Re: Match Day Thread 19/20

by FennecFox7 Thu Jun 25, 2020 2:42 am

You guys needs athleticism. Messi is old but still scores and assists. It’s possible to build around him, but you cant do that with 30something year olds who also can’t run

by Harmonica Thu Jun 25, 2020 12:05 pm

FennecFox7 wrote:You guys needs athleticism. Messi is old but still scores and assists. It’s possible to build around him, but you cant do that with 30something year olds who also can’t run

19-20 Most Dribbles Per Game (Top 5 Leagues)

5.7 Messi
5.1 Traore
4.9 Saint-Maximin
4.7 Neymar
4.6 Zaha
4.4 Mbappe
4.2 Boga
...
1.8 Cronaldo

by FennecFox7 Fri Jun 26, 2020 7:30 am

The two things I don’t understand are the point of your post and who upvoted it. We’re talking team tactics and how to get the best out of Messi in his later years, and you show me a Ronaldo dribbling stat.. that’s like going into a thread about boxing and talking about WWE

One thing is for sure though, the cotinho and griezmann transfers were such a waste. Not a fan of Arthur but surely pjanic isn’t better then him

As a side note harmonica, I’m a fan of futbol and my national team first before any player, you’re really not gonna trigger me with that comment. We just think differently.

by Harmonica Fri Jun 26, 2020 8:30 am

Well you made it sound like Messi is only involved goal scoring, when he's clearly also the best playmaker in the world. Just wanted to correct that mistake, that's all.

by Myesyats Fri Jun 26, 2020 8:38 am

Messi is a great playmaker but he needs dynamic, young players around him. Fennec is totally right and your response makes no sense.

by Harmonica Fri Jun 26, 2020 9:14 am

Everyone needs dynamic players around them, which is why that was kind of a silly statement. Dribbling however is the only skill in football, which you can advance the game individually, and Messi is the best at it.

by FennecFox7 Fri Jun 26, 2020 10:33 am

Harmonica wrote:Well you made it sound like Messi is only involved goal scoring, when he's clearly also the best playmaker in the world. Just wanted to correct that mistake, that's all.

I didn’t make it seem like anything, you saw what you wanted to see from my comment. You’re responsible for what you interpret.

Messis off the ball movement is the problem, but my point is it shouldn’t be a problem. Normally, playing with a 10 is impractical in the modern game, but I disagree because

1. Messi is, like I said, an end product machine and

2. Requires strict man marking and still has potent ability to affect the game despite that

The solution is to do a 4-2-3-1. You can’t do that formation with busquets and rakitic. There’s also no side midfielders. Coutinho was an even worse buy then griezmann. He is the exact type of player as Messi but obviously way worse.

Griezzmann plays off a focal point just like Messi, but Messi can do it with or without a focal point cause he can dribble. Griezzy can’t. Braithwaite was the best attacking buy you guys had in the past two years, and that says a lot more about Barca’s board then anything else

Why not buy 2 athletic DMs who can play good football. Kovacic is one. Sane or mahrez as a winger. Even someone like Lozano. For striker, someone like Raul jiminez. Obviously not all of these players are world beaters, but they have pace, are team players and have good technical ability. Ziyech or pulisic. Etc etc. Sancho, aouar..

There are options but then they go and get pjanic. This guy is struggling in serie Zz. He will get run over in la Liga

by BarcaLearning Fri Jun 26, 2020 6:44 pm

Dembele was a proper winger that had so much promise, its just a shame hes always injured. Coutinho I think its fair to say most ppl didnt expect him to flop, since I personally was skeptical about him but I remember most thought he was a good signing for us. De Jong was a great signing, so is Griezmann for me even if hes not a good fit position wise atm, but too good a player to miss out. So the signings and perhaps u can say the board isnt all terrible and clueless like many are saying, but definitely agree, could and should have done better in areas like just buy players who are gonna play in their natural position, and players that would solve our problems in the positions where we are lacking.

by Myesyats Sat Jun 27, 2020 4:21 pm

what a genius goal :bow:

Suarez is back.

I kinda like setienball, it's much more dynamic than valverdeturd

by BarrileteCosmico Sat Jun 27, 2020 4:38 pm

Ter Stegen; Semedo, Piqué, Umtiti, Jordi Alba; Rakitic, Arturo Vidal, Riqui Puig; Messi, Luis Suárez y Ansu Fati.

Puig and Fati getting very deserved starts

by Myesyats Sat Jun 27, 2020 4:46 pm

I love how Puig immidiately makes himself available after making a pass. It's so simple yet we've been lacking that sorely and players were too static for most of the game

by BarrileteCosmico Sat Jun 27, 2020 5:49 pm

Seems like the league's over, bad wall placement

by Myesyats Sat Jun 27, 2020 5:51 pm

Griezmann could have just kicked that ball away, what a pleb

by windkick Mon Jun 29, 2020 3:50 pm

Not sure if you guys have noticed this, but on twitter there is a lot of news circulating that the senior players are pretty much done with Eder (the assistant coach). And that the players are also upset with how Setien talked about Arthur during a recent interview and are also upset at the board at how they handled the situation.

First thing first, I am OK with the players being mad at the board using Arthur like a pawn to balance the books. That's pretty wack. From a business point of view, there probably was little more they could of done at this point and they felt they had to do the move and clearly they didn't do it out of a "squad building" thing but out of a business move and if the players want to get upset for them doing that and not managing the clubs finances better so something like this didn't need to be done then I 100% stand by them on that. Because that's 2 summers in a row they do one of those swap deals to simply add a transfer to the balance the numbers. Last summer it was Neto and Cillissen.

However, if these bust ups between the senior players and Eder are true, and they are all mad at how he talks to them then wtf lol. That's a classic sign that the players need to go. You cant have the the players thinking they are better than your coaching staff, its just not going to work. You have to check there egos, and right now given we have so many players in the senior group (30-33 range) who have won so much they all feel like they know how to win and the coach doesn't and he shouldn't be talking to them like children. Reminds me of when Madrid was going through a similar thing and then they slowly moved out the senior players like Iker and co. In the end, the club won not the players. I'm not saying we should handle it like they did but think about the younger players who will follow Messi and co. How does this help the mentality in the dressing room? And right now, our club feels like they cant win without the players so they bends over to them. I mean you dont see Ramos and Benz doing this crap nowadays, its just basically them 2 and Marcelo and a bunch of new fresh kids ready to listen and play hard for the badge. Kids that are ready to learn. At our club, we have Puig who barely got his first start and Fati who apparently from what I read, Setien doesn't like and only plays because the board asked him to (he clearly prefers Braithwate over Fati and Grezieman). All in all, if I were the club I'd look at moving some of the older guys (anyone over 30 except Messi), little by little. But at this point you have a bunch of old players, not playing like the 200 something a week wages they make, so who's going to take them? That's why Arthur was moved due to his age and potential and Juve didnt take Vidal or Rakitic. Say what you want about Flo, but he knows how to build a team (not saying it always wins), vs at what Barto has done. The team is a hot mess and I feel bad for whoever takes over the following season.

by BarrileteCosmico Mon Jun 29, 2020 3:57 pm

Setien can't give in to that demand and keep any control himself.

Managing egos is the hardest part of managing a top team. The Club will always come down on the side of the players because it's much cheaper to replace the coach than the players, but I agree that it's indicative of a rotten core.

Also Flo didn't know how to build a team for like the first 10 years, just saying.

by windkick Mon Jun 29, 2020 4:27 pm

Yeah not saying I want or like the way Flo handled this either. More so I was pointing at the senior players currently having a massive ego issue and the manager doesn't know how to manage them. He is trying to coach a group of players that need a manager more than anything. I think if we had majority young players we would need a coach.

by danyjr Mon Jun 29, 2020 4:33 pm

Honestly, just let the whole thing die. I know it is sad and difficult to let go of the scraps you have, but you need to start from the ground up again. This incompetent board needs to die. This is Gaspart era all over again.

by Myesyats Mon Jun 29, 2020 4:41 pm

Is it Setien's fault or is the average age of starting XI being 30 the problem?

I would say it's more the latter, with Valverde there were also plenty of rumors that he "lost the dressing room"

by BarrileteCosmico Mon Jun 29, 2020 4:48 pm

It's always a risk when you promote a coach from a mid-level team who never had to manage 'stars' before.

by windkick Mon Jun 29, 2020 5:51 pm

I am not blaming Setien on this one as far as what he is fielding, not his fault he arrived and the team was already the way it was. But it is him and Eder to blame if they don't understand how to manage these level of egos on players at this level. He can be a tactical mastermind but he and Eder don't understand how to get the players to believe in him then its game over.