See how pretty his reaction is.how can you hate him
Ibra himself is the problem.he called mourinho a good person

That's the thing people who have hug ego/attitudes are the only one who have issues with Pep, Ibra/Eto'o/Mandzu, etc.

Bumping up a very old thread.

Considering how closely we followed Pep Guardiola since 2008 and have followed his career after he left Barcelona, just how high do we rate him today?

I think the criticism against him today is justified to some extent but it's also way too unfair to take away his credit.

2008-09 - He built what is arguably the best ever team and he did this from a team that was going nowhere and with not too much significant investment in the transfer market. The first time he achieved perfection.

2009-10 - He to some extent destroyed his own creation. Inserting Ibrahimovic in place of Eto'o meant compromising on our mobility and team play and blooding in Busquets at the deep end when he was still maturing while sidelining the well versed Yaya Toure. Had he not made these two changes it's not unthinkable that we would have won the UCL again and quite possibly won three in a row. After all a team much inferior to that team of ours is so close to doing that.

2010-11 - Corrected his mistakes and showed more successful innovation. Messi as the false number 9 was a masterstroke. Later when it was overdone it started causing problems but in its very first season it worked like a charm. The second time he achieved perfection.

2011-12 - Once again destroyed perfection. The shameless pursuit of Fabregas which never brought up anyone associated with it an iota of joy. Due to that we had an imbalanced midfield in which no one could play his role properly. To add to that Pep's stubborness of playing a three man defense. Years later coaches like Antonio Conte perfected this system but at that time it just did not work and Pep was too stubborn to change it. One more change he did that I did not like is its at this time that he converted the world's best team into a one man team. In his obsession with Messi he structured the team to play through Messi moving Xavi deeper making him less effective and pushing Iniesta towards the wing which was never his best position. Once again it's not unthinkable that had we not made these unnecessary changes including above all not bought Fabregas we could have won the UCL again. The purchase of Fabregas at that time eventually also led to us losing our brightest youth prospect of those days, Thiago.

Bayern Munich - Inherited the best team in the world but insisted on making too many changes too soon. That team could be sublime at times but was usually found wanting against the best of opposition. In a nut shell I would say in three years he never managed to create a team as good as the one he had inherited.

Manchester City - Took over when the team was in the doldrums. Took a year to get things really going. After that made them play the best football in their history and won the league in very dominant fashion. Still was found wanting in Europe probably due to his insistence on over-experimentation.


Conclusion - A truly innovative coach who can create perfection but whose propensity to experiment too much hurts his team quite often.

He is a coach with a 3-4 season expiry date. And he knows it well too.

His best seasons have been his 2nd and 3rd seasons and by 4th seasons you can see the sign of fatigue in the team as well as within himself. That's when he leaves while leaving the team in shambles.

2008-09: Iniesta's wonderstrike saved him in a match where Chelsea were head and shoulders better than Barcelona. Let's not even mention Øvrebø

2009-10: Lost to Inter in a match that he should have won. Luck wasn't on Barcelona's side because unlike the season before, they deserved to be in the final.

2010-11: Total domination. One of the best teams I have seen in my life.

2011-12: Going downhill. His fear of becoming predictable lead to over the board experimentation which lead to absolute failure.

Bayern and City: Trying too hard to bring his style to a team. Overspending and outspending his peers in the league. To me his stint at Bayern was a failure as even I would have won BundesLOL and DFB PokLOL as the head coach of Bayern. He failed, miserably against Barcelona and Real Madrid. Against Atlético however (3rd season) he should have made it to the final. His work at City has been received much better, as he took over from a pleb coach and spent twice as much as he did. Still in his first season he didn't do any better than Pellegrini did. This season he has dominated EPL and I predicated that a long time ago. Personally I think any good coach would have dominated EPL with this team too. Klopp, Conte, Allegri, Mourinho etc. would have won EPL alright.

He has failed in the CL in recent seasons but I look at performances and the quality of play. Results come after that for me. And when it comes to quality of play, no one comes close to Guardiola.

They lost yesterday against United but the level of play from City in the first half was breathtaking. The speed, the passing, the positioning and the movement. No one else can get his team to play at that sort of level. Sort of play that I wish we did.

The hyberbole. Yes, City murdered them in the first half but it's a lackadaisical United team under Mourinho that is trained to treat the ball as if it were a grenate and get rid of it as soon as possible. Sevilla killed them.

And I would certainly not be okay with "beautiful play over results", otherwise you turn into Arsenal. Results can not come for 1 or 2 seasons but not longer than that.

Really enjoyed reading very diverse opinion on this question. Thanks for the replies.

futbol wrote:The hyberbole. Yes, City murdered them in the first half but it's a lackadaisical United team under Mourinho that is trained to treat the ball as if it were a grenate and get rid of it as soon as possible. Sevilla killed them.

And I would certainly not be okay with "beautiful play over results", otherwise you turn into Arsenal. Results can not come for 1 or 2 seasons but not longer than that.

It is not hyperbole. I can pick multiple games. At peak level, name another manager who can get his teams to play as well? People said he couldnt do it outside Barca but he has done the same at Bayern and City. And before you talk results, I am not talking results. I am talking style and performance.

Compare that to Valverde. Under the mighty Valverde we struggle against the Leganes, Las Palmas, Roma's and Chelseas of the world. Cant even dominate scrubs and spend most games on the backfoot.
The crowning momnet yesterday was when we were trying to play out from the back at one point. There were 4 players in one line
Thats 4 players in one line. The complete antithesis of Cruyffian football.

I guess I differ from you in that results dont matter as much for me. All I care about is that we play the Cruyff way and the players give their all. As long as we do that, I am happy. If I want to see us PTB for results, might watch one of the Madrid sides.

Interesting posts...and Pep is such a fascinating coach to watch, add to that the clubs and players he can attract, and the rivalry with Mou, is just too much fun not to follow.

Probably as everyone has mentioned, he is a top coach, the best at what he is good at, getting his players to play that 'pure' entertaining football, at times its just a pleasure to watch. Also one of his best strengths is to get players that suit his style to perform at their best, so many players to name. But on the other hand he has some weaknesses that are still big, impacting results and against some top teams able to attack his teams weakness, which is unacceptable by many of his critics.

His major weaknesses - stubbornness and not flexible, lack of plan B, and the last one (although this is probably asking too much since perhaps a very attacking team just cant be expected to defend well also) is he just cant get his teams to defend well. Some of these weaknesses have probably been improved over the years, but some stick.

I would really want to see him last longer at Man C, the club is probably the best one he can be at, buying the young players he wants, building the team the way he wants, and not a club known to fire managers based on short term results. His way of playing tends to tire players, and the motivation thing running out after a few years, should be easier to manage with the young players that hes bought, and probably will continue to bring in, so it will be great to keep watching what happens, and again Mou being in similar situation at Man U, it just doesnt get any better than that

Atm though, I dont think can call him the best, hes right up there, but with some weaknesses hopefully he can continue to reduce and minimize.

Who would you guys says are the better coaches than Pep right now?

alexjanosik wrote:

futbol wrote:The hyberbole. Yes, City murdered them in the first half but it's a lackadaisical United team under Mourinho that is trained to treat the ball as if it were a grenate and get rid of it as soon as possible. Sevilla killed them.

And I would certainly not be okay with "beautiful play over results", otherwise you turn into Arsenal. Results can not come for 1 or 2 seasons but not longer than that.

It is not hyperbole. I can pick multiple games. At peak level, name another manager who can get his teams to play as well? People said he couldnt do it outside Barca but he has done the same at Bayern and City. And before you talk results, I am not talking results. I am talking style and performance.

Compare that to Valverde. Under the mighty Valverde we struggle against the Leganes, Las Palmas, Roma's and Chelseas of the world. Cant even dominate scrubs and spend most games on the backfoot.
The crowning momnet yesterday was when we were trying to play out from the back at one point. There were 4 players in one line
Thats 4 players in one line. The complete antithesis of Cruyffian football.

I guess I differ from you in that results dont matter as much for me. All I care about is that we play the Cruyff way and the players give their all. As long as we do that, I am happy. If I want to see us PTB for results, might watch one of the Madrid sides.

In what world is Real Madrid a PTB team? your "Cruyffian " snobbism exceeds that of Cruyff himself. He even said quality football is pointless without results.