Re: Luiz Suarez

by McAgger Fri Mar 22, 2013 2:53 am

Suarez assaults a woman Proud

I except all the British media to get on his back soon because of this :coffee:

by CBarca Fri Mar 22, 2013 3:06 am

"I don't care for the guy... I've always really liked Suarez"

What? lol

I should have been more explicit. What I meant was I don't care for his on field behavior.

As a player I've always liked Suarez though and as a character off the field he also seems like a nice guy.

by Lex Fri Mar 22, 2013 3:21 am

Bunch of Torreses in this thread Laughing

I'll take a broken heart over Eduardo's injury any day of the century. Not that I'd like to experience either, but if given the choice, of course

Come at me, Sepi and co. bounce

by Nishankly Fri Mar 22, 2013 5:57 am

Mr Nick09 wrote:Suarez is not good enough for Arsenal

Not sure if joking or serious.

by ExtremistEnigma Fri Mar 22, 2013 7:33 am

Suarez is easily in the top 10 players of the world at this very moment. And about not being consistent.. he was very consistent except last season where KK's tactics were horrendous.

by Raptorgunner Fri Mar 22, 2013 2:20 pm

How much is Suarz worth?

I would love to have him at Arsenal, would fit perfect at Arsenal. I think Bayren or City will pay huge money for him.

by Onyx Fri Mar 22, 2013 4:41 pm

Suarez is probably worth around 35m.

by stevieg8 Fri Mar 22, 2013 4:42 pm

Yohan Modric wrote:Suarez is probably worth around 35m.

I would be SHOCKED if Liverpool accepted a 35m bid for him. Not saying what he's objectively worth, but just in terms of what it would take to pry him, I'd expect something much closer to 50m. It's going to take a massive amount of money or a transfer request to make Liverpool consider selling him.

by The Nature Boy Fri Mar 22, 2013 5:02 pm

ExtremistEnigma wrote:Suarez is easily in the top 10 strikers of the world at this very moment. And about not being consistent.. he was very consistent except last season where KK's tactics were horrendous.

by McAgger Fri Mar 22, 2013 11:49 pm

SUAREZ YOU BEAUTY.

Carrying Uruguay on his back. What a volley :bow:

by RealGunner Fri Mar 22, 2013 11:51 pm

what a goal

by Onyx Fri Mar 22, 2013 11:52 pm

A vid of the goal?

by Swanhends Fri Mar 22, 2013 11:55 pm

Messiah "Aggerswagger" wrote:

This biggest thing that stands out in this picture by far is the fact that he's only scored one goal each against United, City, Chelsea, and Spurs

When other players do this people say they are only good vs poor teams tbf

by McAgger Fri Mar 22, 2013 11:58 pm

Bhends are you trying to say he's not a big game player??? LOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOL rofl

by RedOranje Sat Mar 23, 2013 1:09 am

Swanhends wrote:
This biggest thing that stands out in this picture by far is the fact that he's only scored one goal each against United, City, Chelsea, and Spurs

When other players do this people say they are only good vs poor teams tbf

No, people say that when a player has only scored once or so against all of those sides COMBINED. The fact that you intentionally left out Everton (derby, so big match) and Arsenal speaks volumes as well. Plus there's the unmentioned assists. And let's not forget the actual performances he's put in against United and others.

And before you claim you were just trolling, please have a glance at the rules.

by Swanhends Sat Mar 23, 2013 1:21 am

RedOranje wrote:
Swanhends wrote:
This biggest thing that stands out in this picture by far is the fact that he's only scored one goal each against United, City, Chelsea, and Spurs

When other players do this people say they are only good vs poor teams tbf

No, people say that when a player has only scored once or so against all of those sides COMBINED. The fact that you intentionally left out Everton (derby, so big match) and Arsenal speaks volumes as well.

lets not act like there is a giant gap between the teams I mentioned (which scored 1 goal each) and the 2 teams I left out (who scored 1 additional goal each).....4/50 - hardly a significant percentage to be speaking "volumes"

RedWhoreanje wrote:Plus there's the unmentioned assists.

RedOranje wrote:And let's not forget the actual performances he's put in against United and others.

The charts about scoring goals, and when forwards dont score goals, pundits and people talk about how the player is better against smaller teams

If, in your opinion, Suarez' lack of goalscoring is made up for by his contributions in other areas of play, thats a fair opinion....that image conveys none of that

by Great Leader Sprucenuce Sat Mar 23, 2013 1:22 am

Bhends leave it brah, if you say anything negative at all about Liverpool here even if its fair criticism.

You are A. a hater B. a troll.

by RedOranje Sat Mar 23, 2013 1:35 am

No, when you personally state that you hate Liverpool you're labelled a hater and I was intentionally giving him the benefit of the doubt in terms of NOT being a troll.

@ bhends: But Suarez as the creative hub of the team is judged on chances and goals created, as well as scored. His assists and overall performances ARE as important as the goals stats. And you can be as flippant as you want, but derbies are generally considered by most to be important matches, while Arsenal and Everton are both considered solid to good, if not top tier teams. Arsenal, lest you forget, has in the Champions League longer than Chelsea this season.

by Swanhends Sat Mar 23, 2013 1:59 am

RedOranje wrote:No, when you personally state that you hate Liverpool you're labelled a hater and I was intentionally giving him the benefit of the doubt in terms of NOT being a troll.

@ bhends: But Suarez as the creative hub of the team is judged on chances and goals created, as well as scored. His assists and overall performances ARE as important as the goals stats. And you can be as flippant as you want, but derbies are generally considered by most to be important matches, while Arsenal and Everton are both considered solid to good, if not top tier teams. Arsenal, lest you forget, has in the Champions League longer than Chelsea this season.

My point was not that Arsenal and Everton are not big games, my point was that even if you include Arsenal and Everton in the goals score...Thats an additional 4 out of the overall 50 - 8% perhaps not a negligible difference, but its not exactly a game-changer either

by RedOranje Sat Mar 23, 2013 2:06 am

Comparing goals overall to goals against "big" sides is a misleading and frankly meaningless stat. All that suggests is that he scores more against weaker opponents... hardly a shocking, or telling statistic in any way. A more telling statistic would be goals & assists to "big" games he's appeared in, and even that would be both misleading and lacking in analytical depth as it does not take into account other key factors in whether a player performs against strong opponents. The relationship you are attempting to establish simply isn't a statistically relevant one. At best such analysis is lazy and shallow, at worst it is intentionally misleading...

Suarez is NOT just a striker for Liverpool, and he's certainly not played only as a goalscorer during his time at the club. Even in the big games, ESPECIALLY IN THE BIG GAMES, he's been asked to play other roles in creating, harassing, and linking play as well as potentially scoring goals.

by Swanhends Sat Mar 23, 2013 2:14 am

RedOranje wrote:A more telling statistic would be goals & assists to "big" games he's appeared in

It would be.....but thats not the picture that was posted

redoranje wrote:and even that would be both misleading and lacking in analytical depth as it does not take into account other key factors in whether a player performs against strong opponents. The relationship you are attempting to establish simply isn't a statistically relevant one.

Questioning the use of statistics alone in measuring performance

Questioning the statistical significance

Pick one

redoranje wrote:Suarez is NOT just a striker for Liverpool, and he's certainly not played only as a goalscorer during his time at the club. Even in the big games, ESPECIALLY IN THE BIG GAMES, he's been asked to play other roles in creating, harassing, and linking play as well as potentially scoring goals.

If thats your assessment of his overall performances, thats great...but again, the picture I was commenting on conveys none of that

by RedOranje Sat Mar 23, 2013 2:16 am

Both criticisms are valid points, especially given the point you were attempting to raise.

by stevieg8 Sat Mar 23, 2013 3:19 am

In not quite 2.5 seasons, Suarez has reached 50 goals, and had 9 of those come in "big" games against top sides. I don't see how any of that counts against him. If you include his assist numbers in big games as well (the hattrick of them he got against United without scoring in his first derby comes to mind), his statistical influence in big games is pretty impressive on its own. Even if you completely ignore the argument Red is making - which would be a pretty limited analysis of Suarez's game - his impact against big teams is still pretty impressive.