Spain,the greatest ever NT?

rwo power wrote:

ACMRox wrote:

jibers wrote:They certainly are the greatest. Greatest =/= Best. Their trophy haul is unprecedented for a NT cycle.

EXCELLENT point.

Their success does not mean they are the best, especially when you consider their poor competition.

Especially as the German NT 1972/74/76 was really close to the same treble too, and still people always quote the Dutch team as the team of that era

LOL the germas were betetr than the Dutch. No comparison tbh.

England 66.

Surag wrote:Just my opinion ,might be a bit controversial but i certainly believe Italy 2006 would win this team ,maybe even Brazil of 2002.

Well, everyone is entitled to their own opinion...

jibers wrote:

rwo power wrote:

ACMRox wrote:

jibers wrote:They certainly are the greatest. Greatest =/= Best. Their trophy haul is unprecedented for a NT cycle.

EXCELLENT point.

Their success does not mean they are the best, especially when you consider their poor competition.

Especially as the German NT 1972/74/76 was really close to the same treble too, and still people always quote the Dutch team as the team of that era

LOL the germas were betetr than the Dutch. No comparison tbh.

They weren't as dominant as you think. It was a narrow but deserved victory, but all that was really needed was bit of dutch luck and the same success would be theirs.

Italy 2006 better then this Spain team...

Mother of god.....

Surag, you need to have a lie down

Jonathan28 wrote:Italy 2006 better then this Spain team...

Mother of god.....

Surag, you need to have a lie down

Well i didnt say they were better..

But hypothetically speaking ,a game between Italy 2006 vs Spain 2012..Italy would win !

Italy...Nah, I think they would encounter similar issues, their midfield was relatively weaker and though their defense was great, I don't think you can say they would beat us.

They were relatively lucky to get past Australia,got lucky again in the final after Materazzi got Zidane sent off....i wouldn't call them an amazing team by any standards.

Don't get me wrong they had quality, but they had their weaknesses and didn't really dominate the competition.

Brazil O2 is a different story, Ramos Pique and Busquets and Alonso would seriously need to show up.We would struggle against France 06 as well, Ribery would get at the fullbacks, Zidane and Viera wouldn't just let themselves be dominated..henry would pose our CS some problems.

I don't see Italy exploiting our weaknesses like those two teams.

I mean Arbeloa and Alba would get schooled by RC3 and Cafu....and as good as Busquets and Alonso vs Rivaldo and Ronaldhinio

Its not about the competition or how dominant they were..

I was just speaking tactically..I was just analyzing in my mind this current Italy and Italy of 2006 ,there's quite a huge difference.

Almost everybody in that 2006 squad were in their prime.Tactically they were on another level.

Hypothetically speaking if Italy 2006 played yesterday ,the game would've probably gone to penalties,maybe they would even sneak a win..Just my opinion.

You mean they would just defend better and hope for corners and penalties?

I could see it , But I think this team , tactically, (3-5-2) is much better equipped to deal with us than 06.

The problem with this team is that injuries meant the defense lacked quality....sub in Zambrotta and Nesta/Materazzi for Boucci and Abate and you have a whole different story yesterday.

But it goes both ways, no one on Italy 06 could replace De Rossi....Marchisio would be sorely missed as well, as would Balo.

Le Samourai wrote:Italy...Nah, I think they would encounter similar issues, their midfield was relatively weaker and though their defense was great, I don't think you can say they would beat us.

They were relatively lucky to get past Australia,got lucky again in the final after Materazzi got Zidane sent off....i wouldn't call them an amazing team by any standards.

Don't get me wrong they had quality, but they had their weaknesses and didn't really dominate the competition.

Brazil O2 is a different story, Ramos Pique and Busquets and Alonso would seriously need to show up.We would struggle against France 06 as well, Ribery would get at the fullbacks, Zidane and Viera wouldn't just let themselves be dominated..henry would pose our CS some problems.

I don't see Italy exploiting our weaknesses like those two teams.

I mean Arbeloa and Alba would get schooled by RC3 and Cafu....and as good as Busquets and Alonso vs Rivaldo and Ronaldhinio

Brazil 02? Is that a joke? That counter attacking team? The will not see the ball.

Counter Attacking teams do well against us precisely because they don't need to hold onto the ball for long periods to be effective....I mean...come on..simple football knowledge.

That and the fact that the crucial individual match ups are decidedly in their favor...trust me, I could see us encountering serious issues.

Well Spain played like Barcelona yesterday and frankly speaking which team they wouldnt dominate ?In terms of possession..(granted stats said otherwise yesterday but it frankly was a barcelona-esque perfomance all the way)

Yes i did mean that ,Italy would play the same way like they did vs Germany in 2006..

A defense was Zambrotta-Nesta-Cannavaro-Grosso is miles better than the current Italian defense..Yes its true..
and you talk about RC3 and cafu ,while Zambrotta and Grosso offered so much attacking wise in 2006.especially Zambrotta with his constant overlapping runs.

As for De Rossi in his overall play maybe you have a point.. But Gattuso as a destroyer >>>>>>>>>De Rossi,sorry to break it to you..and likewise you would've had a more agile version of Pirlo too..Perotta like Marchisio would've offered pretty much the same i.e relentless running.

In Camoranesi ,Italy would've had an extra attacking option along with his tactical astuteness.Totti is way better than Cassano too ,only thing that would've been missing was a technical striker like Balo as opposed to just a poacher in Toni.

Italy 2006 would've created much more chances as well.


vs


This game would go to penalties..

Lol..first off we can't predict something like..it would go to penalties.

I can safely say we would dominate the ball much more than we did yesterday, and Pirlo as the deepest midfielder would still be a weakness as both Xavi and Iniesta( more space because you replaced Marchisio with Cameronasi) would be given space to weave their magic.

No effective counterattacking mechanism down the left hand side to take advantage of Pique and Arbeloa's lack of speed.

An amazing defense, suffers a bit when you replace Nesta with Materazzi, can we break it down? maybe, we could always bring on Navas to open it up a little if we can't.

But I don't see that Italy matching up against us much better than this one, the defenders just have more quality...which in all honesty could be the difference at the end of the day.

And De Rossi is not a destoryer , the word destoryer is just a insult to all that he is. The modern Matthaus

Le Samourai wrote:Lol..first off we can't predict something like..it would go to penalties.

Just ask EarlyPrototype. I guess he could predict what would happen
(For reference check his points in the Euro Prediction League )

Le Samourai wrote:

Brazil O2 is a different story, Ramos Pique and Busquets and Alonso would seriously need to show up.We would struggle against France 06 as well, Ribery would get at the fullbacks, Zidane and Viera wouldn't just let themselves be dominated..henry would pose our CS some problems.

I don't see Italy exploiting our weaknesses like those two teams.

I mean Arbeloa and Alba would get schooled by RC3 and Cafu....and as good as Busquets and Alonso vs Rivaldo and Ronaldhinio

Exactly. Spain would have to play the game of their life to beat Brazil 02. And I think we all agree Brazil 70 and Brazil 82 were better than that team.

ACMRox wrote:

Le Samourai wrote:

Brazil O2 is a different story, Ramos Pique and Busquets and Alonso would seriously need to show up.We would struggle against France 06 as well, Ribery would get at the fullbacks, Zidane and Viera wouldn't just let themselves be dominated..henry would pose our CS some problems.

I don't see Italy exploiting our weaknesses like those two teams.

I mean Arbeloa and Alba would get schooled by RC3 and Cafu....and as good as Busquets and Alonso vs Rivaldo and Ronaldhinio

Exactly. Spain would have to play the game of their life to beat Brazil 02. And I think we all agree Brazil 70 and Brazil 82 were better than that team.

How do you know this? 'Tis all mental masturbation, unless you have a time machine lying around somewhere...

brazil 82 was more talented,but in a game between them,we would lose because of our crappy defense.02 and 1970 would win imo though.Pele and R9 would toy with Ramos-Pique.

Brady2Moss wrote:

ACMRox wrote:

Le Samourai wrote:

Brazil O2 is a different story, Ramos Pique and Busquets and Alonso would seriously need to show up.We would struggle against France 06 as well, Ribery would get at the fullbacks, Zidane and Viera wouldn't just let themselves be dominated..henry would pose our CS some problems.

I don't see Italy exploiting our weaknesses like those two teams.

I mean Arbeloa and Alba would get schooled by RC3 and Cafu....and as good as Busquets and Alonso vs Rivaldo and Ronaldhinio

Exactly. Spain would have to play the game of their life to beat Brazil 02. And I think we all agree Brazil 70 and Brazil 82 were better than that team.

How do you know this? 'Tis all mental masturbation, unless you have a time machine lying around somewhere...

This. The fitness difference Brazil would be gased in half an hour.

02 Brazil arent even betterthan the 98 team ffs. 02 couldnt dominate games so they sat back and countered and they are betetr than spain? get real ffs. Spain would have molested their whole team.

so 02 wasnt a good team because we used counter attacking tactics?

Brazil 02 dont stand a chance to beat this spain. they were very effective team but their defense was simply protected by the 3 man DM,their back line especially their CBs will get exposed against Spain easily.

Look at what Spain has done to Barzagli who according to many was best CB of serie A last year.Its not easy to play CB against this Spain.

They had a Roque Junior as their CB ffs. They were a counter attacking team totaly built on Ronaldo,Rivaldo and Ronaldinho.

Adit wrote:Brazil 02 dont stand a chance to beat this spain. they were very effective team but their defense was simply protected by the 3 man DM,their back line especially their CBs will get exposed against Spain easily.

Look at what Spain has done to Barzagli who according to many was best CB of serie A last year.Its not easy to play CB against this Spain.

They had a Roque Junior as their CB ffs. They were a counter attacking team totaly built on Ronaldo,Rivaldo and Ronaldinho.

The counter attacking play style is nothing negative.

In fact, the only teams to give Spain real trouble in the last couple of years have been counter attacking ones.

Rivaldo, Ronaldo, and Ronaldinho against Arbeloa and Pique? Good luck Spain.

The CB duo Pique_ramos FAR better than what Brazil had at that time. Good luck playing them against Spain attack.

Wow.

I don't even.......

We were unable to breakdown the Portuguese defense of Pepe, Bruno Alves and the fullbacks just 3 days ago....protected by relative trash like Mierles and Veloso...but we would pick apart....

Cafu-Lucio-Edmilson-Roque Junior-RC3
--------Gilberto Silva-Kleberson(Should be Emerson )
-----------Rivaldo-----------Ronaldhinio
-------------------Ronaldo----------------


They don't need that much of the ball, they can sit back and absorb our relatively impotent attack,and then they win all the matchups.

RC3 will rape Arbeloa all day long as will Cafu on the other end and then it's up to Xabi, Busquets , Ramos and Pique, to stop some serioulsly talented players.

Will they be tired? perhaps...but I'm looking at the matchups and they matchup with us far far better than Italy does.


Anyway, you're right all this is senseless unless someone has a time machine.

Khaled wrote:This comment is not fair to Messi...
When it comes to play-making abilities and vision, Messi is as good as Xavi and Iniesta...
This is why he's the most complete player ever... he can do both (finish and create)...

Yes perhaps. It was written in a moment of excitation and I can't claim it's completely logical. However I won't say Messi is as great as Xavi and Iniesta at running a game. That's my opinion and you and others could differ. Yes Messi is an outstanding player and the best we have seen in a long time. My comment was not against him per se. It was against this beyond limits obsession with how many goals Messi and C.Ronaldo are scoring each season. Frankly I judge a player's caliber and performance in ways different than simply looking at his tally of goals.

Guys, it's all about opinion and as far as mine goes I won't even consider brilliant teams who didn't win the big trophies - Brazil 1982, Holland 1974 and even Hungary 1958.

Now among those who won you all have mention Brazil 2002. For me no way. Yes those guys had fantastic attackers but those attackers wouldn't see the ball against Xaviesta. That team liked playing an open attacking game and such teams are bread and butter for us pretty much irrespective of how good they may be.

Then there is a mention of France 98-00. This one is a better bet due to it's defensive qualities but the defense and Zidane notwithstanding I think we are superior to them.

Then even better is Germany 1972-76. Now this one is a really tough one. Due to their physical qualities and not shortage of quality and balance they may be a tad bit better than us but it's hard to say.

As it stands the only team in football history who I will accept is superior to my team is Brazil of 1970.

Not wanting to start a long debate and certainly not trying to deride someone's opinion and/or start a fight. It's simply a matter of opinion.

i dont see how brazil 02 wouldnt be able to beat Spain with counter attacking football if Chelsea and inter managed to beat Barca (which is 10X harder because of Alves and Messi).