Let's quit pretending that this Atletico is still some scrubby team with average players that he's over performing with. Sure when he started with them they were that and he did overachieve.
But now these guys that play there are some of the best footballers in the world and many clubs would pay tens of millions for them. For the last half decade now Atletico has had some very good players but what have they achieved since the La Liga win?

Getting bent over 4 straight seasons in CL to the same team, at what point do we criticize his tactics?

I'm sorry I'm off the bandwagon. What a disappointing fraud.

Criticism can always apply, despite the success he had.

yes he did maximize the potential of his team but he also reached the end of a cycle because the style his team was playing cant be sustained for long long periods.

Early Atletico under him was a awe inspiring pressing Machine that would defend collectively better than any team. Well repeating those defending efforts is tiring and overtime they are not as sharp nor precise as they once were.

This season he tried to make the style of the team evolved with more attacking flare but still i can't help but think that it's hard for them to improve summer after summer as a team when they can't spend as much as other to improve their team.

I can never call him a scrub, it's just the end of a cycle and we can point multiple reasons to it.

I hope he goes to Inter.

Nick is spot on.

I personally think he's overstayed his welcome to an extent.

Winter is Coming wrote:Nick is spot on.

I personally think he's overstayed his welcome to an extent.

Do you remember what Atleti was like before him? The guy turned one of the leakiest teams in the top 5 leagues into one of the most solid.

And since when is finishing in the CL semis not a fantastic season for a team like Atleti? The very fact that he's being criticized for it shows the scale of his achievement.

BarrileteCosmico wrote:

Winter is Coming wrote:Nick is spot on.

I personally think he's overstayed his welcome to an extent.

Do you remember what Atleti was like before him? The guy turned one of the leakiest teams in the top 5 leagues into one of the most solid.

And since when is finishing in the CL semis not a fantastic season for a team like Atleti? The very fact that he's being criticized for it shows the scale of his achievement.

I don't mean to say that in a negative way. I just think he's done the best he could with Atleti unless he's willing to stick around and build again, but it doesn't seem likely he will.

It's similar with Klopp and Dortmund, all tho he was near regulation in his final season.

Winter is Coming wrote:

BarrileteCosmico wrote:

Winter is Coming wrote:Nick is spot on.

I personally think he's overstayed his welcome to an extent.

Do you remember what Atleti was like before him? The guy turned one of the leakiest teams in the top 5 leagues into one of the most solid.

And since when is finishing in the CL semis not a fantastic season for a team like Atleti? The very fact that he's being criticized for it shows the scale of his achievement.

I don't mean to say that in a negative way. I just think he's done the best he could with Atleti unless he's willing to stick around and build again, but it doesn't seem likely he will.

It's similar with Klopp and Dortmund, all tho he was near regulation in his final season.

What was he about to regulate?

Gegenpress to be a league wide rule

Cracking idea imo

Other than Griezmann and Godin... pretty much a pub squad imo.

let's not pretend atleti is on the same level as us, or any of these major sides. losing would be a huge disappointment for us, not for atleti. they've pushed far above their weight. i know some are just frustrated that we won this leg, and its not necessarily about what simeone did or didn't do. at the end of the day, players are the ones who play on the pitch, and their squad and budget are limited

Saul, Koke, Oblak, Yannick Carrasco, Felipe Luis are all very good.

All 5 walk into Liverpool, Arsenal, Spurs(bar Oblak), City, United (bar Oblak), PSG etc.

Saul and Koke would probably start for Chelsea as well over Matic. Even Carrasco over Pedro.

And Gameiro, Gabi, Gaitan, and Correa are all very serviceable useful good players.

Their squad is no joke whatsoever. Don't let the underdog narrative blind you to the fact that Atleti actually have very very good players.

Walking on to Liverpool isn't exactly an achievement...

Atleti's squad is on par with the Spurs or maybe slightly better. They really only have two players you would consider world class as I mentioned: Griezmann and Godin. All the other elite squads are full of WC level players.

No way. Spurs squad is miles better than this Atleti side. Spurs have one of the best GKs in the world, one of the best CBs, the 2 best English FBs, the AM with most assists in the top 5 leagues, the 2nd coming of Shearer, the best young player in the EPL for 2 seasons in a row now, etc. How does Atleti even compare? As you said they have just 2 WC players, 2 others that are great in Felipe Luis and Gimenez (who is injured), and the rest are from very good to below, not exactly elite.

Imagine going from De Gea to Courtois to Oblak

Oblak is one of the best CB in europe, Godin one of the most dominant, Gimenez was the next goat in line, and Savic is good too;Filipe has long been held a brilliant and complete Fullback, one of the best in europe; Koke is one of the game best CM, Saul is a great all around midfielder; Griezmann is often compared to CR and Messi, Carrasco is one of europe great wingers.

Euhhh they have a great squad, they easily compare to spurs

Getting Atletico to change their style has not worked as well as last season, and Atletico's bench has not responded or pushed the first team: Correa, Gameiro, TOrres, Gaitan, Lucas at times, even Gimenez this season, a lot of underwhelmed. Just the end of a cycle, and a squad not evolving as fast or as well as their competition in europe

Spurs are miles better than this Atletico side? That's an astonishing assertion. Didn't Spurs lose to Bayer at some point, a club at the lower end og the Bundesliga table. Lloris is one of the best GKs in the world?

I guess you were kidding. You almost got me. LOL

But, on the other hand. Atletico just don't have the depth that Barca and Real have. They had some key players in defense injured or not at 100% and no one to at the same level to replace them.

breva wrote:But, on the other hand. Atletico just don't have the depth that Barca and Real have. They had some key players in defense injured or not at 100% and no one to at the same level to replace them.

Okay so lack of depth explains why they struggle in La Liga to keep with barca/Madrid.

It doesn't explain why they are getting bent over in Europe 4 times to the exact same team.

They had their best XI out there today. And they got spanked 3-0. At some point it's due to Simeone's shitty tactical approach. I mean how can you not have learned from 3 previous times they beat you.

THis Madrid generation is legendary already for what they are achieving in europe. They are up against greatness, that implies they can get bent over

Okay they get bent over once. This team is legendary it can happen. Okay it happens twice. Maybe it just wasn't their day. Three times? What? Four times? gtfo.

Looks to me like Simeone has no clue what to do tactically.

Real Madrid is vastly superior personnel wise, its not anything to be ashamed of. Making two finals knocking out superior Barca and Bayern sides were great accomplishments that are being overlooked.

Don't call me James wrote:

breva wrote:But, on the other hand. Atletico just don't have the depth that Barca and Real have. They had some key players in defense injured or not at 100% and no one to at the same level to replace them.

Okay so lack of depth explains why they struggle in La Liga to keep with barca/Madrid.

It doesn't explain why they are getting bent over in Europe 4 times to the exact same team.

They had their best XI out there today. And they got spanked 3-0. At some point it's due to Simeone's shitty tactical approach. I mean how can you not have learned from 3 previous times they beat you.

Weren't they missing Sime Vrsaljko and Juanfran? Just asking.

Not only those two but also Gimenez so they had to go with a make shift RB. Anyway, I see James is forgetting Simeone had Madrid's number in the league for 3 years up until this season so between the league meetings, random CDR ties and the UCL, Madrid would have bound to figure out how to beat Atletico.

I wouldn't say tactically he doesn't know what to do but more say Madrid (or more Zidane) found a more stable way on how to beat or for the very least go toe to toe with them.

Atletico is about to go out in the semifinal. Any other season this would be seen as a huge achievement for them. The point where Simeone takes blame sure isn't at the CL semifinals. Bayern, PSG, and all the English scrubs aren't here, Simeone's Atleti is.

Their squad is good, but not good enough to expect 3 or 4 semifinals in a row and 2 finals in that time.

What blame lol. Without him these scrubs would be fighting for europa spot instead they are making to CL semis regularly.