That's not what i'm saying...  

You can project that Iniesta would perform similarly in different circumstances but you don't know because it never happened.  For Zidane, you know because he did perform at legendary level in different circumstances.

You can't discount Iniesta for it.  But you can't give him credit for something he didn't achieve either.  For Zidane, you can give him credit because he did achieve it.

And the fact that Zidane was the top player on all his clubs other than a handful of months is undeniable.

As an analogy.... compare Zuckerberg v Jobs.  Jobs not only founded and brought Apple to what we know today, he also bought Pixar from Lucasfilm for $10 million in 1986 and sold it for $7.4 billion in 2005.  He made CGI animation into what it is today to go along with his Apple innovations.  So although you can't question Zuckerberg's brilliance and you can guess that his brilliance would transcend Facebook...  it hasn't yet and maybe never will.  Doesn't take away from Zuckerberg's brilliance and maybe he is equally as talented as jobs.  But you're just projecting that he is...  Jobs, on the other hand, is proven.  So in my mind at least, Jobs > Zuckerberg.

sportsczy wrote:That's not what i'm saying...  

You can project that Iniesta would perform similarly in different circumstances but you don't know because it never happened.  For Zidane, you know because he did perform at legendary level in different circumstances.

You can't discount Iniesta for it.  But you can't give him credit for something he didn't achieve either.  For Zidane, you can give him credit because he did achieve it.

And the fact that Zidane was the top player on all his clubs other than a handful of months is undeniable.

As an analogy.... compare Zuckerberg v Jobs.  Jobs not only founded and brought Apple to what we know today, he also bought Pixar from Lucasfilm for $10 million in 1986 and sold it for $7.4 billion in 2005.  He made CGI animation into what it is today to go along with his Apple innovations.  So although you can't question Zuckerberg's brilliance and you can guess that his brilliance would transcend Facebook...  it hasn't yet and maybe never will.  Doesn't take away from Zuckerberg's brilliance and maybe he is equally as talented as jobs.  But you're just projecting that he is...  Jobs, on the other hand, is proven.  So in my mind at least, Jobs > Zuckerberg.

Yea so legendary for Juve that when Del Piero got injured Zidane was anonymous. Legendary level for Madrid? What are you smoking sports?

This is the kind of hyperbole I'm talking about when Zidane is mentioned

Zidane is not a Madrid legend. Can't pronounce myself on his Juve stint though

futbol_bill wrote:

Valkyrja wrote:Zidane is not a Madrid legend. Can't pronounce myself on his Juve stint though

??? Are you kidding me?

no. i don't consider him a madrid legend, probably due to the fact that his stint in madrid coincides with the worst madrid team I've ever seen and like the other galacticos he didn't do anything of note, except for that goal. his charisma propelled him to his current status.

i just found out the video about zidane's skill that media always didn't show before

people have a lot of time on their hands...not sure what that's supposed to prove

titosantill wrote:people have a lot of time on their hands...not sure what that's supposed to prove

its prove that zidane was not zero from silly mistake

in fact, its quite astonishing to have a compilation of 22 minutes of silly mistakes for player as famous as zidane who many rated him as top 10 best player in all time

what's quite astonishing is the desperation of the vid creator terming it "rare skills", that wreaks of desperation and an agenda. there isn't a footballer above errors, and any jobless person with time on their hands can go out and start fishing for every footballers mistakes and find something. maybe gaizka mendieta with his few turnovers is now better than zidane....stick to the riquelme praises, this doesn't suit you.

titosantill wrote:what's quite astonishing is the desperation of the vid creator terming it "rare skills", that wreaks of desperation and an agenda. there isn't a footballer above errors, and any jobless person with time on their hands can go out and start fishing for every footballers mistakes and find something. maybe gaizka mendieta with his few turnovers is now better than zidane....stick to the riquelme praises, this doesn't suit you.

don't be too defensive

every player is not free from criticize

even legendary like casillas, people made fun of him because of silly mistakes

Iniesta Ballon d'Or #2, Euro Best Player, Uefa Best Player
Zidane Ballon d'Or #1, World Cup Golden Ball, Euro Best Player, Uefa Best Player

Iniesta won more team titles, Zidane individual titles, both are overrated, although Iniesta less so. So Iniesta wins.

Both are overrated?

Iniesta win % in the finals tho

Winter is Coming wrote:Both are overrated?

Iniesta win % in the finals tho

http://www.worldsoccer.com/features/world-soccer-awards-messi-leads-the-way-as-barcelona-sweep-the-board-366880


2015 Top 10

17.2 Messi
13.0 Cronaldo
12.5 Neymar
10.8 Suarez
8.3 Lewandowski
4.5 Müller
4.1 Iniesta
3.6 Ibrahimovic
2.5 Pobga
2.4 Neuer

When was the last time AM was included in Top 10 with 1+2 in the League the whole year? This has been the case with Iniesta some time now. Zidane's WC Golden Ball is also the worst of the kind, and his goals at the end of NT competitions has stolen some of the glory of his team performances.

win % in finals is dependent largely on the team. besides the first final 2nil win over utd, barcelona have been head and shoulders above the other teams they've met in ucl finals from 06 till last year against juve. whilst juve where probably stronger than us in 98, it wasn't as clear a gap....and no disrespect to iniesta, but that gulf in gap wasn't particularly due to him. same for spain n netherland. its what bothers me when one goes "suarez (great player btw) scored in a ucl final, and henry flopped in his with arsenal", henry was playing against a much better team than his, and even without suarez, messi would have run riot on juventus all day, even if they had replayed that game ten times

Zidane was the leader in all of temas he played. Iniesta was a Top Player but the leader of the was/is someone else, although i think Zidane is more skillful than Iniesta imo anyways.

Harmonica wrote:

Winter is Coming wrote:Both are overrated?

Iniesta win % in the finals tho

http://www.worldsoccer.com/features/world-soccer-awards-messi-leads-the-way-as-barcelona-sweep-the-board-366880


2015 Top 10

17.2 Messi
13.0 Cronaldo
12.5 Neymar
10.8 Suarez
8.3 Lewandowski
4.5 Müller
4.1 Iniesta
3.6 Ibrahimovic
2.5 Pobga
2.4 Neuer

When was the last time AM was included in Top 10 with 1+2 in the League the whole year? This has been the case with Iniesta some time now. Zidane's WC Golden Ball is also the worst of the kind, and his goals at the end of NT competitions has stolen some of the glory of his team performances.

That's where legends are born though

Harmonica wrote:both are overrated, although Iniesta less so.

(:

What tito said.

Valkyrja wrote:

Harmonica wrote:

Winter is Coming wrote:Both are overrated?

Iniesta win % in the finals tho

http://www.worldsoccer.com/features/world-soccer-awards-messi-leads-the-way-as-barcelona-sweep-the-board-366880


2015 Top 10

17.2 Messi
13.0 Cronaldo
12.5 Neymar
10.8 Suarez
8.3 Lewandowski
4.5 Müller
4.1 Iniesta
3.6 Ibrahimovic
2.5 Pobga
2.4 Neuer

When was the last time AM was included in Top 10 with 1+2 in the League the whole year? This has been the case with Iniesta some time now. Zidane's WC Golden Ball is also the worst of the kind, and his goals at the end of NT competitions has stolen some of the glory of his team performances.

That's where legends are born though

Or myths.

Harmonica wrote:

Valkyrja wrote:

Harmonica wrote:
http://www.worldsoccer.com/features/world-soccer-awards-messi-leads-the-way-as-barcelona-sweep-the-board-366880


2015 Top 10

17.2 Messi
13.0 Cronaldo
12.5 Neymar
10.8 Suarez
8.3 Lewandowski
4.5 Müller
4.1 Iniesta
3.6 Ibrahimovic
2.5 Pobga
2.4 Neuer

When was the last time AM was included in Top 10 with 1+2 in the League the whole year? This has been the case with Iniesta some time now. Zidane's WC Golden Ball is also the worst of the kind, and his goals at the end of NT competitions has stolen some of the glory of his team performances.

That's where legends are born though

Or myths.

Valkyrja wrote:

Harmonica wrote:

Valkyrja wrote:

That's where legends are born though

Or myths.

Great example, Messi carried Argentina to the final and lost all the credit there, France carried Zidane to final where he stole all the credit.

Who cares? Even if that were true, winning trumps everything. Nobody remembers the losers

People with honesty, integrity and logic do. That's what matters, who cares what casual fans remember?

Zidane is ovverated because he is put in the same league as Cruijff, Pele and Di Stefano and Messi. Anyone with sense and is unbiased can see he is not on that level. Does nothing for 10 games, traps the ball elegantly and people wax lyrical about it for 7 years.

Dat GOAT (:

Harmonica wrote:People with honesty, integrity and logic do. That's what matters, who cares what casual fans remember?

It's a spectator sport

Valkyrja wrote:

Harmonica wrote:People with honesty, integrity and logic do. That's what matters, who cares what casual fans remember?

It's a spectator sport

Remember when you used to claim CR was better than Messi, what changed your mind?