The All Whites Thread

[MacPhisto/MirrorBallMan]

This thread is specifically dedicated to the New Zealand national football team, the All Whites.



RYAN NELSEN captain
RICKI HERBERT coach



Callups for June 2011 friendlies against Mexico and Australia

[Kiwigunner]

What do you think our formation should be, liam?

I think we need to ditch the 3-4-3 set up. it doesn't work well as a competitive side. worked out at first, but moving forward we need to be set out better.

What i want to see is:

Paston
Sigmond - Reid - Nelsen/Vicelich - Lochhead
Bertos - Christie - Brown - Brockie
Smeltz - Killen

[MacPhisto/MirrorBallMan]

What do you think our formation should be, liam?

I think we need to ditch the 3-4-3 set up. it doesn't work well as a competitive side. worked out at first, but moving forward we need to be set out better.

What i want to see is:

Paston
Sigmond - Reid - Nelsen/Vicelich - Lochhead
Bertos - Christie - Brown - Brockie
Smeltz - Killen

We need to think of the future. Our aim is to pick who will be the players we will rely on for Brazil 2014. Yes to Nelsen and Paston, no to Elliott and Vicelich.

In 2014 I'm thinking of

Paston
Reid - Nelsen - Smith
RM - DM - McGlinchey - Brockie
Rojas - Wood - Barbarouses

It could be Brown (34) and Bertos (33) could fill those positions, but I'd be against that at this stage.

I'm going to have my eyes on Henderson, Boxall and Fitzgerald for the next few years too.

[Kiwigunner]

Nelsen could well be out by then, he'll be 36. I think Brown could stick around, that could be his last year.

You think we stick with 3-4-3 then? I think it's too flimsy.

As for the young players, Boxall has impressed me too. Rojas needs more play time in the national team than he's getting so far.

[MacPhisto/MirrorBallMan]

Nelsen could well be out by then, he'll be 36. I think Brown could stick around, that could be his last year.

You think we stick with 3-4-3 then? I think it's too flimsy.

As for the young players, Boxall has impressed me too. Rojas needs more play time in the national team than he's getting so far.

Nelsen at 36? Considering he is our best player BY FAR, I have no doubt that he'd still be leading the way at 36 and then possibly call time.

3-4-3?

I think that if we played 4 at the back, we wouldn't have achieved what we had. With 3, at the back (and the wingers putting in their defensive dues) then it ensures that we won't be dismantled (with a full strength squad.)

Of course, the formation will change over the next few years as Ricki experiments and so forth. We really don't have a Plan B at the moment, though it's not necessary because usually we aren't that successful in attack anyway. Our strengths are our physicality and the ability to play far beyond our potential. So when you think about how useless it sounds playing with 3 target men in Smeltz, Killen, Fallon and Wood, it doesn't sound too bad because it's unique and a nice 3 pronged attack of big men makes the defenders have a bit of a problem to handle (what they lack in quality, they make up with brute force I guess)!

[Kiwigunner]

I agree he's our best, I don't think it will be form that would keep him out at 36, but he could retire from international duty by 34 or 35.

3-4-3 is tough on those wingers. They're expected to deliver balls in as well as defend well. I don't think it's the kind of formation that gets you small victories, because it relies on the wingers playing at 200% all game.

[MacPhisto/MirrorBallMan]

I agree he's our best, I don't think it will be form that would keep him out at 36, but he could retire from international duty by 34 or 35.

3-4-3 is tough on those wingers. They're expected to deliver balls in as well as defend well. I don't think it's the kind of formation that gets you small victories, because it relies on the wingers playing at 200% all game.

Well yeah, at the World Cup we saw Bertos being sacrificed defensively, and Lochhead was always playing left wing back rather than left wing (didn't do much offensively). I must say, it was never a "3-4-3", it was always a 5-2-1-2. We only relied on Bertos for the counter-attack and the front line were all CFs, so it couldn't have been a wide front line, it was Smeltz that dropped back into the second striker position. But that formation suited us due to it being impossible to do anything orthodox defensively (otherwise we could have been raped) and the fact we had 3 CFs as our only good attacking players with a 36 year old just giving them high, lofted ball by high, lofted ball. The only width we actually got was Bertos on the counter, and someone like Brockie coming off the bench in place of Killen. So the thing we must do is get rid of the players (reduce their game time) that aren't in our plans for 2014 and build a formation out of their strengths. Maybe we could employ a more orthodox solution some day, but the quality must be there for that to eventuate.

[Kiwigunner]

Yeah i think the way forward has to be a new, more flexible formation. Our issue i think is a very limited range of actual professional quality players, especially in midfield.

Defensively we're OK, and offensively we're stacked, but that mid is a real issue.

I'm not sure what the best solution there is though. we're pretty limited with our players.

[BarcaKizz]

Guys, just thought I'd say Rojas was bloody awesome against us last week. He's a great talent, hope he doesn't stall in the transition from A-League to Europe in the future like so many do.. I think he can be a good player!

He's going to Victory though... so me no likey...

[Kiwigunner]

Are Victory in the asian CL the coming year? if so i think thats about the only reason that transfer makes sense.

I can see him doing really well if he adapts to the defenders in the new league well. He's got the a league defenders sorted.

[MacPhisto/MirrorBallMan]

Rojas?

He's got potential.

What was the best thing for his career?

1) Stay with the Phoenix.

2) Get the hell out of New Zealand/Australia

Melbourne Victory? What a dumb move, he's ruining his career. Should've gone to South America or Europe if he wanted to really develop into a decent professional.

[Kiwigunner]

I heard something of a rumour that he wasn't happy playing on the wing and wanted a central role, which victory offered him.

Regardless, what i would have wanted was for him to go to one of the smaller leagues in Europe, like turkey, maybe netherlands.

[Kiwigunner]

OK maybe not turkey...

[BarcaKizz]

Really? Much better that he actually proves himself domestically before moving overseas. Tommy Oar made the switch too early for example. No point going overseas and playing no football...

[MacPhisto/MirrorBallMan]

Really? Much better that he actually proves himself domestically before moving overseas. Tommy Oar made the switch too early for example. No point going overseas and playing no football...

Actually, Tommy Oar is a good example. But what I'm afraid of is that Rojas might settle down in the A-League and have a long career here, which won't do anything to his development at all. He needs to have a shot overseas, then come back if he fails. It doesn't work the other way round, because even if he lights up the A-League a few seasons later, it won't matter because he's not young anymore and that's all he's got going for him. That and maybe some international coverage, in which he must do well on the big stage if he wants a chance. So hopefully Rojas does well at Victory and then leave them very quickly. And I do hope that he starts every match, otherwise he really would have botched up what could have been.

[Kiwigunner]

I don't think he needs more than a full season in the A league, and then work through a higher league. From his few appearances it is clear that he knows what he's doing, he needs to play at a higher level or the talent that he develops may not be useful - if he learns how to dominate the a league by 25 then tries to move, he'll find out that other countries play a lot better, and he could flop. If he goes now and does badly he can improve, and if not he can always come back.

[MacPhisto/MirrorBallMan]

I don't think he needs more than a full season in the A league, and then work through a higher league. From his few appearances it is clear that he knows what he's doing, he needs to play at a higher level or the talent that he develops may not be useful - if he learns how to dominate the a league by 25 then tries to move, he'll find out that other countries play a lot better, and he could flop. If he goes now and does badly he can improve, and if not he can always come back.

This, but more importantly- an attacking weapon who has lit up the A-League in the space of a couple months will appeal to overseas scouts- ESPECIALLY because he is still only 19 years old. It would be much different if he becomes twice as a good as he is now at the age of 25, because there will effectively be no hope for him left due to his age and the fact that he plies his trade in the A-League.

[Kick]

I never use ot Support the all whites but they have certainly Improved in recent years, And having played football in New Zealand for 6-7 years I know it's going to get better and better. I can't wait till the 2018 WC as I think we'll be a much stronger squad by then. (I'm from Wellington by the way)

[MacPhisto/MirrorBallMan]

I never use ot Support the all whites but they have certainly Improved in recent years, And having played football in New Zealand for 6-7 years I know it's going to get better and better. I can't wait till the 2018 WC as I think we'll be a much stronger squad by then. (I'm from Wellington by the way)

Well mate, it would be great if you helped us keep this thread going. And I hope you're watching the All Whites, it is your native country so don't neglect us!

[fatman123]

[beatrixasdfghjk.]

WHERE THE HELL'S KIWI BEEN?

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