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Arsenal 2 - 0 West Bromwich Albion: That's more like it

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Post by SamuelJayC Sat Dec 08, 2012 9:02 pm

Cazorla 8 at least. Was majestic.

Great performance alround. We actually defended well! Sagna back makes a difference with his experience.

Cazorla-Arteta-Wilshere showed it CAN work, just needs to get used to eachother.

Gervinho, Chamberlain impressive. Giroud quiet but not great service and seemed to suffer back problem.

Bring on Bradford! bounce

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Post by LeBéninois Sat Dec 08, 2012 10:56 pm

urbaNRoots wrote:Happy with the result.

Wilshere was MOTM for me even though Santi, Mikel and Vermaelen had a great game. Wilshere looks like truly coming back. I liked him even more when Wenger moved him to AM in the last 10 minutes, looked extremely good.

Santi should never dive again and Oxlade-Chamberlain needs to step it up.

fully agree
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Post by El Gunner Sun Dec 09, 2012 3:57 am

Fecking Jack Wilshere!!!!!

That's all that needs to be said.
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Post by El Gunner Sun Dec 09, 2012 4:00 am

julias wrote:
julias wrote:Off to the emirates today and I have never watched Arsenal lose a game a run which stretches for the best part of 13-14 odd years, 15-20 games.

Lets hope my run continues COYG...

Very Happy

and my run continues, good game at the emirates Wilshere bossed 100%, the fans were on Gervinho's back so badly I fear another Eboue....

We never really looked threatened and I thought attacking wise we looked a lot better when Rosicky came on. Hopefully this isn't another false dawn...
HOPEFULLY.... *fingers crossed*
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Post by Eman Sun Dec 09, 2012 4:23 am

Wenger:
on the Cazorla penalty…
No [I haven't reviewed it]. I am sorry if it was not a penalty but I have spoken to Santi and he said he has been touched and lost his balance. Maybe he made more of it, I don't know. But he told me just after I came to see you [the press], I asked him the question because I knew you would ask me the question.

on if being touched means it's a penalty…
Not necessarily, no. But it's a difficult decision, it can go against you, it went for us today. That's what it is. What I mean is, when he [a player] is touched, he goes down, the referee can give or not give the penalty. Of course [I will speak to Santi if he has not been touched]. I will look at it, don't worry.
Santi will get a talking to, I'm sure.
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Post by MJ Sun Dec 09, 2012 9:27 am

Fully agree.

Don't want him or Arsenal to get any reputation of diving associated with us. He's still new to the EPL and Arsenal so he's got time to turn it around. Besides he's had other opportunities to dive he's stood through like the challenge on him in the Sp*ds game where he fell on the ground, got up and gave an assist.
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Post by Jay29 Sun Dec 09, 2012 10:39 am

Desperate times called for desperate measures, I guess.

The important thing here is to not make a huge deal out of it. There's no need for punishment, either internally or externally.

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Post by boss Sun Dec 09, 2012 11:54 am

Well we got 3pts at last,that's good BUT the way we got hmmmm ! lol....i'm not satisfied about performances again ,2bfair...exceptin Wilshere >Motm
We have to improveeeeeee definitely! WE lost at least 4 ideal chances !

However ,I see all of U are criticising Cazorla about that dive Embarassed .....I just want to say that......I'm soooo PROUD with all of U guys ... :bow:
Our game is FAIR play.

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Post by juventus101 Sun Dec 09, 2012 1:08 pm

From what ive seen, Rosicky needs to play. But Cazorla is too.good to drop, Wilshere has been doing excellent, Arteta is the leader, and a fully healthy Poldi when played centrally is easily your most dangerous forward. The problem is then do you put Giroud/Walcott/Ox in there too for extra attack or Diaby for sone more defensive stability. Thats what you need to figure out.
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Post by Wilson37 Sun Dec 09, 2012 1:18 pm

boss wrote:Well we got 3pts at last,that's good BUT the way we got hmmmm ! lol....i'm not satisfied about performances again ,2bfair...exceptin Wilshere >Motm
We have to improveeeeeee definitely! WE lost at least 4 ideal chances !

However ,I see all of U are criticising Cazorla about that dive Embarassed .....I just want to say that......I'm soooo PROUD with all of U guys ... :bow:
Our game is FAIR play.
Thumbs up
same here boss.. whole lot of discussion going in the social networking sites in Arsenal fan groups.. and like said, the majority 80% criticised Cazorla for what he did, they were concerned about fairplay and the reputation of our team even at this situation.. remaining were like they dont mind if they get 3 points given our desperate situation.. and very few said they wont mind instances like that once in a while..
not like the reaction we get from United or Chelsea fans when their player dives.. 90% of guys will be defending their players, finding reasons to say that it was not a dive...
thats CLASS... proud to be a GOONER... :bow:
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Post by Eman Sun Dec 09, 2012 4:02 pm

juventus101 wrote:From what ive seen, Rosicky needs to play. But Cazorla is too.good to drop, Wilshere has been doing excellent, Arteta is the leader, and a fully healthy Poldi when played centrally is easily your most dangerous forward. The problem is then do you put Giroud/Walcott/Ox in there too for extra attack or Diaby for sone more defensive stability. Thats what you need to figure out.
Our midfield trio was excellent, but in the last few weeks, they have really let us down. The question becomes whether they played better because they had a week of rest or just because West Brom were poor. They have a few more weeks to prove that they can work without a big guy helping them out, but if they go back to the levels before the game this weekend where we can't get the ball back once we lose it, playing a guy like Diaby is a must when he's available.

As for Poldi, he hasn't excelled in the few appearances he has made as the lone striker. Giroud is the better choice if we're playing with 1 guy up front due to his physical presence. I would love to see us experiment with 2 strikers at some point to see if Podolski and Walcott can play there for us, but if we're playing with 1 striker, it has to be Giroud IMO.

And I agree about Rosicky. I wouldn't mind seeing us play Rosicky central and Cazorla out on the left, or even trying a 4-2-2-2 with Cazorla and Rosicky as wider AMs, Arteta and Wilshere as the holding midfielders, and 2 strikers up top. I already play the latter formation on FIFA with Podolski and Theo as my strikers, but I doubt Wenger will go for it, especially since we've never tried it.
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Post by Jay29 Sun Dec 09, 2012 4:23 pm

Our midfield dominated for the first time those three have come together and I think that was down to the fact we had two playmakers instead of one.

A typical midfield set-up for us would be:

Arteta --- Wilshere

Cazorla

Which worked quite well when we had Song and Diaby in there, because they could both dominate with their strength despite not being out-right defensive midfielders.

Wilshere has tried to assume the same role since returning but it hasn't quite worked because defensively he can be rash and he's lacking in physical strength. The way he used to dominate midfields was by playing around pressure with his dribbling ability. When he's playing in a pivot alongside Arteta, he doesn't quite have that freedom.

Yesterday, the midfield was more like this:

Arteta

Cazorla --- Wilshere

Where Wilshere and Cazorla took turns in going forward and played alongside each other. This gave Wilshere more freedom and you could see how much it benefited his performance to not be burdened by too many defensive duties.

It's worth mentioning that in a game where West Brom were non-existent as an attacking force, this set-up can work quite well. However in games where we need a more solid defensive shape, Wilshere would have to play in a deeper role like he used to.

In any case, I would like to see us go for a more attacking set-up in some games. Something like:

Arteta

Walcott ---- Wilshere --- Cazorla

Podolski --- Giroud

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Post by Wilson37 Sun Dec 09, 2012 6:25 pm

Cazorla has done well as a CAM in the initial matches, but now he is getting marked out of the game...
i think Cazorla will better benefit playing wide.. most of the time he drifts wide and there is no game centrally.. and most of his runs have come through the left side..
i want to see..
Arteta ---- Wilshere
Walcott/Ox --- Rosicky --- Cazorla
Giroud/Podolski
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Post by Thinking.. Sun Dec 09, 2012 8:07 pm



:facepalm:
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Post by RealGunner Sun Dec 09, 2012 8:14 pm

LMAO
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Post by julias Sun Dec 09, 2012 8:18 pm

lmao I don't think I have seen a worse dive aside from that Gareth Bale one
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Post by juventus101 Mon Dec 10, 2012 12:28 am

I like the look of this:

When attacking:
--Sczezny--
--Mertesacker-- --Verm/Kosc--
--Sagna------- --Arteta-- -------Gibbs--
--Rosicky-- --Wilshere-- --Cazorla--
--Walcott-- --Podolski--

When defending:
--Sczezny--
--Sagna-- --Mertesacker-- --Verm/Kosc-- --Gibbs--
--Rosicky-- --Arteta-- --Wilshere-- --Cazorla--
--Walcott-- --Podolski--

Overall, its a hybrid 4-1-3-2/4-4-2/4-2-2-2. I think it would work beautifully. It lets Rosicky and Cazorla both play as AMs, albeit pushed out a bit wider than usual, but would still be just as effective. Wilshere gets a free role in the center. Podolski and Walcott both get their prefered central poitions. And the depth you would have would be perfect. Ox and Gervinho cover for Cazorla and Rosicky in this formation, and Giroud and Arshavin for Walcott and Poldi.
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Post by Amar Mon Dec 10, 2012 2:14 am

julias wrote:lmao I don't think I have seen a worse dive aside from that Gareth Bale one

I think you forgot this gem Laughing

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Post by silver Mon Dec 10, 2012 5:15 am

We cant have Arteta as our sole DM! He's too lightweight
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Post by Wilson37 Mon Dec 10, 2012 9:27 am

4-1-3-2 would be perfect with a true dm.. Not with Arteta..
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Post by furiouswindbottom Mon Dec 10, 2012 10:29 am

Agree on Arteta. He's an excellent player and I think he's great, but he's not a pure DM.

One big difference you'll notice between Man Utd and us is that they get 3 or 4 in the box for crosses. We at times, just have Giroud. A quick, whipped ball into the box is always dangerous. When we cross it...get men in the box FFS. Another problem is that our AM players are a little short. Maybe that's why he'll go with Gervinho and The Ox.

If you look at Man Utd and us, a few of our players would probably get in their team (Vidic injured remember). Szczesney, Vermaelen, Koscielny, Wilshere and Cazorla would all have a shout.

It's just the balance. In the EPL you need a few physical players and you need men in the box for crosses.
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Post by Wilson37 Tue Dec 11, 2012 4:53 am

When United attack they do as a team.. But its more to the fact that it is their style and they have better crossers..
And ours.. Gibbs runs to corner and just put a blind curler, even when not under any pressure, which can land anywhere in the box.. Cant understand why he doesnt have a look and cross.. Many a times he just needs to drag it in along the ground like Gervinho does rather than scooping it in the air.. Sagnas cross is a 50-50.. Walcott can be terrible or average.. Jenkinson is a decent crosser but he doesnt get forward frequently.. Arshavin and Podolski are decent but they dont get wide to cross instead they try to play more centrally..
So i feel it is again connected to the style of play.. Their players such as Valencia, Young, Raphael and Evra prefer to run wide and hit crosses.. So its difficult for us to do the same without changing our style or tactics..
Only thing feasible is to increase the frequency and improve the quality of crossing from the fullbacks and some midfielder like Wilshere making runs to the box to make use of the balls Giroud knocks like the first goal against Montpellier...
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