Wenger just said staying EPL is like trophy and he is happy with 7.5m a year for now no need to give him a raise.

The only downside to this team is, big clubs wont be coming for our players so the board is mad at Wenger no raise for him.

Lex and Raptor in this thread:

Self-trolling is the best way to remain sane during these weeks for an Arsenal supporter.

6unner wrote:
Kind of disagree, If you replace world class players with mid-table players you become a mid-table team. We are currently now what our transfers have made us. An average team. The bad part is not only are we an average team. We are an average team that every player in the club knows has no ambition to win anything. 4th place is not a trophy for any other club or player in the world but it is the extent to what we have tried to achieve for too long.

Yep, I'll definitely grant that in general Arsenal have traded down when it comes to overall transfer dealings in recent years. But I do think 'mid-table' underestimates the squad. (And I'm not a rose-tinted glasses believer in the unlimited potential of each Gunner, either.) If we look at squad lists, and you said "let's put an in-form Arsenal against an in-form [any other PL team]," I'd say that 4th in the table is an accurate reflection. (Plus 3rd is not out of reach - and to bolster this we can remind ourselves that even in last season's awful campaign Arsenal still somehow finished above every other non-Manchester club. A really bad season for Arsenal is still higher than most top-flight clubs hope for.) And placing the squad anywhere below 6th seems pretty rough on a side comprised of Cazorla, Arteta, Wilshere, Sagna, Koscielny, etc. That's why I think they're a very good - not all-around superb but very good - squad that are underperforming badly.

You're also right that 4th place is not a trophy for any other club, and I'm not saying the situation shouldn't be improved. But however one feels about the wisdom or foolishness of the club's financial dealings, Arsenal have been hitting above their weight in this respect and still edging their way into the elite levels consistently. Is this all we should want or expect, as fans? No, of course not! I was just advocating (to no one in particular, and not specifically in response to anybody here) the importance of keeping perspective, even when making bracing & necessary criticisms. We can probably all agree on that much.

Rev wrote:Lex and Raptor in this thread:

Self-trolling is the best way to remain sane during these weeks for an Arsenal supporter.

Trust me I am so angry, if I knew Arsenal were going to be this shit I would have waited another year to quit smoking.


No team can afford Wenger's wages, I hope we can send him on a loan and pay half of his wages.

Calmed down a bit. Six winnable games coming up in the EPL.

West Brom (H)
Reading (A)
Wigan (A)
West Ham (H)
Newcastle (H)
Southampton (A)

After that Liverpool, Chelsea and Man City.

Those six games will decide Wenger's fate at the club as far as the fans go.

Sort it out Arsene. I'm really good at my job, but if I was half arsed and rubbish for years my boss would have a word or sack me.

Earn that salary FFS!

Spend some money!

I am not sure what are winnable games anymore mate

We had "winnable" games for over a month, we managed to *bleep* up 80% of those.

The likes of West Brom (even at home) and Reading (we know) are no pushovers while MoleCastle (no matter how shat they're atm) can always surprise us.

Until we manage to beat someone convincingly we should not use the term "winnable" game.

Samuelj29060 wrote:Gervinho is arguably the worst signing of the Wenger era. Cost more than Jeffers, and at least Chamakh (free) & Silvestre (750k) were cheap

Wiltord, Arshavin and Reyes all cost more than Gervinho. That's because they were all twice as good and scored some historic goals.

You forgot Squid

so cazorla dispossessed 5 times and made 8 misplaced passes
looked even worse than stats suggest
simply ran out of esteem some time ago!!

when he joined there was already concerns with lack of winter break and seeing Mata and Silva's form also dropping in 2nd half of last season

did it come to soon for Santi?
our fault surely
with such a short squad
still lack of understanding is baffling

slow build up and game plan that awkwardly crossing to Gervinho been discussed already

Podolski moved centrally as many wanted to see
the movement and understanding not there

main missing link is creative wide player to help us keep the ball in final 3rd and share creative burden .Lacking that type since Na$ri

but one of priorities should also be getting physical ball-winner how we make Rangel look like Alves
and midfielders go past us and are up against our defence
Szczesny deserves lots of credit
Verms 1st half looked the old verm that we liked

these 2(type of players) should be our on top of shopping list imo
not striker/GK!!

Winnable games? Weren't Norwich, Swansea, Sunderland all winnable?

Lol im not even angry or surprised, the team I play for won today so that lessened the blow

We are of a low level of quality now especially in terms of consistency and Wenger's problem is loyalty to players who don't perform well.

Take Gervinho for an example, rash decision maker, poor finisher, lacks composure. His assets are pace and good dribbling (SOMETIMES) and yet this guy starts at CF...WHY?

Giroud has only been starting because this half wit was injured hes back now and back come his poor performances.

We buy Podolski who scored 20 plus goals for a team that ended up getting relegated AS A CF and he has played virtually every single game on the left. WHY?

Ramsey need I say more and to make matters worse he plays him RW half the time.

Arteta plays EVERY single game, Cazorla every flipping game

I don't understand Wenger anymore and I don't understand how someone who claimed before that he would be physically sick after losing games is accepting this mediocrity.

Why is Diaby still on our payroll? He plays what 10 games a season MAX and to compound things we go and sell Song.

Are you really telling me Arshavin cannot add some quality to the trash we see every week? Victim of competition from who? Podolski and Gervinho?

Do me a favour.....

And learn to cross a f'kin ball properly ffs

Why Wenger plays Gervinho and not Arshavin who is our best winger beats me. Wenger is not a real manager, how the *bleep* certain players keep getting starts at Arsenal.


How many chances does a player need to prove himself? why is Wenger so blind?

I for one, can't wait for this season to end....

It's when I read Julius' and Goonerjay's post that actually convince me that tactically and strategically AW has lost it. I've been saying in almost every post match thread that on paper this is one of our better XI, but squad depth quality is nowhere to be seen.

Far too much expectation on Cazorla - it's unreal. Since I read about the alleged break down in relationship between Bould and AW, things have gotten progressively worse. Besides needing 3 TOP players, we need to look into a complete revamp of the technical tutorage being given to our players. AW needs to be ruthless and accept that players such as Gervinho are not fit for Arsenal; And players such as Podolski need to be playing to their strengths.

Wenger out? Meh, I don't know, I'm torn right now...

I understand your gripes about not replacing players with players of the same ability- and you're right. That's something Tottenham certainly got right this window. Let go of the likes of Modric and VdV and replaced them with Dembele, Dempsey, and Sigurdsson (although Dempsey and Sigurdsson have NOTHING on VdV yet).

While I agree that that's something Arsenal hasn't done recently...you guys still have a good squad. You talk about how your squad is just mid table now.... It's not, you guys aren't the sides you've had in the past, but you're much better than you're currently doing. You look at the Arsenal squad and maybe it's not full of "world class" players, but you guys are good enough for top 4 if you want my opinion.

I'm not saying it because that idiot Piers Morgan says it, but I think I agree with those that think it's time for Wenger to go. He hasn't been doing it, and if you guys continue on this season like you have been so far, I wouldn't think it unfair to have Wenger step down from manager of Arsenal.

I'm actually interested to see what happens if we continue to drop points to teams we should be beating and the fans start a major movement.
Do the board have the balls to get rid of Wenger?
Will they give him till February if these performances continue and he is given the transfer window to bring in players to make a difference?

The main issues personally for me:
Give players more wages to retain them get the trash off our wage bill. (Squid/Denilson/Bendtner etc.)
Pick players based on form and not based on favoritism.
Personally I'm getting sick of the players like Ramsey/Gervinho/Santos not preforming and Coquelin/Arshavin. Coquelin will leave at the end of the season and have success where ever he goes.

Worst Arsenal team I've seen in a while. Hope you guys buy smart in Jan and turn it around soon.

Artilleristen wrote:

Samuelj29060 wrote:Gervinho is arguably the worst signing of the Wenger era. Cost more than Jeffers, and at least Chamakh (free) & Silvestre (750k) were cheap

Wiltord, Arshavin and Reyes all cost more than Gervinho. That's because they were all twice as good and scored some historic goals.

You forgot Squid

Squid is just a backup 3rd or 4th choice defender.. Gervinho was supposed to become a starting winger/wide midfielder and a 2nd choice striker who could create and score goals..

If you look at our midfield we don't have anyone who is decent at winning the ball back for us. Too small and too slow.

We need a someone tough in there. Even Diame looks a better option. I look at other teams in the EPL and it seems that we are out of touch. Look at the size of most team's CM pairings.

On another note, the players should be ashamed of themselves. I hope Arsene forces them to come in today and work on tactics and do some training. He should tear them a new one.

Thing is...can you actually see him doing something like that.

Big changes needed.
My team for our next EPL game:

Szczesney

Jenks Vermy Merty Gibbs

Arshavin Coquelin Eisfeld Podolski

Giroud Walcott

Drastic? Yes. But a crisis means you change it up. A lot.

It's only gonna be the same old story picking the same old team.

Legend wrote:Santi was horrible, he kept losing the ball trying to do his turns, he only livened up in the last few mintues, even then his passing was crap.

THIS!

I kept thinking, ffs Wenger bring Rozza on. Or maybe even bring Ramsey on and let Wilshere play in the playmaking role.

Juz horrible shit... Same old stuff we've seen in the last 2-3 seasons. A team comes with a well organised defense and with a good pressing game and they catch us on the counter attack (or through our mistakes). It's been happening for LONGGGGG time now, but that stubborn manager of us doesn't do anything about it.

TACTICALLY INEPT

Chumlum wrote:I'm a bit torn because in some sense I think that Arsenal would probably be much worse off over the past few (Emirates) years, with Champions League consistency a thing of the past, with almost any other manager. So it pains me to see bitter abuse hurled at Wenger. His loyalty to the club and his achievements should be respected, and that includes the less glamorous achievement of staying consistently in the top 4 even in these barren years.

At the same time I think that the biggest problems at Arsenal club don't necessary come down to the squad personnel. (I'm not saying we can't criticize the fact that the club aren't aiming a little higher in terms of transfers, I'm just saying that this is already a good squad that on paper should be a lock for 4th at least ... but it's underperforming drastically.) I think the culture & mentality are lacking and that blame has to be laid at Wenger's feet. I've got no insight into what it is on the training ground or in the dressing room but he just doesn't seem able to motivate his squad consistently any more.

A so-called "pretty football" team that can no longer keep possession well, that tends to cross into the box a lot & poorly, that neither consistently presses opponents on the pitch nor reliably defends with disciplined banks of four. On top of all that, there's a crazy high amount of defensive errors. It's easier to take lack of trophies if the team are playing with a style and conviction that makes you proud to watch them, that makes you want to watch them. But currently Arsenal offer neither results nor exciting play.

It's just depressing. I believe in the majority of this squad. I want to see younger players like Wilshere, Oxlade-Chamberlain, Ramsey, Gibbs, Jenkinson, etc., achieve their full potential for the club. I want to see the likes of Sagna, Arteta, and Rosicky play great veteran football as they gradually approach retirement.

But it just doesn't seem like anything's coming off.

And the thing is this team of players that we have is not bad.

But the formation and tactics aren't to the strength of the players. Plus Wenger plays players out of position ( Poldi ). Keeps on playing shit that fails every game (Gerv & Rambo)

This ain't working no more. Why not change your game. Your tactics. It doesn't have to be a drastic change. But why don't you juz start with 2 strikers up top. I have a feeling Giroud Poldi up top, or Poldi Walcott will be more effective. And maybe a change will also bring more motivation and inspiration to the team.

The guy's juz stubborn. And for the fans it's juz heartbreaking watching the team that we love so much go on a downward spiral.

i too feel the problems we are facing are more in favour of the tactical aspect..
By some chance, the alleged conflict between Wenger and Bould has something to do with our problems.. Both seem to have different ideologies.. and i still have a feeling that we are trying to do things quite differently from previous years, and this has resulted in our collapse..
could be the same 'Bould impact' which was praised highly after 3 clean sheets responsible for this..?

Yep. Maybe it could be that Wilson... Especially if you consider our offensive game nowadays. Maybe the new defensive style of Bould is affecting our imagination and creativity and work ethic going forward.

There's juz something "out of character" about the way we're playing now.

I'd much rather us lose when we're playing great, fast-flowing footy and creating lots of chances, than this present crap we're seeing.

@Wilson and El Gunner,

The problem is AW has always been of the understanding that if our opponents score 1, we'll score 2 - essentially disregarding that defensive aspect due to the strong belief of our attacking potency. Although this has worked in many season, it has now developed to a stage whereby we're conceding and not looking like actually scoring; or scoring and not defending.

Could The fact we have no DM been the problem? How come we weren't saying this after the first 6 games? Did Diaby give us that balance? Should we have signed M'Vila? Does the current 3 midfield players lack cohesion? Should we move to 4 in the middle? So many ifs and buts..