epic hairline

You can completely forget about ever having a pressing team now.

danyjr wrote:You can completely forget about ever having a pressing team now.

Been the case for years though

My question is where does Griezmann fit in now. Too many players occupying the middle so hopefully Laporta is on the lookout for a way out for the frenchman.

LW: Ansu,Dembele
ST: Aguero,Depay
RW: Messi

Quality wise Griezmann is still great in comparison to these other players but he's a mismatch and won't gladly sit on the bench either I imagine, and hes on crazy wages aswell

Wonder what happens to Coutinho too. Keep forgetting he's still on the team

Griezmann could go for a nice fee if he has a good Euros which is likely.

If Koeman stays, Dembele is gonna play RWB loooooool, with Aguero and Griezmann rotating I guess in the stupid 3-5-2. Otherwise then we will have front 3 Aguero, Griezmann, Messi bunching up even more than we have been in the past few years looooooool. Whatever the case it seems we are doomed again.

Still undecided on what to think about it.

What is his role on this team? Is it start one game every 3 and be a serious impact sub off the bench in the way Braithwaite obviously couldnt be?

If so, im relatively optimistic about it.

My issue is, what if Griezmann stays? If he picks up some good form and goes 3 or 4 games in a row scoring goals are we going to shoehorn him into the side, with Aguero and with Messi? Therefore playing 3 players with little speed, little dynamism and awkwardly playing in each other's small spaces?

What if Fati comes back and plays how he did before he left. Is Aguero fine with 20 minutes here and there? Can he and Fati play together?

I dont envy the coach, Koeman or otherwise, who has to figure all this out.

Myesyats wrote:My question is where does Griezmann fit in now. Too many players occupying the middle so hopefully Laporta is on the lookout for a way out for the frenchman.

LW: Ansu,Dembele
ST: Aguero,Depay
RW: Messi

Quality wise Griezmann is still great in comparison to these other players but he's a mismatch and won't gladly sit on the bench either I imagine, and hes on crazy wages aswell

Wonder what happens to Coutinho too. Keep forgetting he's still on the team

Griezmann could go for a nice fee if he has a good Euros which is likely.

Both the wings are non-existent. One side cant stay fit (jointly) for a single good season. Another is getting slower in every passing game. Bright future ahead

The Franchise wrote:Still undecided on what to think about it.

What is his role on this team? Is it start one game every 3 and be a serious impact sub off the bench in the way Braithwaite obviously couldnt be?

If so, im relatively optimistic about it.

My issue is, what if Griezmann stays? If he picks up some good form and goes 3 or 4 games in a row scoring goals are we going to shoehorn him into the side, with Aguero and with Messi? Therefore playing 3 players with little speed, little dynamism and awkwardly playing in each other's small spaces?

What if Fati comes back and plays how he did before he left. Is Aguero fine with 20 minutes here and there? Can he and Fati play together?

I dont envy the coach, Koeman or otherwise, who has to figure all this out.

Griezmann needs to go. Huge burden on the financial department, especially relative to his performance

Gotta free up that money to finally buy players that suit our style.

BarcaLearning wrote:If Koeman stays, Dembele is gonna play RWB loooooool, with Aguero and Griezmann rotating I guess in the stupid 3-5-2. Otherwise then we will have front 3 Aguero, Griezmann, Messi bunching up even more than we have been in the past few years looooooool. Whatever the case it seems we are doomed again.

The Dembele vs Dest decisions will be a sight to behold

BarrileteCosmico wrote:

BarcaLearning wrote:If Koeman stays, Dembele is gonna play RWB loooooool, with Aguero and Griezmann rotating I guess in the stupid 3-5-2. Otherwise then we will have front 3 Aguero, Griezmann, Messi bunching up even more than we have been in the past few years looooooool. Whatever the case it seems we are doomed again.

The Dembele vs Dest decisions will be a sight to behold

You forget about Emerson

What a waste of a signing.
Freaking Chelsea have won more CL's in the past decade than us. Let that sink in. And their team is nothing to write home about.
And yet here we are signing another one of Messi's amigos hoping he will stick. Why? Cause having Messi around on $150m has been oh so great for us. When will we realize that the tired lame ass pass to Alba for the cut back or the one two around the box wont work against the big boys anymore. It will work every alternate weekend against Granada (even that less frequently now) but it will be shown its place and we will be humiliated against the big boys every single time.

I agree alex. The thing is we don't have funds to do better this year. The revolution will happen, just not yet this summer. At this stage, with no money to properly reinforce the team, we would finish midtable without Messi. Especially with this defense.

You should thank bartomeu for that, we should have started the rebuilding process about 2 years BC (before covid), but he preferred to waste money on useless French players.

[Fernando Polo] Sergio Aguero earned 23 million euros gross at Manchester City. At Barcelona, he will earn 6 million euros gross with performance bonuses based on games played and titles won. He had a better economic offer from Juventus but he wanted to play for Barcelona

Myesyats wrote:I agree alex. The thing is we don't have funds to do better this year. The revolution will happen, just not yet this summer. At this stage, with no money to properly reinforce the team, we would finish midtable without Messi. Especially with this defense.

You should thank bartomeu for that, we should have started the rebuilding process about 2 years BC (before covid), but he preferred to waste money on useless French players.

I think we will still finish top 4 without Messi.
Busquets, FDJ, Pedri with Illaix, Wijnaldum and Puig(if he doesnt leave) off the bench. That's probably the best midfield in the league. And without Messi, we wont get overrun in midfield.
Defense. Again, we are underestimating the Messi impact on defense. Without Messi, we can implement a proper pressing game. Araujo, Lenglet, Minguezo. Thats a pretty solid group of CB's with pace, strength and athleticism. Dest/Emerson on the right with Alba at LB. Its not the best defense but pretty solid.
Attack - Assuming no one comes in. We still have Griezmann who is still a WC attacker. He was playing second fiddle to Messi. We could play the offense through him in the absence of Messi. We have Dembele who is injury free. Fati hopefully coming back. Aguero for the bench role.
Not WC. But certainly top 4 in La Liga.
I think we have a squad which should easily get top 4 without Messi. Dont see 4 squads better than us.

Myesyats wrote:[Fernando Polo] Sergio Aguero earned 23 million euros gross at Manchester City. At Barcelona, he will earn 6 million euros gross with performance bonuses based on games played and titles won. He had a better economic offer from Juventus but he wanted to play for Barcelona

Now we see the true picture emerging. Previously it was 5. Now its 6. Plus games played lol. Ofcourse he is going to play games. Who were they trying to kid with the Aguero signing on poverty wages spiel.

alexjanosik wrote:

Myesyats wrote:[Fernando Polo] Sergio Aguero earned 23 million euros gross at Manchester City. At Barcelona, he will earn 6 million euros gross with performance bonuses based on games played and titles won. He had a better economic offer from Juventus but he wanted to play for Barcelona

Now we see the true picture emerging. Previously it was 5. Now its 6. Plus games played lol. Ofcourse he is going to play games. Who were they trying to kid with the Aguero signing on poverty wages spiel.

It wasnt supposed to be "poverty". It was meant to be 50% less than at Man City.

Even with bonuses I doubt it'll go over 10m which is half of what he got at City (23m).

alexjanosik wrote:

Myesyats wrote:I agree alex. The thing is we don't have funds to do better this year. The revolution will happen, just not yet this summer. At this stage, with no money to properly reinforce the team, we would finish midtable without Messi. Especially with this defense.

You should thank bartomeu for that, we should have started the rebuilding process about 2 years BC (before covid), but he preferred to waste money on useless French players.

I think we will still finish top 4 without Messi.
Busquets, FDJ, Pedri with Illaix, Wijnaldum and Puig(if he doesnt leave) off the bench. That's probably the best midfield in the league. And without Messi, we wont get overrun in midfield.
Defense. Again, we are underestimating the Messi impact on defense. Without Messi, we can implement a proper pressing game. Araujo, Lenglet, Minguezo. Thats a pretty solid group of CB's with pace, strength and athleticism. Dest/Emerson on the right with Alba at LB. Its not the best defense but pretty solid.
Attack - Assuming no one comes in. We still have Griezmann who is still a WC attacker. He was playing second fiddle to Messi. We could play the offense through him in the absence of Messi. We have Dembele who is injury free. Fati hopefully coming back. Aguero for the bench role.
Not WC. But certainly top 4 in La Liga.
I think we have a squad which should easily get top 4 without Messi. Dont see 4 squads better than us.

Well I disagree. Mingueza, Araujo, Puig, Moriba, Lenglet sound to me like a bang average, midtable team. I dont particularly rate any of these players. We need proper strengthening before we let Messi go, that's for sure. Griezmann, Depay, Dembele up front isnt a guarantee of success either. I see it as pretty terrible and dire situation without Messi.

Who's the team that would leapfrog us?

Lets assume Madrid, Atleti and Sevilla would be better.

Villarreal, Betis and Sociedad are the only candidates right?

I am sorry, but without Messi, we are still far better than these guys. Its a shame he doesnt leave and we could prove it.

Pau Torres might be the only player out of those 3 combined would could start for us.

"Far" better? Barca has achieved 79 points this season with Messi scoring 30 and assisting 9. The next best scorer is Griezmann with 12 goals and then Démbéle with 6. Even if Barca press a bit better without Messi, goals will come from nowhere. Mentally weak Griezmann will melt if he were expected to take on the main scoring burden. Barca would realistically become a 70 point team and that's generous. Losing your only 30+ goals forward easily drops you 9 points.

Real Sociedad finished with 62 points. If they have a slightly better season and a real chance on top 4 in sight, they would be neck on neck with Barca for a top 4 finish. While Barca under such pressure of dropping out of top 4 would simply melt.

Pressing is overrated in league games. Barca has missed Suarez' goal threat a lot more than what Griezmann's work ethic has brought. Likewise Atletico gained 16 points on previous season with Suarez upfront who is pressing deadweight.

CL might be different. In those high pressure low-scoring one-off games you don't need a 50 goal a season striker necessarily and good team work overcomes everything but even then Barca has no chance in the CL, with or without Messi.

Also: Dumb signing.

Barca clearly emulating Manchester United post Ferguson now, signing the likes of Ibra at retirement age.

Even in their primes Kun and Messi never worked together. Literally another Griezmann.

There is no point bringing up stats about what those guys did or didnt do while playing with Messi and then using this to project on what they will do without him. Pointless.

Griezmann, who I dont even like, will obviously have a bigger impact without Messi than with him. This is not a knock on anyone, but its obvious. If you assume he could play better, add in Fati's goals and the possibility of goals from Depay, then I dont think this is a team which lacks enough goals to reach the top 4.

I also dont get this strange comparison between Suarez/Griezmann and pressing and non pressing.

Barca without Saurez and with Griezmann are no better a pressing side. It is not a matter of swapping out these two players and suggesting you will automatically press better.

Atleti dont use much high pressure, so Saurez not being effective in this area makes no difference to them. You use this obvious tactical difference and have inferred that pressing isnt important, which is a bizarre claim.

Alex point, which was obvious, is that without Messi, the team has a better chance of being defensively sound. Thats pretty much indisputable.

The difference is not pressing or not pressing, its compact or not compact. Atleti are always compact and we are not. Saurez or no Saurez for either side.

This was as far as I understand, a debate on the quality of the teams. Not something as abstract as theoretical performance.

Isak, Silva, Monreal, Mikel and Illarramendi are really fine players but sorry, they are not the level of current talent we have.

Apparently Agüero is now looking to cancel his contract because he was signed with the promise of playing w/Messi

Sounds like proper fake news.

Imagine he joins PSG