Gil wrote:When exactly was Pirlo the best midfielder in the World?

Gilvorak

cyberman wrote:just retire from international football like me.
I saw the team sheet and knew what would happen. Barry? Milner? Downing? Jesus Capello..

Cleverley on the bench behind that muck

Smallings invention and composure pushing up and supplementing the midfield is a must at CB ... but hes at RB.
Its ok for Utd, we have Rio, Jones etc playing...

You wouldn't have scored without Downing

Rooney was the worst player on the pitch and one of the reasons England sucked in second half since he didn't pressure their CBs....stop getting high every night amte

Adit wrote:English players doesnt take internationals seriously,thats why they sucks in int games,oh dont forget those crap coaches,including cappello

Capello has won you 2 Ligas and he is a crap manager?

He is one of the best of all time.

And you flog him for playing Downing who has been far more consistent then Young in his career and was one of Englands' best performers today.

I can understand Barry and Milner though

Arquitecto wrote:

Adit wrote:English players doesnt take internationals seriously,thats why they sucks in int games,oh dont forget those crap coaches,including cappello

Capello has won you 2 Ligas and he is a crap manager?

He is one of the best of all time.

I think he's being sracastic.

Capello is a moden day average manager

fact

Arquitecto wrote:

Gil wrote:When exactly was Pirlo the best midfielder in the World?

Gilvorak

I actually forgot Ronaldinho completely lost his form during and after the World Cup. So yeah he probably was around that time although Scholes was amazing in that period of time as well.

*waits for the inevitable English so can't be good logic from Adit*

Gil wrote:

Arquitecto wrote:

Gil wrote:When exactly was Pirlo the best midfielder in the World?

Gilvorak

I actually forgot Ronaldinho completely lost his form during and after the World Cup. So yeah he probably was around that time although Scholes was amazing in that period of time as well.

*waits for the inevitable English so can't be good logic from Adit*

Well said Gil.

Agreed.

cyberman wrote:Capello is a moden day average manager

fact

I like you so I don't really want to go the insult route but you have got to be kidding.

We'll just wait till the Euro's.

The mans a joke
Tactics = joke
Selection = joke
Man management = joke
Handling of captain issue = joke

We used to play decent football and go out in glorious defeat. Now were embarassing, slow and humiliating defeat

Hes the ultimate example of living off of rep. Only Sir Alex can get better with age.. the Giggs of management

Capello would be the Deco of management

cyberman wrote:The mans a joke
Tactics = joke
Selection = joke
Man management = joke
Handling of captain issue = joke

We used to play decent football and go out in glorious defeat. Now were embarassing, slow and humiliating defeat

Hes the ultimate example of living off of rep. Only Sir Alex can get better with age.. the Giggs of management

Capello would be the Deco of management

When did you ever play decent football and go out in glorious defeat

Sepi, I couldnt care if Downing created 23 goals tonight.
Im sick of nothing players having a decent game v average teams and living off that rep for ages. Its what I call Shaun Wright Philips syndrome
Ive watched Downing for years, 2 decent games for Lvpool and an alright game for England changes nothing.
Hey Capello, see how Rooney is tearing it up in 2011 as a no 10 surrounded by pace and passing players?

Why the fcuk would you play and isolate him up top with Fat.. couldnt play a delicate / inventive pass for 5hit... Lampard supporting him?

My head hurts

1990, 96, 98, 2002 (maybe) 2004 2006

Went toe to toe and bar 2002 (maybe) we werent outplayed like now

Hell, 1986 v Maradonna also, we went blow for blow with Brazil 70..

2002 England and 2004 euro England played decent ball. It went downhill from then on as the players became bigger than the team.

Why Terry Milner Barry Downing and Lampard start for England is beyond my understranding, these players are either past it or not good enough. As to their tempo, its just horrible...no other way to put it.

Tactics are old, same old stuff, get the ball pass it out wide, pass it back, nothing is done through the middle, no flair, no great passing, just boring tactics over and over...

They need to get Rodwell, Henderson, and cleverly in the side, also johnson over downing any day. Capello is an idiot...plain and simple

I agree with Cyber......

Capello is a joke for england he keeps making mistake after mistake iam not saying he was never good because its quite obvious he was one of the best managers around at one point but like Lippi imo he is past it.....

England need someone flexible tactically and who understands the players strengths and weaknesses and act upon it.....

Id play something like this in the near future.....


I Realise there's alot of technically gifted talent coming through but theres are the ones that are ready now imo, England desperately need a DM to go into this group imo which they are sorely missing Frimpong would be great but i hear he chose Ghana?

But anyway this wont come to pass until Capello leaves and England get a coach with a flexible and open tactical mind who understands the strengths and weaknesses of each player and obviously has to pick the correct players.

Unfortunatly it sounds like 'Arry is going to be the replacement

ManUnited4Ever wrote:Why Terry Milner Barry Downing and Lampard start for England is beyond my understranding, these players are either past it or not good enough. As to their tempo, its just horrible...no other way to put it.

Tactics are old, same old stuff, get the ball pass it out wide, pass it back, nothing is done through the middle, no flair, no great passing, just boring tactics over and over...

They need to get Rodwell, Henderson, and cleverly in the side, also johnson over downing any day. Capello is an idiot...plain and simple

What has Adam Johnson done to justify a starting place over Downing as a RW ? I'd really like to know. It's another curious case like "Rafael is top 5 RB"

Sepi wrote:

ManUnited4Ever wrote:Why Terry Milner Barry Downing and Lampard start for England is beyond my understranding, these players are either past it or not good enough. As to their tempo, its just horrible...no other way to put it.

Tactics are old, same old stuff, get the ball pass it out wide, pass it back, nothing is done through the middle, no flair, no great passing, just boring tactics over and over...

They need to get Rodwell, Henderson, and cleverly in the side, also johnson over downing any day. Capello is an idiot...plain and simple

What has Adam Johnson done to justify a starting place over Downing as a RW ? I'd really like to know. It's another curious case like "Rafael is top 5 RB"

He is better at football?

The Franchise wrote:

Sepi wrote:

ManUnited4Ever wrote:Why Terry Milner Barry Downing and Lampard start for England is beyond my understranding, these players are either past it or not good enough. As to their tempo, its just horrible...no other way to put it.

Tactics are old, same old stuff, get the ball pass it out wide, pass it back, nothing is done through the middle, no flair, no great passing, just boring tactics over and over...

They need to get Rodwell, Henderson, and cleverly in the side, also johnson over downing any day. Capello is an idiot...plain and simple

What has Adam Johnson done to justify a starting place over Downing as a RW ? I'd really like to know. It's another curious case like "Rafael is top 5 RB"

He is better at football?

Based on what? What are his assists/ goals last season? what about his defensive contribution, chances created, keeping possesion starts, etc. The same way NZogbia was better I guess May I direct you to this:

https://goallegacy.forumotion.com/t4553p18-official-n-zogbia-to-aston-villa?highlight=n+zogbia

The Franchise wrote:

Sepi wrote:

ManUnited4Ever wrote:Why Terry Milner Barry Downing and Lampard start for England is beyond my understranding, these players are either past it or not good enough. As to their tempo, its just horrible...no other way to put it.

Tactics are old, same old stuff, get the ball pass it out wide, pass it back, nothing is done through the middle, no flair, no great passing, just boring tactics over and over...

They need to get Rodwell, Henderson, and cleverly in the side, also johnson over downing any day. Capello is an idiot...plain and simple

What has Adam Johnson done to justify a starting place over Downing as a RW ? I'd really like to know. It's another curious case like "Rafael is top 5 RB"

He is better at football?

Not really Dani.

Johnson is like Arjen Robben but a poor mans version.

His repitoire includes running on the wing, cutting in, doing stepovers and fakes and shooting.

It works at times.

Problem is.... he does it all the time and is a one trick pony.

Downing is more intelligent, passes better, crosses far better, long range shooting and accuracy is better along with team and general play. I once or twice mentioned how he is like Beckham who makes up for lack of pace with intelligence and technique.

Downing is hands down better.

Dont need stats, seen both play enough.

There was a reason both where at Middlesborough together and one went to Man City and the other Aston Villa.

The Franchise wrote:Dont need stats, seen both play enough.

There was a reason both where at Middlesborough together and one went to Man City and the other Aston Villa.

He went at a point where city were nowhere near the force they were as well as being recognized as they are now.

Villa at around that time were a much better rated and feared team whereas City were somewhat of a joke.

No point Arq. Franchise thinks Song is a better DM than Lucas, despite even Arsenal fans (hell even on Arsenal Mania) admitting to Song's severe lack of positional discipline for a DM....he just doesn't rate our players. No point

And Downing had a broken leg when Boro went down, that's why many clubs were scared to take a risk on him, because they didn't know how he'd come back.

Lee Dixon's analysis on MOTD perfectly explained what he has brought to the club and how drags opposition defenders outta position all the time

Arquitecto wrote:

The Franchise wrote:

Sepi wrote:

ManUnited4Ever wrote:Why Terry Milner Barry Downing and Lampard start for England is beyond my understranding, these players are either past it or not good enough. As to their tempo, its just horrible...no other way to put it.

Tactics are old, same old stuff, get the ball pass it out wide, pass it back, nothing is done through the middle, no flair, no great passing, just boring tactics over and over...

They need to get Rodwell, Henderson, and cleverly in the side, also johnson over downing any day. Capello is an idiot...plain and simple

What has Adam Johnson done to justify a starting place over Downing as a RW ? I'd really like to know. It's another curious case like "Rafael is top 5 RB"

He is better at football?

Not really Dani.

Johnson is like Arjen Robben but a poor mans version.

His repitoire includes running on the wing, cutting in, doing stepovers and fakes and shooting.

It works at times.

Problem is.... he does it all the time and is a one trick pony.

Downing is more intelligent, passes better, crosses far better, long range shooting and accuracy is better along with team and general play. I once or twice mentioned how he is like Beckham who makes up for lack of pace with intelligence and technique.

Downing is hands down better.

Everyone has their opinion, im glad someone was willing to at least talk about the player rather then just throwing stats at me.

Now for me, Johnsons only problem is he doesnt play enough and with that comes some inconsistency and so forth.

However, while Johnson might be one dimensional (I am not sure I agree with that either) its not a diomension that is easily stopped. He is a game changer in the final 1/3.

Downing to me relies on percentage things, like crossing. Johnson can and will go past people and actually pick someone out.

For me, Johnson is by a margin better.

Arquitecto wrote:

The Franchise wrote:Dont need stats, seen both play enough.

There was a reason both where at Middlesborough together and one went to Man City and the other Aston Villa.

He went at a point where city were nowhere near the force they were as well as being recognized as they are now.

Villa at around that time were a much better rated and feared team whereas City were somewhat of a joke.

He went there in 2010, they went what they are now, but they were far and away better then Villa.

Sepi wrote:No point Arq. Franchise thinks Song is a better DM than Lucas, despite even Arsenal fans (hell even on Arsenal Mania) admitting to Song's severe lack of positional discipline for a DM....he just doesn't rate our players. No point

And Downing has a broken leg when Boro went down, that's why many clubs were scared to take a risk on him, because they didn't know how he'd come back.

Erm, what did I say Song is better then Lucas? Maybe like 2 seasons ago? I havent said a word about Lucas in a very long time so I dnt know where that comes from.