I doubt if Mourinho can't be a long term manager for Madrid any other coach can, he's already lasted longer than any other manager at the club in the last decade.

I enjoy seeing the team win trophies, and so far so good, Real Madrid is winning trophies, at the end of the season we may have won the CL and CDR double and finished second in la liga, that would be one of the most successful seasons in the clubs history.

EDIT: Just checked on Wikipedia, only three managers in the History of Real Madrid have played more competitive matches than Jose Mourinho. He's also the longest serving manager presently in la liga - Patience

buddytaller wrote:
I enjoy seeing the team win trophies, and so far so good, Real Madrid is winning trophies, at the end of the season we may have won the CL and CDR double and finished second in la liga, that would be one of the most successful seasons in the clubs history.

seriously how possible do you think this scenario is based on your current form?

you really have to be ignorant to believe a manager with the titles that mourinho has won can be a average manager

Perez is being patient with Mourinho because he appointed him for the trophies etc. Otherwise I'm sure in the long term Perez wants better youth development, good style of play, good relationship with the fans, backroom staff etc etc.

Se7en wrote:you really have to be ignorant to believe a manager with the titles that mourinho has won can be a average manager

Clearly he's on a decline

Mr Nick09 wrote:attractive football? we played attractive football for a month and a half, the rest of the season, we were just ridiculously efficient. We were coming short in many games last season already, but we were able to score 2 or 3 to get away with the win.

there is no depth in the way we play, hence why we struggle. The monster was due to our efficient and thirst to beat barcelona. we did beat them, it's time to move on. He compensated his inaptitude to build a balanced system with our desire to overcome barcelona, but now that we did, there is nothing left.

Absolute nonsense.

1- He transformed Madrid into a team who beat Barcelona fair and square after being their little bitch for 3 years.
2- He won La Liga with 100 points, displaying attacking massacre.
3- He got the team to CL semis after how many years?

And you say it is all down to some magical efficiency

Give credit when it is due. This season he's finished and should be shown the door, but taking away the credit for what he did last year is absurd, period.

Off-topic: I can also say Barcelona weren't the same team last year, simply because Guardiola could not motivate his players any more (as Mourinho is experiencing the same problem now). The players just didn't give any more. How Sir Alex does it season after season shits on my understanding of football and psychology indeed. #MoyesForUnited #NotPep #NotMou

Se7en wrote:you really have to be ignorant to believe a manager with the titles that mourinho has won can be a average manager

yeah, and you need not to be a genius to understand what i am talking about. Mourinho is clearly good at doing something, otherwise he wouldnt have achieved so much. He is a genius motivator, mediocre tactician, team builder etc... this isnt about whether he can win or not, Di Matteo won a CL ffs

danyjr wrote:
Absolute nonsense.

1- He transformed Madrid into a team who beat Barcelona fair and square after being their little bitch for 3 years.
2- He won La Liga with 100 points, displaying attacking massacre.
3- He got the team to CL semis after how many years?

And you say it is all down to some magical efficiency

Give credit when it is due. This season he's finished and should be shown the door, but taking away the credit for what he did last year is absurd, period.

i give credit to his incredible ability to motivate and to inspire, to find things around a group can rally around and fight for a united cause. That's mourinho's genius. It overcomes any kind of shortcoming you have and lead you to victory. Unfortunately, it's not sustainable over a long period of time.

1. as a barca fan you should recognize that the clasicos are games on their own. It's about spirit even more than it's about tactic. It's about how much running and effort you will lay on the pitch. And that's how mourinho got us to beat you, after xxxxx trials, spirit.

2. Again, winning the league with 100 or so isnt that incredible to me, even Pelligrini got up there in his first season alone. Winning =/= to playing well, and i have seen plenty of examples of that last season.

3. Success in CL? i didnt say he is a bad manager and achieved nothing with madrid. I said he is a mediocre tactician whose tactical deficiencies are exposed when he cant overpower opponents with talent. Refer to bayern, refer to dortmund, refer to barca and even refer to city.

danyjr wrote:

Mr Nick09 wrote:attractive football? we played attractive football for a month and a half, the rest of the season, we were just ridiculously efficient. We were coming short in many games last season already, but we were able to score 2 or 3 to get away with the win.

there is no depth in the way we play, hence why we struggle. The monster was due to our efficient and thirst to beat barcelona. we did beat them, it's time to move on. He compensated his inaptitude to build a balanced system with our desire to overcome barcelona, but now that we did, there is nothing left.

Absolute nonsense.

1- He transformed Madrid into a team who beat Barcelona fair and square after being their little bitch for 3 years.
2- He won La Liga with 100 points, displaying attacking massacre.
3- He got the team to CL semis after how many years?

And you say it is all down to some magical efficiency

Give credit when it is due. This season he's finished and should be shown the door, but taking away the credit for what he did last year is absurd, period.

Off-topic: I can also say Barcelona weren't the same team last year, simply because Guardiola could not motivate his players any more (as Mourinho is experiencing the same problem now). The players just didn't give any more. How Sir Alex does it season after season shits on my understanding of football and psychology indeed. #MoyesForUnited #NotPep #NotMou

No offense man but what in the hell are you and the French guy talking about Madrid and Mou beating Barcelona last year?

They basically played to a draw. Just because he avoided total domination and humiliation to the point he had to blame officials, UEFA, other La Liga coaches like every other year you guys think he made some formula to beat Barcelona, that's total nonsense.

If you look at the games they played last year both teams won and lost the same amount of games and then drew the same amount against each other and that was the total best Mou could do while he has been at Madrid in the other years Pep didn't just beat him because he had Messi or a much better team but he gave him a managing lesson.

Pep's record against Mou at Madrid is a joke and total domination and it's because of what Nick is saying he knows exactly what Mou is going to do every gamenot just because he had Messi like the popular theory is by the young kids on here.

And I said this in another thread, stop with this whole 100 point thing acting like he did some incredible job to accomplish that.

Barca and Madrid had been playing to that capacity for years before that. Barca had a season to 98 and the coach Mou is so much better then Pellegrini the year he got fired putting all the dirty work he had to do mixing all the new players together (which he wasn't allowed to hand pick like Mou) played to 97 points.

Last year was the first year Mou actually earned a pay check while at Madrid and he's doing it all with one of the most talented/expensive teams in the history of the sport.

He's not winning anything this year I told some of you guys this in another thread, can't you see the team has quit on him and he on the team? Benching Casillas was basically him trying to get fired and his last chance to childishly exert his authority on the Spanish players one last time before he leave our beautiful league and hopefully never comes back again.

And believe me, Perez didn't pay all that money and ruin the clubs image for a Copa Del Rey and a La Liga title in three years. Others have been fired for seasons like this.

This ^^^^^^

Mou equaled Pep's Barca at best, he never really beat Pep, considering the humiliation Pep has done to Mou's Real.

OLpower wrote:Mourinho built a monster Madrid last season, don't forget it.

Record number of point, record number of goal scored, strong and attractive football, owning of Barcelona, semi final of CL , Liga title.

Greatest manager ever

OLpower wrote:Mourinho built a monster Madrid last season, don't forget it.

Record number of point, record number of goal scored, strong and attractive football, owning of Barcelona, semi final of CL , Liga title.

nobody lives in the past... and especially team like Real Madrid. this is the club that lives on good form, wins, and trophies. its simply not happening under mourinho.

now even players and fans have problem with him...

actually madrid was very good under pellegrini

Dnmac4 wrote:

danyjr wrote:

Mr Nick09 wrote:attractive football? we played attractive football for a month and a half, the rest of the season, we were just ridiculously efficient. We were coming short in many games last season already, but we were able to score 2 or 3 to get away with the win.

there is no depth in the way we play, hence why we struggle. The monster was due to our efficient and thirst to beat barcelona. we did beat them, it's time to move on. He compensated his inaptitude to build a balanced system with our desire to overcome barcelona, but now that we did, there is nothing left.

Absolute nonsense.

1- He transformed Madrid into a team who beat Barcelona fair and square after being their little bitch for 3 years.
2- He won La Liga with 100 points, displaying attacking massacre.
3- He got the team to CL semis after how many years?

And you say it is all down to some magical efficiency

Give credit when it is due. This season he's finished and should be shown the door, but taking away the credit for what he did last year is absurd, period.

Off-topic: I can also say Barcelona weren't the same team last year, simply because Guardiola could not motivate his players any more (as Mourinho is experiencing the same problem now). The players just didn't give any more. How Sir Alex does it season after season shits on my understanding of football and psychology indeed. #MoyesForUnited #NotPep #NotMou

No offense man but what in the hell are you and the French guy talking about Madrid and Mou beating Barcelona last year?

They basically played to a draw. Just because he avoided total domination and humiliation to the point he had to blame officials, UEFA, other La Liga coaches like every other year you guys think he made some formula to beat Barcelona, that's total nonsense.

If you look at the games they played last year both teams won and lost the same amount of games and then drew the same amount against each other and that was the total best Mou could do while he has been at Madrid in the other years Pep didn't just beat him because he had Messi or a much better team but he gave him a managing lesson.

Pep's record against Mou at Madrid is a joke and total domination and it's because of what Nick is saying he knows exactly what Mou is going to do every gamenot just because he had Messi like the popular theory is by the young kids on here.

And I said this in another thread, stop with this whole 100 point thing acting like he did some incredible job to accomplish that.

Barca and Madrid had been playing to that capacity for years before that. Barca had a season to 98 and the coach Mou is so much better then Pellegrini the year he got fired putting all the dirty work he had to do mixing all the new players together (which he wasn't allowed to hand pick like Mou) played to 97 points.

Last year was the first year Mou actually earned a pay check while at Madrid and he's doing it all with one of the most talented/expensive teams in the history of the sport.

He's not winning anything this year I told some of you guys this in another thread, can't you see the team has quit on him and he on the team? Benching Casillas was basically him trying to get fired and his last chance to childishly exert his authority on the Spanish players one last time before he leave our beautiful league and hopefully never comes back again.

And believe me, Perez didn't pay all that money and ruin the clubs image for a Copa Del Rey and a La Liga title in three years. Others have been fired for seasons like this.

thats well summed up...

this is not madrid lol.. its like as if mourinho is having control over a country and being a dictator ...

Yohan Modric wrote:Perez is being patient with Mourinho because he appointed him for the trophies etc. Otherwise I'm sure in the long term Perez wants better youth development, good style of play, good relationship with the fans, backroom staff etc etc.

this is the first time perez has ever been patient lol,

Mr Nick09 wrote:3. Success in CL? i didnt say he is a bad manager and achieved nothing with madrid. I said he is a mediocre tactician whose tactical deficiencies are exposed when he cant overpower opponents with talent. Refer to bayern, refer to dortmund, refer to barca and even refer to city.

I don't really care about anything else you have to say except this. Jose Mourinho was, is, and will always be a tactical mastermind. You simply don't "lose it" over the course of 3 years. You may be talking about his stint at Real Madrid, but you still called him a 'mediocre tactician'. In fact, it is somewhat the opposite.

The 2010 UEFA Champions League final was arguably one of the most tactically brilliant finals by a manager in this millennium, and possibly one of the best ever. Jose Mourinho's tactics not only were implemented, but seamlessly cut apart Bayern Munich with crisp, defensive football. The talent that Jose Mourinho has at Real Madrid far outstrips that of Internazionale, but the strength of the team in 2010 shows that talent does not mean everything, as Inter beat the champions of Spain, England, and then Germany en route to winning the 2010 Champions League final.

Jose Mourinho brought Inter past a great Barcelona side who were poised to win the Champions League. A mistake by Pep Guardiola was easily exploited by Jose Mourinho, who in my opinion brought a new style of football that was not seen on a worldwide scale before the latter stages of the Champions League. A formidable back line that was shielded by Thiago Motta and Esteban Cambiasso neutralized the majority of Barcelona's attacks, whereas Goran Pandev and Wesley Sneijder did break apart and expose Barcelona's few weaknesses. Playing Zlatan Ibrahimovic allowed Lucio and Walter Samuel to succeed in harnessing the Zlatan to a minimal role in the match, whereas Lionel Messi's role was diminished due to him not being the focal point - the obvious error by Josep Guardiola. Showing that Xavi Hernandez did not have the defensive abilities to help contain Wesley Sneijder and to the help of Dani Alves who's bombed runs down the wings allowed Goran Pandev, an intelligent footballer, to reach space and to cause issues to the right side of the Barcelona defense. The tactical error by Josep Guardiola allowed Maicon to contribute extensively to Inter's attacks, where he also had the likes of Lucio and Esteban Cambiasso shielding his territory in case of a quick counter-attack. Going down early to a goal by Pedro would cause most managers to change their tactics, but the mastermind that is Jose Mourinho stuck it through and was rewarded, as his relatively defensive style allowed quick, unexpected counter-attacks combined with long hoofs that allowed chances that were converted well by Maicon, Wesley Sneijder, and Diego Milito.

The second leg brought a varied tactic from Jose Mourinho, one to protect a slender 3-1 aggregate lead away at the Nou Camp. Some critics call it "parking the bus", but it's funny that Thiago Motta's sending-off thanks to Sergio Busquets' now infamous theatrics was the catalyst that forced Inter to play one of the most recent 'catenaccio' styles of football in recent history. And the match that was played was one of the best defensive performances that I have seen in UEFA competition, as the stalwarts of the Inter defense prevented the elusive goal from Barcelona. Once again, Zlatan Ibrahimovic was minimized - a victory for Jose Mourinho. Inter clogged the midfield after the sending-off, essentially playing 10 men off the ball. This meant that Barcelona were reduced to passing, which they did marvelously. Over 500 total passes, with Xavi having over 200 touches, but failing to unlock Inter's defense - a victory for Jose Mourinho. Barcelona, led by Josep Guardiola, brought 2 plans to this decisive semi-final. Their first plan was to combine Zlatan Ibrahimovic with Lionel Messi, which failed. Zlatan Ibrahimovic was substituted in the 63rd minute for Bojan, and Sergio Busquets was substituted for Jeffren. This allowed Barcelona to execute their second plan, which was basically "small ball". Knowing that Inter had not evident attacking threat, they took off Sergio Busquets, the lock of the midfield. This allowed Xavi Hernandez, Lionel Messi, Pedro, Bojan, and Jeffren to all connect and the latter four to interchange, yet a goal could not be found by any of them, which meant that both plans failed against Inter - a victory for Jose Mourinho. Jose Mourinho, implementing this great defensive tactic was the key reason for Inter's victory. Barcelona played fiercely, and if Inter attempted to play against Barcelona, they would have lost. Inter did successfully what in my opinion no other team has done in Barcelona's dynasty era - negating Lionel Messi and Xavi Hernandez' abilities to create without attempting to deprive them of the ball*.

That, was one of the most tactically brilliant rounds of football that I have ever seen. Saying that Jose Mourinho is a 'tactical fraud' and a 'spin doctor' is borderline delusional [granted you are not only talking about his Real Madrid managing career]. Seeing the 1-0 match the day after watching Ivica Olic's master-class against Olympique Lyon showed how talent does not win matches - tactics do.

*zm

Edit: But then again, if you are just basing your posts off his time in Real Madrid, then I guess his Inter tactics are irrelevant. Which means that if you're reading this you basically wasted time.

Mourinho isn't the greatest tactician, he wasn't at Chelsea either he is a strategist though. He's similar to ferguson without the longevity.
His strong points are simply a motivator, team builder and a mind game player. infact he's very one-eyed when it comes to tactics.

His style is fast, aggressive, physical, football with maximum passion. Madrid knew this, they shouldn't employ him if they didn't want the style.

He consistently gets outclassed on a regular in the tactical department - I have no idea what he's trying to do in la liga, but most managers are superior in that specific area.
He came up short against Bayern, Dortmund, City (result aside), Barcelona - Madrid's biggest challenges and Mourinho's style doesn't succeed. I guess motivate C Ronaldo fully and hope for trophies works in this day and age, 'sigh' the luck some people get in life.

peerIess wrote:

I don't really care about anything else you have to say except this. Jose Mourinho was, is, and will always be a tactical mastermind. You simply don't "lose it" over the course of 3 years. You may be talking about his stint at Real Madrid, but you still called him a 'mediocre tactician'. In fact, it is somewhat the opposite.

The 2010 UEFA Champions League final was arguably one of the most tactically brilliant finals by a manager in this millennium, and possibly one of the best ever. Jose Mourinho's tactics not only were implemented, but seamlessly cut apart Bayern Munich with crisp, defensive football. The talent that Jose Mourinho has at Real Madrid far outstrips that of Internazionale, but the strength of the team in 2010 shows that talent does not mean everything, as Inter beat the champions of Spain, England, and then Germany en route to winning the 2010 Champions League final.

Tactical mastermind because he played counter-attacking tactics?

Jose Mourinho brought Inter past a great Barcelona side who were poised to win the Champions League. A mistake by Pep Guardiola was easily exploited by Jose Mourinho, who in my opinion brought a new style of football that was not seen on a worldwide scale before the latter stages of the Champions League. A formidable back line that was shielded by Thiago Motta and Esteban Cambiasso neutralized the majority of Barcelona's attacks, whereas Goran Pandev and Wesley Sneijder did break apart and expose Barcelona's few weaknesses. Playing Zlatan Ibrahimovic allowed Lucio and Walter Samuel to succeed in harnessing the Zlatan to a minimal role in the match, whereas Lionel Messi's role was diminished due to him not being the focal point - the obvious error by Josep Guardiola. Showing that Xavi Hernandez did not have the defensive abilities to help contain Wesley Sneijder and to the help of Dani Alves who's bombed runs down the wings allowed Goran Pandev, an intelligent footballer, to reach space and to cause issues to the right side of the Barcelona defense. The tactical error by Josep Guardiola allowed Maicon to contribute extensively to Inter's attacks, where he also had the likes of Lucio and Esteban Cambiasso shielding his territory in case of a quick counter-attack. Going down early to a goal by Pedro would cause most managers to change their tactics, but the mastermind that is Jose Mourinho stuck it through and was rewarded, as his relatively defensive style allowed quick, unexpected counter-attacks combined with long hoofs that allowed chances that were converted well by Maicon, Wesley Sneijder, and Diego Milito.

Since when has sticking to a tactical plan qualified you to be a tactical genius?

The second leg brought a varied tactic from Jose Mourinho, one to protect a slender 3-1 aggregate lead away at the Nou Camp. Some critics call it "parking the bus", but it's funny that Thiago Motta's sending-off thanks to Sergio Busquets' now infamous theatrics was the catalyst that forced Inter to play one of the most recent 'catenaccio' styles of football in recent history. And the match that was played was one of the best defensive performances that I have seen in UEFA competition, as the stalwarts of the Inter defense prevented the elusive goal from Barcelona. Once again, Zlatan Ibrahimovic was minimized - a victory for Jose Mourinho. Inter clogged the midfield after the sending-off, essentially playing 10 men off the ball. This meant that Barcelona were reduced to passing, which they did marvelously. Over 500 total passes, with Xavi having over 200 touches, but failing to unlock Inter's defense - a victory for Jose Mourinho. Barcelona, led by Josep Guardiola, brought 2 plans to this decisive semi-final. Their first plan was to combine Zlatan Ibrahimovic with Lionel Messi, which failed. Zlatan Ibrahimovic was substituted in the 63rd minute for Bojan, and Sergio Busquets was substituted for Jeffren. This allowed Barcelona to execute their second plan, which was basically "small ball". Knowing that Inter had not evident attacking threat, they took off Sergio Busquets, the lock of the midfield. This allowed Xavi Hernandez, Lionel Messi, Pedro, Bojan, and Jeffren to all connect and the latter four to interchange, yet a goal could not be found by any of them, which meant that both plans failed against Inter - a victory for Jose Mourinho. Jose Mourinho, implementing this great defensive tactic was the key reason for Inter's victory. Barcelona played fiercely, and if Inter attempted to play against Barcelona, they would have lost. Inter did successfully what in my opinion no other team has done in Barcelona's dynasty era - negating Lionel Messi and Xavi Hernandez' abilities to create without attempting to deprive them of the ball*.

So packing 10 men into the 1/3 of your own half qualifies as the best tactical performance you have ever seen and what no other team has done before?

That, was one of the most tactically brilliant rounds of football that I have ever seen. Saying that Jose Mourinho is a 'tactical fraud' and a 'spin doctor' is borderline delusional [granted you are not only talking about his Real Madrid managing career]. Seeing the 1-0 match the day after watching Ivica Olic's master-class against Olympique Lyon showed how talent does not win matches - tactics do.

*zm

Edit: But then again, if you are just basing your posts off his time in Real Madrid, then I guess his Inter tactics are irrelevant. Which means that if you're reading this you basically wasted time.

And you have based your entire post on 3 matches Inter has played to prove Mou's tactical brilliance.

I think Mourinho is a great manager with excellent motivational skills and a decent grasp of tactics required to win a match. But he is no tactical genius/mastermind. Refer to my previous thread on Mourinho for more.

http://www.goallegacy.net/t6462-jose-mourinho

"And for my next trick, I shall make £120 million disappear right before your very eyes"

Top that, Jose

peerIess wrote:

Mr Nick09 wrote:3. Success in CL? i didnt say he is a bad manager and achieved nothing with madrid. I said he is a mediocre tactician whose tactical deficiencies are exposed when he cant overpower opponents with talent. Refer to bayern, refer to dortmund, refer to barca and even refer to city.

I don't really care about anything else you have to say except this. Jose Mourinho was, is, and will always be a tactical mastermind. You simply don't "lose it" over the course of 3 years. You may be talking about his stint at Real Madrid, but you still called him a 'mediocre tactician'. In fact, it is somewhat the opposite.

The 2010 UEFA Champions League final was arguably one of the most tactically brilliant finals by a manager in this millennium, and possibly one of the best ever. Jose Mourinho's tactics not only were implemented, but seamlessly cut apart Bayern Munich with crisp, defensive football. The talent that Jose Mourinho has at Real Madrid far outstrips that of Internazionale, but the strength of the team in 2010 shows that talent does not mean everything, as Inter beat the champions of Spain, England, and then Germany en route to winning the 2010 Champions League final.

Jose Mourinho brought Inter past a great Barcelona side who were poised to win the Champions League. A mistake by Pep Guardiola was easily exploited by Jose Mourinho, who in my opinion brought a new style of football that was not seen on a worldwide scale before the latter stages of the Champions League. A formidable back line that was shielded by Thiago Motta and Esteban Cambiasso neutralized the majority of Barcelona's attacks, whereas Goran Pandev and Wesley Sneijder did break apart and expose Barcelona's few weaknesses. Playing Zlatan Ibrahimovic allowed Lucio and Walter Samuel to succeed in harnessing the Zlatan to a minimal role in the match, whereas Lionel Messi's role was diminished due to him not being the focal point - the obvious error by Josep Guardiola. Showing that Xavi Hernandez did not have the defensive abilities to help contain Wesley Sneijder and to the help of Dani Alves who's bombed runs down the wings allowed Goran Pandev, an intelligent footballer, to reach space and to cause issues to the right side of the Barcelona defense. The tactical error by Josep Guardiola allowed Maicon to contribute extensively to Inter's attacks, where he also had the likes of Lucio and Esteban Cambiasso shielding his territory in case of a quick counter-attack. Going down early to a goal by Pedro would cause most managers to change their tactics, but the mastermind that is Jose Mourinho stuck it through and was rewarded, as his relatively defensive style allowed quick, unexpected counter-attacks combined with long hoofs that allowed chances that were converted well by Maicon, Wesley Sneijder, and Diego Milito.

The second leg brought a varied tactic from Jose Mourinho, one to protect a slender 3-1 aggregate lead away at the Nou Camp. Some critics call it "parking the bus", but it's funny that Thiago Motta's sending-off thanks to Sergio Busquets' now infamous theatrics was the catalyst that forced Inter to play one of the most recent 'catenaccio' styles of football in recent history. And the match that was played was one of the best defensive performances that I have seen in UEFA competition, as the stalwarts of the Inter defense prevented the elusive goal from Barcelona. Once again, Zlatan Ibrahimovic was minimized - a victory for Jose Mourinho. Inter clogged the midfield after the sending-off, essentially playing 10 men off the ball. This meant that Barcelona were reduced to passing, which they did marvelously. Over 500 total passes, with Xavi having over 200 touches, but failing to unlock Inter's defense - a victory for Jose Mourinho. Barcelona, led by Josep Guardiola, brought 2 plans to this decisive semi-final. Their first plan was to combine Zlatan Ibrahimovic with Lionel Messi, which failed. Zlatan Ibrahimovic was substituted in the 63rd minute for Bojan, and Sergio Busquets was substituted for Jeffren. This allowed Barcelona to execute their second plan, which was basically "small ball". Knowing that Inter had not evident attacking threat, they took off Sergio Busquets, the lock of the midfield. This allowed Xavi Hernandez, Lionel Messi, Pedro, Bojan, and Jeffren to all connect and the latter four to interchange, yet a goal could not be found by any of them, which meant that both plans failed against Inter - a victory for Jose Mourinho. Jose Mourinho, implementing this great defensive tactic was the key reason for Inter's victory. Barcelona played fiercely, and if Inter attempted to play against Barcelona, they would have lost. Inter did successfully what in my opinion no other team has done in Barcelona's dynasty era - negating Lionel Messi and Xavi Hernandez' abilities to create without attempting to deprive them of the ball*.

That, was one of the most tactically brilliant rounds of football that I have ever seen. Saying that Jose Mourinho is a 'tactical fraud' and a 'spin doctor' is borderline delusional [granted you are not only talking about his Real Madrid managing career]. Seeing the 1-0 match the day after watching Ivica Olic's master-class against Olympique Lyon showed how talent does not win matches - tactics do.

*zm

Edit: But then again, if you are just basing your posts off his time in Real Madrid, then I guess his Inter tactics are irrelevant. Which means that if you're reading this you basically wasted time.

Dude, calm down. Di Matteo did basically the same thing going through Barca and Bayern to win the CL and is he a mastermind tactician? No, he's unemployed.

You can put 10 men behind the ball and beat better teams then you and win in tournament football.

I guess now the Greece team of 2004 and there manager are the best tactical team ever because he parked the bus and went on to beat Spain, Portugal twice, France(a loaded team) and were the only team ever to beat the host and returning champions in a Euro tournament.

It happens in tournament football, it's a crap shoot. If you play defensive football you have a better chance to not make a mistake and win and that's why Spain has 1 World Cup and Italy has 4 or 5, they put winning first and substance second as they both have had there share of great players.

Guess what the next year in the Confederations cup Greece lost 3 straight to Brazil, Japan and Mexico with pretty much the same team, the tactics don't hold up over time and it's why Mou jumps from job to job because he's given a Ferrari drives it like a pinto wins and then bolts because he has no more substance and the teams are tired of having the reins pulled back on them when there are world class players all over the field.

It's also why this Barca and Spain team are so terrific because they are always going forward trying to score and winning tournaments that way, that's not how it's usually done because it leaves you open to a counter and to be beaten by a team even though you have 20 shots to there 5 or 6.

Mou usually get's it done. At Real he didn't. He has a great win loss record and a poor record as a human being IMO. But I agree with Nick he takes loaded teams plays cautiously with them and then splits usually leaving them in ruins.

He's a great coach not a great tactician.

I was wondering if some Madrid fans care more about Mou or their club but then I realized I am on goalegacy and now everything makes sense.

kiranr wrote:Tactical mastermind because he played counter-attacking tactics?

Stupid. How you could have condensed my prose into a simple "counter-attacking tactics" jibe is laughable. There is much more to a tactical battle than just a simple phrase.

kiranr wrote:Since when has sticking to a tactical plan qualified you to be a tactical genius?

Very stupid. If you have any recollection of the 2010 Champions League, you might remember how Jose Mourinho outwitted Carlo Ancelotti in the 3-1 aggregate victory for Internazionale against Chelsea. You might remember how in the first leg, he radically shifted the formation of his side from a narrow tactic to a wider one to negate any form of attacking threat from Chelsea's wingbacks, Florent Malouda and Branislav Ivanovic. The switch after Esteban Cambiasso's goal allowed Internazionale to completely stifle any attempt of attacking from Chelsea which deadened the game.

Jose Mourinho completely played it by the book in the round of 16, and against CSKA Moskva his tactics slowly cut apart the side that could have posed a bigger threat than Chelsea did.

kiranr wrote:So packing 10 men into the 1/3 of your own half qualifies as the best tactical performance you have ever seen and what no other team has done before?

Please read my post before making such stupid posts. I will not bother explaining why that was so stupid, because you need to re-read my post to understand it correctly.

kiranr wrote:And you have based your entire post on 3 matches Inter has played to prove Mou's tactical brilliance.

I think Mourinho is a great manager with excellent motivational skills and a decent grasp of tactics required to win a match. But he is no tactical genius/mastermind. Refer to my previous thread on Mourinho for more.

http://www.goallegacy.net/t6462-jose-mourinho

I can go on and on about Jose Mourinho's excellence as a manager, bringing up important matches from when he was with FC Porto, Chelsea Football Club, and Internazionale. I do not watch Real Madrid that much, so I cannot analyze the tactics that Jose Mourinho has implemented there and to which any form of success he has had in La Liga, seeing as how he has been competing against one of the greatest club sides of all time. I only posted in specific about the 2 legs against Barcelona, as they were some of his most defining matches as a manager.

Jose Mourinho is one of the best all-around managers in the world today, and one of the upper-tier all-around managers of all time. There is of course more to a manager than what he can do on the pitch, and Jose Mourinho does the majority of it exceptionally.

I may have overexaggerated by calling Jose Mourinho a "tactical mastermind", but he is an exceptional tactician. There is, and should be no doubt about it.

Dnmac4 wrote:Dude, calm down. Di Matteo did basically the same thing going through Barca and Bayern to win the CL and is he a mastermind tactician? No, he's unemployed.

You literally compared Internazionale's tactical masterclass to that of Chelsea's hero-ball. Bayern Munich had 43 total attempts on goal, Chelsea blocking 21 of them. Bayern Munich completely dominated the tactical battle, but poor finishing and lack of composure by players [Arjen Robben] allowed their work to become undone.

Dnmac4 wrote:I guess now the Greece team of 2004 and there manager are the best tactical team ever because he parked the bus and went on to beat Spain, Portugal twice, France(a loaded team) and were the only team ever to beat the host and returning champions in a Euro tournament.

It happens in tournament football, it's a crap shoot. If you play defensive football you have a better chance to not make a mistake and win and that's why Spain has 1 World Cup and Italy has 4 or 5, they put winning first and substance second as they both have had there share of great players.

There is a difference between 1 knockout match and a 2-legged cup tie. There is a difference between playing at a neutral venue [excluding Portugal, to some extent] to playing at home to your supporting crowd and to playing away to a hostile crowd.

If you are going to compare the Greece squad of 2004 and the Internazionale squad of 2010, at least have some form of a concrete point. You're just spouting tripe, attempting to compare the two sides when in reality the only thing they had in comparison is that they were known for their defensive solidity - whereas Internazionale's were renowned due to their tactical astuteness.

Dnmac4 wrote:Guess what the next year in the Confederations cup Greece lost 3 straight to Brazil, Japan and Mexico with pretty much the same team, the tactics don't hold up over time and it's why Mou jumps from job to job because he's given a Ferrari drives it like a pinto wins and then bolts because he has no more substance and the teams are tired of having the reins pulled back on them when there are world class players all over the field.

It's also why this Barca and Spain team are so terrific because they are always going forward trying to score and winning tournaments that way, that's not how it's usually done because it leaves you open to a counter and to be beaten by a team even though you have 20 shots to there 5 or 6.

Greece is a completely different team compared to Internazionale. It's a national side where they do not have full control over their players, having them for shorter periods of time compared to the completely devoted staff of Internazionale who have the players at their service for the majority of the season.

Stupid comparison. Barcelona and Spain are effective due to their tactical prowess and their knowledge of a team system that allows each player to minimize their weaknesses and heighten their own strengths. If that wasn't obvious to you already, that is poor. Zlatan Ibrahimovic was the anomaly and he was a regarded failure at Barcelona, whereas an above-average footballer in Sergio Busquets is known as the best defensive midfielder in the world due to his knowledge of his simple role for Barcelona, and Spain. The lock of the midfield, really.

Dnmac4 wrote:Mou usually get's it done. At Real he didn't. He has a great win loss record and a poor record as a human being IMO. But I agree with Nick he takes loaded teams plays cautiously with them and then splits usually leaving them in ruins.

He's a great coach not a great tactician.

You're underestimating the abilities of Mourinho.

And to say he has a poor record as a human being due to events sensationalized by media is pathetic.

remember Real Madrid is still at CL not many manager you can find better than mourinho

Lex wrote:

"And for my next trick, I shall make £120 million disappear right before your very eyes"

Top that, Jose

Made me laugh so much

Its back to mediocrity if he leaves. Hence you can even quote me on that.

People tend to forget that Mou never really got the chance to build the team he wanted. He likes to play it passive, with Madrid however he was forced to change the winning formula. He knew that before he took over the helm tho.

this season my biggest gripes with him are

1. transfers. not reinforcing the RB problem or the midfield problem.
2. losing the faith and trust of the players and as a result:
3. not being able to motivate the players.

thats pretty huge, and not to the standard of real madrid.

however, the problems are not coming just from mourinho. the injuries and suspensions have been a massive setback to madrid starting right after all of the players came back in miserable form after the euros another reason for the terrible performances

but to sum it up mourinho hasnt set up madrid to fail this season (a lot of things have been and still are out of his control), but certainly could have done many things to prevent such poor performances.