembered better due to the nostalgia and historical factor, but because back then you could tackle like a man and get away with it Also, attackers back then got hit pretty hard, but they didn't go down like a bomb, but rather kept on going without stopping the play. Most guys nowadays just look for the foul, even if had they had an ounce of balls they could withstand most easy tackles you see.

halamadrid2 wrote:

rwo power wrote:

halamadrid2 wrote:
lol, quite right there... well played

See. Modern defending. Anticipation and deflection

no clearance or blocked shot....blasphemy

But no booking either. Efficient

Its bull

Defenders (appears to be) struggles these days due to over protection of attacking players and strict refereeing.Also we have to consider the evolution of the game,back in the day teams rarely pressed,teams never really forced CBs to play with ball because GK can catch a back pass..Some of the so called Greats were really protected by conservative tactics and some never played in a high line..

Defending today is overall alot tougher job than it was say 15 years ago let alone Keiser,Sciera..eras

I can't really say much coz i didn't watch football back in those days, but take into consideration that alot of people selecively remember the good things of the past, like how i always thought my childhood was fantastic, btu really there were alotta dark moments too. Maybe the defenders of the past are overrated a little and the defenders of today are underrated? I dunno i just think that lets say someone like Vermaelen will get more credit in around 20 years time than he gets now.

Defenders are okay as they are. You underrate a lot of them
There's something called zonal marking and team pressing for the ball. The game evolved, nowadays, the whole team defends together
Unless a team plays deep on counters you won't see the skill of the defenders. Also, the part about referees is right but still, defenders tackle when they need to.

I see another big problem in selection. The modern game is based a lot on speed and fitness. You're average defender has to have pace otherwise he'll be 2nd or 3rd rate. Now, most of the football newbies prefer to play an attacking role for the glory/money/ whatever. Most of the pacey guys with skill go there, then you have midfielders. They require less speed all around but a lot more footballing brains and awareness. Until now, most pacey and intelligent guys were selected out
The rest of the pacey guys try to become attacking fullbacks... That leaves you with a pretty slow bunch that is either strongly built physically or are intelligent but can't run to save their life. From this bunch, to find an intelligent AND pacey CB is a pain in the ass
Leftbacks are even more of the problem. See the position preferences in my post above, one of the ten players that're left in the bunch are left-footed
Try to find a high quality one among them... :lol!:

In Germany we have a FreeTV channel that always shows classic matches when there is not much current football going on (at least in the Bundesliga), so I could watch a couple of games from the 70es onwards in the last weeks.

IMO the defenders in the past often got away with bloody murder at times (heck, in the 70es, they didn't even were shin protectors, if I saw that right!)

I think it is not the worst thing that players now get protected better, although I think it is sad that the attackers often abuse the stricter reffing by playacting more to get advantages for themselves.

On the other hand it forces the defenders to become much more technically adept - the rule change about the backpass to the GK that Adit mentioned is one good example. (Thus not only defenders needed to work on their technique, GKs as well - just being a shotstopper nowadays isn't enough - GKs at best should be able to play with the ball as well and be available as 11th field player to give the defenders one more option to pass to.)

So IMO defending in the past and nowadays are actually two different things if you look at it, and thus I think the past way of defending has actually become obsolete.

I would also like to see so many so called great Defenders of the past who never played in a high line and were protected by midfield in a high line..