Re: Are "Controllers" overrated?

by windkick Wed Sep 18, 2013 6:39 am

How about English since it's a English forum?

My first language is Spanish, my I should start writing in Spanish with a link at the end for Spanish terminology when I could of just wrote it in a langue everyone understands here

Smile

by Forza Wed Sep 18, 2013 6:48 am

I will use whatever word I want. Personally, I find regista and trequartista much more eloquent ways of describing a player.

For example, regista does not just mean any "deep-lying playmaker". It means a director. Whether they are in a deep-lying (defensive-midfield) position or in a normal central midfield position is not important. The defining characteristic is directing. Like a film director, they run the show, but they are not the star of the show. The regista organises the rest of the team, the actors, with their passing and movement. If premfaces don't appreciate that kind of subtlety then that's their loss.

Another reason for the use of these Italian terms is that these positions have traditionally been much more important in the Italian game than the English game. In the past, while Italian teams commonly had central players in their formations, the English game was dominated by the monotony of the now almost clichéd 4-4-2.

Lastly, as a keen follower of Serie A, it would make no sense to me to revert back to an English term if everyone else understands the Italian term.

by Blue Barrett Wed Sep 18, 2013 6:50 am

by Forza Wed Sep 18, 2013 7:08 am

^ Probably because people have no idea how to define "controller" and the premise of the thread is to assign a general rating to what, in my opinion, is a very diverse range of players.

by Kick Wed Sep 18, 2013 7:14 am

I don't think they are, It's what Chelsea are missing.

by emassy Wed Sep 18, 2013 8:01 am

jibers wrote:Trequartistas don't really exist anymore Gil so I don't know wtf you are on about.... Why would a deep lying playmaker need to score goals when he iss further away from goals and most registas are sitting in front of defences as well. Use your head ffs.

AMs are closer to goal so they are more likely to be judged on GS ability. Who said AMs have to control games as well? Never heard that before. I think you just made this thread to throw the two words trequartista and regista around because you're question makes no sense. Who is more important, a goal keeper or a striker....

it depends on the team and the roles.

trequartistas dont exist?? What of ozil,gotze? Imo, i prefer trequartistas but registas are common like alonso, pirlo, de rossi, xavi, e.t.c

by BarcaLearning Thu Sep 19, 2013 9:03 am

Didnt read in detail but anyway, watching Xavi come on for Cesc and immediately controlling the game and making assist, what a boss, a true 'controller' of a game.

by juvealbanian Thu Sep 19, 2013 3:07 pm

Trequartista and regista role players are NOT overrated.Actually they are the type of players who make the difference on the pitch and we have a lot of names to prove that: Pirlo,Del Piero,Totti,Baggio,Xavi etc.

by LeSwagg James Thu Sep 19, 2013 7:47 pm

emassy wrote:
jibers wrote:Trequartistas don't really exist anymore Gil so I don't know wtf you are on about.... Why would a deep lying playmaker need to score goals when he iss further away from goals and most registas are sitting in front of defences as well. Use your head ffs.

AMs are closer to goal so they are more likely to be judged on GS ability. Who said AMs have to control games as well? Never heard that before. I think you just made this thread to throw the two words trequartista and regista around because you're question makes no sense. Who is more important, a goal keeper or a striker....

it depends on the team and the roles.
trequartistas dont exist?? What of ozil,gotze? Imo, i prefer trequartistas but registas are common like alonso, pirlo, de rossi, xavi, e.t.c

Yeah I don't see how they don't exist anymore.. The definition given was an AM with no defensive duties? So if they're told to help out in defense it excludes thm from being called a trequartista?

Anyways I do think they're over rated, I don't see how one player can dictate the tempo of a football match.. If they want to speed up play they passing quickly, and if the don't they hold on to the ball or pass it sideways? Anybody can do that tbh

by El Jefe Thu Sep 19, 2013 9:37 pm

Surely it just depends on how the team plays?

by FennecFox7 Thu Sep 19, 2013 9:54 pm

Swagg wrote:
emassy wrote:
jibers wrote:Trequartistas don't really exist anymore Gil so I don't know wtf you are on about.... Why would a deep lying playmaker need to score goals when he iss further away from goals and most registas are sitting in front of defences as well. Use your head ffs.

AMs are closer to goal so they are more likely to be judged on GS ability. Who said AMs have to control games as well? Never heard that before. I think you just made this thread to throw the two words trequartista and regista around because you're question makes no sense. Who is more important, a goal keeper or a striker....

it depends on the team and the roles.
trequartistas dont exist?? What of ozil,gotze? Imo, i prefer trequartistas but registas are common like alonso, pirlo, de rossi, xavi, e.t.c
Yeah I don't see how they don't exist anymore.. The definition given was an AM with no defensive duties? So if they're told to help out in defense it excludes thm from being called a trequartista?

Anyways I do think they're over rated, I don't see how one player can dictate the tempo of a football match.. If they want to speed up play they passing quickly, and if the don't they hold on to the ball or pass it sideways? Anybody can do that tbh

Disagree.

Yes, one player in itself is not gonna help you completely dominate a match.. but these type of players can hold the ball under pressure and never lose it which is very, very useful.. not everyone can just "pass" it quickly.. look at xabi-khedira bro. xabi is a great passer but too many times he flops under pressure. you man mark xavi, he will still play brilliant.

by Clockwork Orange Fri Sep 20, 2013 1:09 am

Controllers are the true heroes of the footballing world. Players that have the ability to slow down and change the pace of the game are invaluable. As The Franchise pointed out, it depends on the tactical system being used. When Jose 'Catenaccio' Mourinho was at Real Madrid, Players where required to release the ball quickly so a controller was not as valuable to a team such as Barcelona. Any team that wants to play football stemming from the philosophies of both Michels and Cruijff need controllers. That is why a player like Xavi is 100x more valuable than Messi ever will be.

by jibers Fri Sep 20, 2013 1:42 am

Clockwork Orange wrote:Controllers are the true heroes of the footballing world. Players that have the ability to slow down and change the pace of the game are invaluable. As The Franchise pointed out, it depends on the tactical system being used. When Jose 'Catenaccio' Mourinho was at Real Madrid, Players where required to release the ball quickly so a controller was not as valuable to a team such as Barcelona. Any team that wants to play football stemming from the philosophies of both Michels and Cruijff need controllers. That is why a player like Xavi is 100x more valuable than Messi ever will be.

Are "Controllers" overrated? - Page 2 Is-this-real-life

by Blue Barrett Fri Sep 20, 2013 2:11 am

Clockwork Orange wrote:Controllers are the true heroes of the footballing world. Players that have the ability to slow down and change the pace of the game are invaluable. As The Franchise pointed out, it depends on the tactical system being used. When Jose 'Catenaccio' Mourinho was at Real Madrid, Players where required to release the ball quickly so a controller was not as valuable to a team such as Barcelona. Any team that wants to play football stemming from the philosophies of both Michels and Cruijff need controllers. That is why a player like Xavi is 100x more valuable than Messi ever will be.

LMFAOOO!

I get your overall point but you shit the bed with that last sentence. Relax. Xavi isn't even half as valuable as Messi.

by FennecFox7 Fri Sep 20, 2013 3:40 am

xavi didnt play and barca won 4-0 i recall :coffee:

messi didnt play and barca got raped by bayern :coffee:

by LeSwagg James Fri Sep 20, 2013 3:56 am

Giggity5313 wrote:
Swagg wrote:
emassy wrote:trequartistas dont exist?? What of ozil,gotze? Imo, i prefer trequartistas but registas are common like alonso, pirlo, de rossi, xavi, e.t.c
Yeah I don't see how they don't exist anymore.. The definition given was an AM with no defensive duties? So if they're told to help out in defense it excludes thm from being called a trequartista?

Anyways I do think they're over rated, I don't see how one player can dictate the tempo of a football match.. If they want to speed up play they passing quickly, and if the don't they hold on to the ball or pass it sideways? Anybody can do that tbh
Disagree.

Yes, one player in itself is not gonna help you completely dominate a match.. but these type of players can hold the ball under pressure and never lose it which is very, very useful.. not everyone can just "pass" it quickly.. look at xabi-khedira bro. xabi is a great passer but too many times he flops under pressure. you man mark xavi, he will still play brilliant.

They're useful yes, but Xavi/Piro etc don't control the tempo as much as people say imo.. They can boss the midfield but tempo depends on the team as a whole really, especially the whole midfield

by Le Samourai Fri Sep 20, 2013 4:11 am

I think it really depends on the team. They can benefit some teams, they can hurt others...it's all about bringing together players who complement each other.

I would never take Xavi over Xabi for us...he simply doesn't think about football the way most of our team does. If we keep passing into people and they have nowhere to go...they have nowhere to go. You pass to Iniesta and Messi...they make space.

Xavi is perfect for them.

by inter1lachen Fri Sep 20, 2013 2:17 pm

Art Morte wrote:ffs I hate it when people use these Italian words to describe positions... Either write your whole damn message in Italian or stick to English, thanks!

On topic: depends on many factors, the players and system the team has.

In music, would you complain about people using "andante" instead of the English "moderately slow tempo" or even the use of the Italian word "tempo" instead of "pace"? Would you complain about using the word "soprano" instead of "highest pitch voice" or "mezzo-soprano" instead of "half highest pitch voice"?

I think you have a prejudice, sir.

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