Was Carroll to Liverpool more overpriced than Ibra to Barca?

What is wrong with some of you people? It's like you just make up your own history and present it as fact.

NO MATTER WHAT Eto'o was gone from Barca, period. Pep wanted to get rid of him the year before and didn't and made a point to get rid of him after the CL wining year was out plus he was NEVER going to resign him.

You people who say they lost Eto'o or traded Ibra for Eto'o are just plain ignoring the facts. First of all they didn't lose Eto'o they got rid of him it was there choice mostly for non footballing reason's, and the fact they would have had to resign him. It may have been a bad choice but it was already made.

Barca were going to sign a WC striker and get rid of Eto'o no matter what and they thought they were getting Villa but Valencia backed out and they were kinda stuck with this deal because ETO"O WAS NOT COMING BACK.

On another note I still think Carroll can put it all together, he's only 22, and yes 35 mill was way too much but in the right system he could easily be a top 5 goal scorer in the EPL in the future he has all the tools.

Sepi wrote:No.

Michael Owen to Newcastle was the biggest rip off of history. Because he was finished by then.

Signing a 22 year old, who has time on his side, is never as much of a rip off as signing an absolute has been.

All in all, well done Andy for winning the penalty yesterday (though he missed it) and running his bollocks off to pressure Alex and Luiz and don't let them build the play up , and should have had another peno, but Dowd was scared to give it.


Bet he'll score the winner vs City in Carling Cup Semi and guide us to our first trophy since 2006.

Up Mr. Carroll, love the frustrated man

Wouldn't mind if we bought Colocini-Cabaye-Tiote in Jan just in an attempt to troll and butthurt Mole

2 different things though sepi owen was a proven talent and newcastle took the risk of buying him hoping he could regain that form as he still had his prime years ahead of him when they got him.

where as carrol literally had half a good season and use paid basically just as much as chelsea did for torres.

the differance is massive,chelsea bought a proven epl scorer,national team scorer which is the same thing newcastle did when they got owen.

for liverpool to pay that much for a half a season player was a joke.

besides liverpool fans are starting to sound like chelsea fans defending torres, ohh he played a great game he did this he did that all he was missin was a goal.

honestly iv heard the same thing over and over again.

carrol just like torres needs to start scoring goals simple as that.

and untill he does, he is a massive flop considering liverpool have never spent like that on a player

michael1 wrote:

Sepi wrote:No.

Michael Owen to Newcastle was the biggest rip off of history. Because he was finished by then.

Signing a 22 year old, who has time on his side, is never as much of a rip off as signing an absolute has been.

All in all, well done Andy for winning the penalty yesterday (though he missed it) and running his bollocks off to pressure Alex and Luiz and don't let them build the play up , and should have had another peno, but Dowd was scared to give it.


Bet he'll score the winner vs City in Carling Cup Semi and guide us to our first trophy since 2006.

Up Mr. Carroll, love the frustrated man

Wouldn't mind if we bought Colocini-Cabaye-Tiote in Jan just in an attempt to troll and butthurt Mole

2 different things though sepi owen was a proven talent and newcastle took the risk of buying him hoping he could regain that form as he still had his prime years ahead of him when they got him.

where as carrol literally had half a good season and use paid basically just as much as chelsea did for torres.

the differance is massive,chelsea bought a proven epl scorer,national team scorer which is the same thing newcastle did when they got owen.

for liverpool to pay that much for a half a season player was a joke.

besides liverpool fans are starting to sound like chelsea fans defending torres, ohh he played a great game he did this he did that all he was missin was a goal.

honestly iv heard the same thing over and over again.

carrol just like torres needs to start scoring goals simple as that.

and untill he does, he is a massive flop considering liverpool have never spent like that on a player

Some points I agree, Some points are not.

There is no doubt we massively over-paid, everyone who denies it is deluded.

However, It was apparent that Torres/Owen had their best days past them when they were signed for big money (No matter what they did in the past, they were long past their peak). So it doesn't justify their big money transfers either. Where as Carroll, still very raw, has his peak days ahead of him and is much more likelier to turn it around than the other 2.

I know strikers are out there to score goals, but it's not black and white. If you watched the game last night, the difference between attitude of Torres and Carroll was so obvious. Torres was walking like he is playing with his mates at the park and didn't bother playing until last 20 minutes, whereas Carroll pressed the hell outta opposition CBs, Held up the wall well, Won a penalty through his persistence...and had he scored his penalty, everyone would have said he played a great game. Scoring a Peno = Great game, Peno saved = Bad game ? I don' agree with that notion.

Both of them are flops right now that we speak, but considering will, attitude and age, Carroll is much more likely to turn it around than Torres/Owen (back when he went to NUFC). He just needs that rub of luck (Imagine what a hero status the lad would have got, had his amazing header not been miraculously saved by Hart). It happened to Crouch when we signed him where he went 18 games without scoring and missing penalties, but he bid his time and rub of luck was shown to him.


If in worse case scenario it doesn't happen, and Kenny thinks it's unlikely to change, he'll be sold and replaced by someone else. Transfers go wrong here and there and that happens in every club.

carrol's price tag was absolutely hilarious. in terms of what team (inter or newcastle) ended up with the better deal that's us for sure. also i'm pretty sure ibras price was closer to 50m (euros)... and we sold eto for like 27m. so effectively we got 50m for ibra and we were paid 27m to use Eto for 2 seasons.

but in terms of purely being ripped off i think they're equal deals. Eto was just too good of a player for it to not mean that barca were ripped off deal-wise

for 35 mil, in the short term, caroll is a joke of a player but if liverpool does well in the future, and he helps pool to big things, we might all forget about the price tag. ibra is the bigger flop. that can change though.

torres ftw though.

if anyone mentions coentrao ill give them a cookie for being stupid. lool

Sepi wrote:

michael1 wrote:

Sepi wrote:No.

Michael Owen to Newcastle was the biggest rip off of history. Because he was finished by then.

Signing a 22 year old, who has time on his side, is never as much of a rip off as signing an absolute has been.

All in all, well done Andy for winning the penalty yesterday (though he missed it) and running his bollocks off to pressure Alex and Luiz and don't let them build the play up , and should have had another peno, but Dowd was scared to give it.


Bet he'll score the winner vs City in Carling Cup Semi and guide us to our first trophy since 2006.

Up Mr. Carroll, love the frustrated man

Wouldn't mind if we bought Colocini-Cabaye-Tiote in Jan just in an attempt to troll and butthurt Mole

2 different things though sepi owen was a proven talent and newcastle took the risk of buying him hoping he could regain that form as he still had his prime years ahead of him when they got him.

where as carrol literally had half a good season and use paid basically just as much as chelsea did for torres.

the differance is massive,chelsea bought a proven epl scorer,national team scorer which is the same thing newcastle did when they got owen.

for liverpool to pay that much for a half a season player was a joke.

besides liverpool fans are starting to sound like chelsea fans defending torres, ohh he played a great game he did this he did that all he was missin was a goal.

honestly iv heard the same thing over and over again.

carrol just like torres needs to start scoring goals simple as that.

and untill he does, he is a massive flop considering liverpool have never spent like that on a player

Some points I agree, Some points are not.

There is no doubt we massively over-paid, everyone who denies it is deluded.

However, It was apparent that Torres/Owen had their best days past them when they were signed for big money (No matter what they did in the past, they were long past their peak). So it doesn't justify their big money transfers either. Where as Carroll, still very raw, has his peak days ahead of him and is much more likelier to turn it around than the other 2.

I know strikers are out there to score goals, but it's not black and white. If you watched the game last night, the difference between attitude of Torres and Carroll was so obvious. Torres was walking like he is playing with his mates at the park and didn't bother playing until last 20 minutes, whereas Carroll pressed the hell outta opposition CBs, Held up the wall well, Won a penalty through his persistence...and had he scored his penalty, everyone would have said he played a great game. Scoring a Peno = Great game, Peno saved = Bad game ? I don' agree with that notion.

Both of them are flops right now that we speak, but considering will, attitude and age, Carroll is much more likely to turn it around than Torres/Owen (back when he went to NUFC). He just needs that rub of luck (Imagine what a hero status the lad would have got, had his amazing header not been miraculously saved by Hart). It happened to Crouch when we signed him where he went 18 games without scoring and missing penalties, but he bid his time and rub of luck was shown to him.


If in worse case scenario it doesn't happen, and Kenny thinks it's unlikely to change, he'll be sold and replaced by someone else. Transfers go wrong here and there and that happens in every club.

well yea both torres and owen were out of form when they were bought but as i said they were both hitting there peak years so the clubs took that chance hoping they would reagin there form im torres case more so than owen i really did expect him to come back this season as did most people.

yes i do agree its not that black and white regarding strikers scoring, but there a difference between scoring every second or 3 game and then asisting in other matches which is fine, while carrol has literally just played decent but with barely any goals.

i mean basically its kinda like vucinic who isnt the most prolific scorer but who always plays a decent game and will chip in with an assist or 2 and grab the occasional goal which us juve fans are fine with,which at the moment carrol is barely even doin that.

he really does need to start scoring and yes he does have age on his side, which is why i can see why use are being so patient with him.

now i hope you dont take this the wrong waybut for 35 mill does carrol even have that much talent, ill be straight up personally i think liverpool panick buyed regarding carrol, they just sold one of their best players, fans obviously arent happy they needed to make a big signing to reassure the fans and who better than the young english player who is having a brillant start to the season in his first time in the top flight.

at the time it showed the liverpool arent scared to invest big if they have to, whcih for u guys wouldve been a massive show of ambition compared to ur last owners, but yea longstory short liverpool could of bought a way better player for that money.

but hey still early in the season well see if he can pick his game up by the end of the season.

Sepi if you bought Colo, Tiote and Cabaye id probably commit suicide.

michael1 wrote:

Sepi wrote:

michael1 wrote:

Sepi wrote:No.

Michael Owen to Newcastle was the biggest rip off of history. Because he was finished by then.

Signing a 22 year old, who has time on his side, is never as much of a rip off as signing an absolute has been.

All in all, well done Andy for winning the penalty yesterday (though he missed it) and running his bollocks off to pressure Alex and Luiz and don't let them build the play up , and should have had another peno, but Dowd was scared to give it.


Bet he'll score the winner vs City in Carling Cup Semi and guide us to our first trophy since 2006.

Up Mr. Carroll, love the frustrated man

Wouldn't mind if we bought Colocini-Cabaye-Tiote in Jan just in an attempt to troll and butthurt Mole

2 different things though sepi owen was a proven talent and newcastle took the risk of buying him hoping he could regain that form as he still had his prime years ahead of him when they got him.

where as carrol literally had half a good season and use paid basically just as much as chelsea did for torres.

the differance is massive,chelsea bought a proven epl scorer,national team scorer which is the same thing newcastle did when they got owen.

for liverpool to pay that much for a half a season player was a joke.

besides liverpool fans are starting to sound like chelsea fans defending torres, ohh he played a great game he did this he did that all he was missin was a goal.

honestly iv heard the same thing over and over again.

carrol just like torres needs to start scoring goals simple as that.

and untill he does, he is a massive flop considering liverpool have never spent like that on a player

Some points I agree, Some points are not.

There is no doubt we massively over-paid, everyone who denies it is deluded.

However, It was apparent that Torres/Owen had their best days past them when they were signed for big money (No matter what they did in the past, they were long past their peak). So it doesn't justify their big money transfers either. Where as Carroll, still very raw, has his peak days ahead of him and is much more likelier to turn it around than the other 2.

I know strikers are out there to score goals, but it's not black and white. If you watched the game last night, the difference between attitude of Torres and Carroll was so obvious. Torres was walking like he is playing with his mates at the park and didn't bother playing until last 20 minutes, whereas Carroll pressed the hell outta opposition CBs, Held up the wall well, Won a penalty through his persistence...and had he scored his penalty, everyone would have said he played a great game. Scoring a Peno = Great game, Peno saved = Bad game ? I don' agree with that notion.

Both of them are flops right now that we speak, but considering will, attitude and age, Carroll is much more likely to turn it around than Torres/Owen (back when he went to NUFC). He just needs that rub of luck (Imagine what a hero status the lad would have got, had his amazing header not been miraculously saved by Hart). It happened to Crouch when we signed him where he went 18 games without scoring and missing penalties, but he bid his time and rub of luck was shown to him.


If in worse case scenario it doesn't happen, and Kenny thinks it's unlikely to change, he'll be sold and replaced by someone else. Transfers go wrong here and there and that happens in every club.

well yea both torres and owen were out of form when they were bought but as i said they were both hitting there peak years so the clubs took that chance hoping they would reagin there form im torres case more so than owen i really did expect him to come back this season as did most people.

yes i do agree its not that black and white regarding strikers scoring, but there a difference between scoring every second or 3 game and then asisting in other matches which is fine, while carrol has literally just played decent but with barely any goals.

i mean basically its kinda like vucinic who isnt the most prolific scorer but who always plays a decent game and will chip in with an assist or 2 and grab the occasional goal which us juve fans are fine with,which at the moment carrol is barely even doin that.

he really does need to start scoring and yes he does have age on his side, which is why i can see why use are being so patient with him.

now i hope you dont take this the wrong waybut for 35 mill does carrol even have that much talent, ill be straight up personally i think liverpool panick buyed regarding carrol, they just sold one of their best players, fans obviously arent happy they needed to make a big signing to reassure the fans and who better than the young english player who is having a brillant start to the season in his first time in the top flight.

at the time it showed the liverpool arent scared to invest big if they have to, whcih for u guys wouldve been a massive show of ambition compared to ur last owners, but yea longstory short liverpool could of bought a way better player for that money.

but hey still early in the season well see if he can pick his game up by the end of the season.

Great points.

Of course there was some PR behind this signing, the plan was to pair Suarez with Torres, until the latter ruined everything.

American owners, 3 months into the job, selling Club's most popular player for 50 MILLION and not spending any of it? That would have been an absolute disaster for them. Shades of Hicks and Gillete.

There was doubt about them at the time, with the whole time the Negotiations for Suarez took, our initial bid being 13M and us trolling Ajax. We were 12th in PL table and many, even on this forum, predicted Suarez will be another flop from the Dutch league who'll be poor man's Defoe in Premier League.

Now with hindsight, you can look back and say, I knew Suarez will hit the ground up and running, and thus fans knew these American owners are genuine, so there wouldn't be a problem not spending any of Torres' money. Now that time has gone, we can say it, but at that time in late January, there was doubts over Suarez and The Owners' intent and ambition. We bid for Llorente for 35M, which was rejected instantly by Bilabo. That totally shows how desparate Henry was to make sure Torres' departure won't go unnoticed. Kuyt had 3 goals until that point, Maxi 3 goals. It was only after arrival of Suarez and his immense form that those 2 replaced Torres' goals and scored 10 more in second half of the season. There was no guarantee with that, and the management took the safe option that appease the fans, and bring the good-feel factor back to the club.

I feel gutted for Andy lad, who went from the local hero of his favourite team, a player who helped immensely in getting the back up and playing good football in PL, praised by Buffon at age 17, living his dream, to the most expensive British player in matter of 24 hours and due to selfishness of a certain Spaniard. He still hasn't got over the price tag, media spotlight associated with it and it's so obvious that he is trying too hard (truthfully obvious by him coming back to half way line to get involved and pick the ball up, yelling at the ref and fighting with Luiz until Peno is given, etc), but thankfully the will to fight on is there, unlike Torres. I am glad at least, he isn't hiding and he is taking responsibility. I don't expect him to be a super star, Big men (players who massive size) develop later than smaller man. It's a statistical fact, so we won't know how Andy Carroll as a player will b like until the next 2 years at least. He has time, and once he gets over his price tag, and gets a rub of luck, he'll be fine.

Immaculate_Mole wrote:Sepi if you bought Colo, Tiote and Cabaye id probably commit suicide.

No.

You'd make threads saying they are over-rated and shit and poor man's Perch, Guthrie, and Alan Smith

I was just discussing with Red possibility of buying Tiote in Jan since Lucas is out, and we need a back up to Spearing and what club better than our unambitious feeders to pick players from

Sushi Master wrote:

EarlyPrototype wrote:I think Barca's was worse because they lost Eto'o through Ibra.

Agree with this. No money in the world could replicate Eto'o. He'd still be playing if at Barca, IMO, plus you wouldn't even have needed Villa.

Correct me if I'm wrong but I got the impression that whole summer that Barca were looking to offload Eto'o. I always knew Pep wasn't exactly the biggest fan and I think the Ibra deal was a way for Barca to get rid of him.

Of course it could be a figment of my imagination during that summer, trying to justify the price tag + Eto'o lol.

im with you on carroll coming good, i do think hell be fine given a bit more time once he gets a few goals to get his confidence up.

but yea definantly money that couldve been well spent on someone else.

cant really blame liverpool for what was a panick buy i mean january is a shocking time to spend big on players, there always seems to be that feeling regarding janaury buys.

besides speaking of shocking buys i should know lol juve have been the kings of that the last couple of years loll the amount of money wasted is ridiculous

Ridicilously overpriced

The Madrid One wrote:for 35 mil, in the short term, caroll is a joke of a player but if liverpool does well in the future, and he helps pool to big things, we might all forget about the price tag. ibra is the bigger flop. that can change though.

torres ftw though.

if anyone mentions coentrao ill give them a cookie for being stupid. lool

Coentrao
Chocolate chip please :dance:

Though he didn't really fit in in the dressing room, he still kicked quite a few goals

Carrol however...

Wenger was stupid not to sell Bendtner for 20m to Newcastle in the deadlined day.

Carroll was a desperate siginng while Ibrahimovic was a stupid signing (trying to keep up with Madrid on big name signings lol)

highburied wrote:Wenger was stupid not to sell Bendtner for 20m to Newcastle in the deadlined day.

Carroll was a desperate siginng while Ibrahimovic was a stupid signing (trying to keep up with Madrid on big name signings lol)

LOL that people still believe that Bendtner BS it was just a BS rumor, when has Ashley ever bid 7 million for a player matter about 20 lol?

Immaculate_Mole wrote:

highburied wrote:Wenger was stupid not to sell Bendtner for 20m to Newcastle in the deadlined day.

Carroll was a desperate siginng while Ibrahimovic was a stupid signing (trying to keep up with Madrid on big name signings lol)

LOL that people still believe that Bendtner BS it was just a BS rumor, when has Ashley ever bid 7 million for a player matter about 20 lol?

Was it a BS rumour?

Not only in january but also you were linked with him in the summer so theres some truth in it.

Too bad, all that Carroll money went to Ashleys stomach

highburied wrote:

Immaculate_Mole wrote:

highburied wrote:Wenger was stupid not to sell Bendtner for 20m to Newcastle in the deadlined day.

Carroll was a desperate siginng while Ibrahimovic was a stupid signing (trying to keep up with Madrid on big name signings lol)

LOL that people still believe that Bendtner BS it was just a BS rumor, when has Ashley ever bid 7 million for a player matter about 20 lol?

Was it a BS rumour?

Not only in january but also you were linked with him in the summer so theres some truth in it.

Too bad, all that Carroll money went to Ashleys stomach

Again paper talk, he was never a target in the summer.........

The player's we actually wanted were Sturridge, Erding, Gamiero, Maiga, Demba Cisse, Gervinho and we tried to hijack Fulham's move for Bryan Ruiz......

Bendtner was never a target and neither was some others which the papers make up to sell papers.....

Carrolll is so limited as a player... his ceiling is very low, which is unfortunate for Liverpool. Forget age. He's just not very good technically and lacks pace. What you have with him is a player that is good in the air, can poach and provides a physical presence.

A poor man's Demba Ba lol.

sportsczy wrote:Carrolll is so limited as a player... his ceiling is very low, which is unfortunate for Liverpool. Forget age. He's just not very good technically and lacks pace. What you have with him is a player that is good in the air, can poach and provides a physical presence.

A poor man's Demba Ba lol.

Who we got for free

That tie's in with why we whether never in for Bendtner actually, Ba and Best are target men theres a reason we where after strikers with pace and movement because they offer something different to what we currently have.

Bendtner would just be another target man and a complete waste of time, the media have got no clue when it comes to our policy i really wish they would do thier research ffs

Our Policy is buying players 25 or under and on low wages and high resale value......

Anybody outside of that of policy is just not happening.

Raptorgunner wrote:

EarlyPrototype wrote:

Raptorgunner wrote:

EarlyPrototype wrote:I think Barca's was worse because they lost Eto'o through Ibra.

Giving up Eto for Ibra.

Sushi Master wrote:

EarlyPrototype wrote:I think Barca's was worse because they lost Eto'o through Ibra.

Agree with this. No money in the world could replicate Eto'o. He'd still be playing if at Barca, IMO, plus you wouldn't even have needed Villa.

lol we never gave up eto'o for ibra willingly
Eto'o wasn't going to renew his contract, so he was leaving us next season. And because of that, barca needed to buy a striker. Villa was the first choice, but valencia wanted more money so barca bought ibra..

Ibra is the one of the most grossly overrated players of the past 25 years. For a CF... he's only scored a total of 25 or more goals in a season once. That's right, just one time. His reputations far exceeds his production. And to boot, he has a crap attitude and is very lazy on the pitch.

That's a bit harsh. I mean sure he may not have that many goals but he's still Zlatan. I mean this massive guy jumps in the air and scores goals with a back heel.

Also he's won a league title every year for how long now?

Zealous wrote:That's a bit harsh. I mean sure he may not have that many goals but he's still Zlatan. I mean this massive guy jumps in the air and scores goals with a back heel.

Also he's won a league title every year for how long now?

He scores beautiful goals no doubt and makes very flashy passes and dribbles. However, in terms of production, he's nowhere near world class individually.

Zlatan is not a typical centre forward........

He gets 20+ goals + 10+ assists every year.....

If anything he's underrated.

Ibrahimovic hasn't lost a league title - Juventus' titles being revoked aside - since 2003, and in most cases he has been the vital forward in each campaign. His technique for such a large man is incredible, he's working very hard under Allegri and is a creative hub for any team built around him. Given that you haven't really given any comparison, I can't really respond to how unfair I believe it is, as we all have different conceptions of how well a player is rated, however Ibrahimovic is an incredible striker no matter how one looks at it.

Production isn't simply his goals and assists but the points he secures. I'd rather Ibrahimovic score or create the loan goals in three consecutive 1-0 victories than put those three moments of magic to use against a single relegation team. Same production, very different results.

When the pressure is on in the league, Ibrahimovic saves you, time and time again. There is no such thing as an arbitrary level of 'production' statistically for world class players.