Re: Is Messi already a LEGEND ?

by billy_gr Tue Nov 01, 2011 11:02 pm

they did play the most beautiful football of the tournament nevertheless

by Highburied Tue Nov 01, 2011 11:02 pm

In Messi's defense in World Cup 2010.

Maradona (un)intentionally was a terrible coach.

by The Franchise Tue Nov 01, 2011 11:03 pm

jibers wrote:
The Franchise wrote:Wasnt Cruyff´s Holland mostly made up of the Ajax team that won the European cup?

Actually, that Dutch team was elite, the best team of the tournament. But lost in the final.

The best team doesnt always win, unfortunately.

No I think they where only like 4-5 players. Tha ajax team had disbanded, Cruyff was playing for Barca at that point. That team played some beautiful stuff, it has to be said.

Intresting. Either way, that Dutch team were great, I think most have seen the footage and they were unlucky not to win the WC because their play deserved it.

Sorry for going off topic somewhat, but lets be honest, its not much of a topic is it?

by mzamani Tue Nov 01, 2011 11:06 pm

ffs, just knight the guy already!!! well, a club legend for sure. as for NT, well, lets be honest here, he aint gonna win a WC but still he is a legend. whether he is surrounded by great players or not, what he has done already is enough for me. as much as i hate the guy and the club he plays for, its a yes for me.

by S32TABLANCA Tue Nov 01, 2011 11:08 pm

jibers wrote:
Saetablanca wrote:Id say he is the best player of the past few years, but not enough to be considered an all time legend. He really has to do something great, like win a World Cup. He is part of an already great Barca team, so he either has to take it to the next level (as wrong as that sounds), or just dominate for a bloody long time. Like, the next 4-5 years without anyone getting a sniff on him. Wont happen IMO.

Still a 'legend', but not worthy of an all time top 10 place.

So R9 is a legend for winning 1 WC then? Messi has been integral to winning THE HARDEST FOOTBALLING COMPETITION. He is breaking scoring records. Di Stefano, Cruyff and Puskas didn't win WC, are they not legends now?

Did I mention R9? Or Di Stefano or anyone else? Take your meds and calm down man.

by Seppuku Tue Nov 01, 2011 11:10 pm

He needs to win a legitimate CL, and do something with his NT.

ffs this flop couldn't even help his team to the Copa.

by jibers Tue Nov 01, 2011 11:13 pm

The Franchise wrote:
jibers wrote:
The Franchise wrote:Wasnt Cruyff´s Holland mostly made up of the Ajax team that won the European cup?

Actually, that Dutch team was elite, the best team of the tournament. But lost in the final.

The best team doesnt always win, unfortunately.

No I think they where only like 4-5 players. Tha ajax team had disbanded, Cruyff was playing for Barca at that point. That team played some beautiful stuff, it has to be said.

Intresting. Either way, that Dutch team were great, I think most have seen the footage and they were unlucky not to win the WC because their play deserved it.

Sorry for going off topic somewhat, but lets be honest, its not much of a topic is it?

They weren't unlucky at all. Unlucky is when you dominate a game and lose in the last minute. They scored and they started toying around with the Germans and got them wound up. There was bad blood between the netherlands and germany because of their history and the second world war. So they said they wanted the Germans to suffer. The germans got mad and the rest is history. The Germans are painted as villains but in truth they won on merit. The irony is that the beauty of that Dutch team lies in their defeat, if they had won they would not be as talked about tbh.

by The Franchise Tue Nov 01, 2011 11:23 pm

Yes, I know the story. Unlucky perhaps isnt the right word, but they were the best team in that tournament, for me and for many others and I like it when the best teams win.

Doesnt take anything away from Germany or their quality.

As for teams and players being talked about and remembered, it doesnt really interest me.

Everyone can remember every team and player differently, its just the way it is.

People want winning teams, then somehow the increases the merit of individual payers. Dont make sense to me. Judging individual players by team awards.

by jibers Tue Nov 01, 2011 11:24 pm

Seppuku wrote:He needs to win a legitimate CL, and do something with his NT.

ffs this flop couldn't even help his team to the Copa.

wow.

by Art Morte Tue Nov 01, 2011 11:25 pm

by Ganso Tue Nov 01, 2011 11:29 pm

highburied wrote:In Messi's defense in World Cup 2010.

Maradona (un)intentionally was a terrible coach.

is he going to use the coach excuse forever?

by Mr Nick09 Tue Nov 01, 2011 11:35 pm

He is one of the most talented player i have ever seen, if not the most, and it's not an exaggeration.

To me, talent wise, and based on what he did so far in his career, easily in the top 10 of the best players of all time.

The rest is a matter of achievements with the NT. Past that, he will comfortably be within the top 5 i think.

I never rank players across time, because messi today, wont be looked the same as the kid dominating the game in 50 years. THis is the Wilt vs Russel vs Magic vs Jordan argument.

I rank them by generation, and there is no doubt he is the greatest player of this era of football for now.

by harhar11 Tue Nov 01, 2011 11:41 pm

Ganso wrote:
jibers wrote:
The xcx wrote:Far as I know to be considered as a legend, you got to succeed in NT, something Messi has yet to accomplish.

Like Di Stafano, Cruyff, Laudrup, Baggio, Figo? This is ridiculous tbh. You people would say anything to discredit this man. Unbelievable.
not like they had a great NT....

And please dont say Argentina's NT is bad because its certainly better than most NTs from those guys you mentioned. bar Cruyff,and Bagio who was a penalty away from a WC in which he missed

Denmark won the euro without Laudrup, so its not like they were bad. Figo played for portugal when they had their golden generation. Di stefano played for Spain between 1957-61 and Spain won the Euro in 1964, I don't belive that Spain went from shit to champions in 3 years. My point is that if the NT that those players played for were not bad then so is the Argentine NT now.

Oh and great players =/= great team

by white_star Wed Nov 02, 2011 12:04 am

Cant be a legend while playing imo! Right now the best player out there without a doubt! If your going to use the excuse that messi has great players around him, well then he does, but so do the other top players!!!

by jibers Wed Nov 02, 2011 12:47 am

white_star wrote:Cant be a legend while playing imo! Right now the best player out there without a doubt! If your going to use the excuse that messi has great players around him, well then he does, but so do the other top players!!!

ryan giggs, del piero, totti, xavi, raul, zanetti, nerman.

by xabi Wed Nov 02, 2011 12:48 am

jibers wrote: nerman.

by Luca Wed Nov 02, 2011 2:35 am

He is a Barcelona legend for sure already.
Lots to do for Argentina to be among the greats though.

by jibers Wed Nov 02, 2011 2:38 am

Luca wrote:He is a Barcelona legend for sure already.
Lots to do for Argentina to be among the greats though.

Again like Cruyff? Like Di Stefano? Like Laudrup? Like Baggio?

by lszanto Wed Nov 02, 2011 2:40 am

Messi is a legend. If he opted to play for overpowered Spain and had won a WC would it be any different? No because all the haters would just find something else to complain about.

by El Chelsea Fuerte Wed Nov 02, 2011 2:42 am

TBH I'm thinking of going back from saying he needs to win something with his NT to be among the greats because he's just excellent.

by Rebaño Sagrado Wed Nov 02, 2011 2:44 am

jibers wrote:
Luca wrote:He is a Barcelona legend for sure already.
Lots to do for Argentina to be among the greats though.

Again like Cruyff? Like Di Stefano? Like Laudrup? Like Baggio?

cruyff's national team wasn't shit though

by Luca Wed Nov 02, 2011 2:47 am

jibers wrote:
Luca wrote:He is a Barcelona legend for sure already.
Lots to do for Argentina to be among the greats though.

Again like Cruyff? Like Di Stefano? Like Laudrup? Like Baggio?

All legends, all retired too
When its said and done he will be a legend

by jibers Wed Nov 02, 2011 3:21 am

MARADONA>messi wrote:
jibers wrote:
Luca wrote:He is a Barcelona legend for sure already.
Lots to do for Argentina to be among the greats though.

Again like Cruyff? Like Di Stefano? Like Laudrup? Like Baggio?

cruyff's national team wasn't shit though

But he didnt win anything, neither did baggio or laudrup.

by SaintJoe Wed Nov 02, 2011 3:30 am

Legends can't be 24 imo. But he'll be joining the rank of football legends, that's for sure.

by windkick Wed Nov 02, 2011 3:47 am

Seppuku wrote:He needs to win a legitimate CL, and do something with his NT.

ffs this flop couldn't even help his team to the Copa.

Probably the dumbest thing I have read on these boards.

by white_star Wed Nov 02, 2011 4:17 am

jibers wrote:
white_star wrote:Cant be a legend while playing imo! Right now the best player out there without a doubt! If your going to use the excuse that messi has great players around him, well then he does, but so do the other top players!!!

ryan giggs, del piero, totti, xavi, raul, zanetti, nerman.

Ya i consider them as players and they will be legenda when they retire but not yet its just my opinion.

O and def not neymar lol

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