Re: Sara carbonero depreciation thread

by Zealous Mon May 06, 2013 12:34 am

Iker is slowly but surely reaching Raul levels of influence. It's not a problem when we win but it starts to become annoying when we don't.

by FennecFox7 Mon May 06, 2013 12:35 am

Both are at fault here
Casillas is no saint in this and I do feel for mou in this situation. Mou's recent interview only added fuel to the fire though.
Mou screwed up tactic wise and giving us a sustainable style of football. that's my major beef with him

by Onyx Mon May 06, 2013 1:55 am

I'm sure Casillas didn't leak it purposely. He probably just said it to her since it's a personal thing. Then obviously with her being a journalist she just published it.

by Mr Nick09 Mon May 06, 2013 2:00 am

Did sara said something that the whole spanish press and medias wasnt aware of already?

are you lads serious? you guys act like she is the one who revealed that Mourinho had issues wth the players, even i knew that.

this is just a copout tbh

by sportsczy Mon May 06, 2013 6:57 am

So Mou can play politics and nobody else is allowed? If Mou was a straight up kind of guy and didn't use the media for political gains, i agree. But he's a massive snake. If you're going to be a snake like that.... then it's all fair game. mou dishes it out and people have every right to retaliate.

by Zealous Mon May 06, 2013 2:11 pm

Mou is the coach, he for better or worse should be given some leeway because it's his head on the chopping block. Besides we all know he was never going to stay here for that long anyway, his cycle here was 4 years maximum. Iker is effectively bigger than the club at this point and like I said that's fine when you're winning but it's annoying when you're not.

If he was preforming well this season I wouldn't have a problem with the politics, it's nothing I haven't seen before unfortunately, but the truth is he hasn't. From the start of the season when he gave Pepe a concussion trying to catch an incoming corner (he didn't catch the ball) to when he was being all prissy and not celebrating goals like he usually does causing unnecessary drama.

To top it all off we upgraded on him (based on performances this season) for 3.5 million with Diego Lopez. Mind you he hasn't even been playing great either, Diego has just been playing very well and it's been more than enough for us.

Now you have Pepe kissing Iker's ass so his face won't be next to a giant "For Sale" sign on the cover of Marca in the morning. He's reaching Raul levels of influence and personally I don't like it. For all the grief I give Ramos sometimes he has shown the he can tow the line and put the club first. I don't know what the fck Iker has been doing this season.

by sportsczy Mon May 06, 2013 2:58 pm

Oh come on. Iker never said a bad word towards Mou in the press. Ramos, on the other hand, did.

Also, Mou benched Iker for Adan, not Lopez. And how did Iker find out? He saw the team sheet 30 mins before the game. What a disgrace. Ramos would have been benchd if Pepe hadn't gotten injured too. It was coming.

Mou deserves no more leeway than a player or anyone else. If he's going to play dirty politics, he should accept it back. He tried to overpower Madrid and he failed. It's not his club. It's everyone's. It's not just a football club either; it's an institution. We're not an underdog club that will let you get away with anything you want because we've failed so much that we're starving for success. We have a tradition and history that everyone needs to respect. You can succeed... but you need to understand the values of the club, embrace them and assert power while understanding this.

Flo was desperate for success and hired Mou. I was hoping that Mou would adapt at least a little to the club... he didn't. So be it.

by Zealous Mon May 06, 2013 3:14 pm

sportsczy wrote:Oh come on. Iker never said a bad word towards Mou in the press. Ramos, on the other hand, did.

Ramos can say he had a good season overall. He played well and he can fall back on that, Iker can't.

sportsczy wrote:Also, Mou benched Iker for Adan, not Lopez. And how did Iker find out? He saw the team sheet 30 mins before the game. What a disgrace. Ramos would have been benchd if Pepe hadn't gotten injured too. It was coming.

Iker wasn't playing well, in fact I'd venture to say he was playing badly. Not even in a "by his standards" way he was objectively not playing well. HIm getting benched was only an issue because his name was Casillas. Mou using Adan was a power play but him getting benched for Lopez was 100% fair.

Ramos may have been benched as well but he was playing well so that stopped being an option for Jose. He justified his place and that's what Iker wasn't doing.

sportsczy wrote:Mou deserves no more leeway than a player or anyone else. If he's going to play dirty politics, he should accept it back. He tried to overpower Madrid and he failed. It's not his club. It's everyone's. It's not just a football club either; it's an institution. We're not an underdog club that will let you get away with anything you want because we've failed so much that we're starving for success. We have a tradition and history that everyone needs to respect. You can succeed... but you need to understand the values of the club, embrace them and assert power while understanding this.

The values of the club, would that include not benching Casillas? Honestly in the past few years the values of the club have been back stabbing and undermining authority but that is a different debate. Iker hasn't justified his status by on pitch performances, just the name on the back of his shirt. We upgraded his position with 3.5 million replacement.

Ramos had his stunts but he can at least point to games where he gave it his all and played very well, plus I don't think we can upgrade on Ramos by spending 3.5 million. Iker needs to be careful because imo this season proves he can be replaced without much fuss if he doesn't show us the Iker we know and love consistently.

sportsczy wrote:Flo was desperate for success and hired Mou. I was hoping that Mou would adapt at least a little to the club... he didn't. So be it.

I agree with this and Jose is far far far from faultless but none of that actually changes the fact that Iker had a shit season both on and off the pitch. He seems above the institution now.

by Pedram Mon May 06, 2013 3:44 pm

At a club like Real Madrid being legend does not guarantee you to be a automatic starter, here you don't play because you "have been" good.

by Zealous Mon May 06, 2013 3:57 pm

Pedram wrote:At a club like Real Madrid being legend does not guarantee you to be a automatic starter, here you don't play because you "have been" good.

What? Of course it does.

Raul in the past and now Casillas is on the same path. Marca crucified Pellegrini for benching Guti, us using a past it fat Ronaldo instead of putting trust in a young Eto'o. We have a long history of politics and favouritism when it comes to certain players.

by izzy Mon May 06, 2013 4:00 pm

Zealous wrote:
Pedram wrote:At a club like Real Madrid being legend does not guarantee you to be a automatic starter, here you don't play because you "have been" good.

What? Of course it does.

Raul in the past and now Casillas is on the same path. Marca crucified Pellegrini for benching Guti, us using a past it fat Ronaldo instead of putting trust in a young Eto'o. We have a long history of politics and favouritism when it comes to certain players.

I believe he means, It shouldn't have an effect at a club like Real Madrid. Very Happy

by Zealous Mon May 06, 2013 4:01 pm

izzy wrote:
Zealous wrote:
Pedram wrote:At a club like Real Madrid being legend does not guarantee you to be a automatic starter, here you don't play because you "have been" good.

What? Of course it does.

Raul in the past and now Casillas is on the same path. Marca crucified Pellegrini for benching Guti, us using a past it fat Ronaldo instead of putting trust in a young Eto'o. We have a long history of politics and favouritism when it comes to certain players.

I believe he means, It shouldn't have an effect at a club like Real Madrid.

Ideally yes but ideally I want Real Madrid to win the treble every season eco smile

by sportsczy Mon May 06, 2013 4:16 pm

Benching a legend is fine if you talk to him about it and do it in a respectful way. For a legend to find out 30 mins before a game is, frankly, disgraceful. That's when Iker started in earnest his behind the scenes war against Mou and Mou deserves every inch of it.

Z... i COMPLETELY disagree with you that Iker was having such a horrible season. By his standards, not a good one. But being benched for ADAN..... FRAKKIN ADAN. R U KIDDING ME? YOU THINK THIS HAD ANYTHING TO DO WITH ADAN BEING BETTER THAN IKER?

Give me a break.

And I'll add that Ramos was absolute garbage to start the season and has been bad for the most part until the Dormtund second leg. But he's been better than Pepe and Mou knew he couldn't survive benching both Iker and Ramos for no good reason...

by Pedram Mon May 06, 2013 4:19 pm

Zealous wrote:
Pedram wrote:At a club like Real Madrid being legend does not guarantee you to be a automatic starter, here you don't play because you "have been" good.

What? Of course it does.

Raul in the past and now Casillas is on the same path. Marca crucified Pellegrini for benching Guti, us using a past it fat Ronaldo instead of putting trust in a young Eto'o. We have a long history of politics and favouritism when it comes to certain players.

Yeah i know but i think we shouldn't be like this, really what Casillas has done this season to prove he deserves to start ? he's not complaining about being benched but all the media are backing him, you see his face on the bench every time Diego Lopez concede a goal or make a mistake, it's getting annoying really.

by sportsczy Mon May 06, 2013 4:27 pm

I really have a hard time reading Madrid fans talking about Iker like this. Very sad really... and defending that prick Mourinho to the expense of Iker.

And btw, after Mou used Adan, he dropped him so hard that Adan suffered from a depression.

by izzy Mon May 06, 2013 4:32 pm

sportsczy wrote:I really have a hard time reading Madrid fans talking about Iker like this. Very sad really... and defending that prick Mourinho to the expense of Iker.

And btw, after Mou used Adan, he dropped him so hard that Adan suffered from a depression.

That's not fair.
You're acting like some of us haven't seen situations like this happen at the club in the past. It's frustrating. It's annoying and absolutely pathetic and ridiculous that GROWN MEN act like this.

We've always been told that it's the coach who's to blame, we need to make a change, he did this wrong etc etc. No one here is disagreeing that most of the blame falls heavily on Mou for this particular situation but Mou or not, it ALWAYS at Madrid, ALWAYS seems to be the coachs fault. 100% of the blame always lands on the coach.

It's a joke really.

by Mamad Mon May 06, 2013 4:34 pm

Me too sports. i can't believe Madrid fans are actually buying Mou's lies.

I trust Iker as a good person and a legend. he has earned it. but Mou? he is a liar, hypocrite and selfish person.

He benched Iker because Iker wasn't acting like his bitch and he got mad.

actually my respect for Iker has grown even more after what happened this season.

by VanDeezNuts Mon May 06, 2013 4:34 pm

on the other hand this 'iker can do no harm' kind of talk is hard to read as well.

iker isnt perfect, he may be close, but he isnt perfect.

by Pedram Mon May 06, 2013 4:35 pm

sportsczy wrote:I really have a hard time reading Madrid fans talking about Iker like this. Very sad really... and defending that prick Mourinho to the expense of Iker.

And btw, after Mou used Adan, he dropped him so hard that Adan suffered from a depression.

Where i defended Mourinho ? i admire Casillas a lot, he's one of my favorite players but he didn't give me any reason this season to believe he's benched undeservedly.

by izzy Mon May 06, 2013 4:35 pm

Mamad wrote:Me too sports. i can't believe Madrid fans are actually buying Mou's lies.

I trust Iker as a good person and a legend. he has earned it. but Mou? he is a liar, hypocrite and selfish person.

He benched Iker because Iker wasn't acting like his bitch and he got mad.

actually my respect for Iker has grown even more after what happened this season.

Talk like this is what is hard to read as well.

by Zealous Mon May 06, 2013 4:41 pm

[quote="sportsczy"]Benching a legend is fine if you talk to him about it and do it in a respectful way. For a legend to find out 30 mins before a game is, frankly, disgraceful. That's when Iker started in earnest his behind the scenes war against Mou and Mou deserves every inch of it.

Z... i COMPLETELY disagree with you that Iker was having such a horrible season. By his standards, not a good one. But being benched for ADAN..... FRAKKIN ADAN. R U KIDDING ME? YOU THINK THIS HAD ANYTHING TO DO WITH ADAN BEING BETTER THAN IKER?[/qoute]

That's on Mou. Doesn't change the fact that Iker has been bad. DIego has been much better than him.

Adan was a power play but Iker deserved to be benched and there wasn't a goal keeper on the squad who could justify starting. Enter Diego Lopez and suddenly or defence looked healthier.

sportsczy wrote:Give me a break.

And I'll add that Ramos was absolute garbage to start the season and has been bad for the most part until the Dormtund second leg. But he's been better than Pepe and Mou knew he couldn't survive benching both Iker and Ramos for no good reason...

Ramos had rough patches and was even benched for Varane in the Man City game, difference is he made a truce with Jose and played well for a sustained period. He was smart enough to know he wasn't playing as good as he should be so he decided to drop the politics BS and focus on the team, when that happened Ramos was the starter at CB and only moved to RB in Dortmund because we had no options. In the second leg he strated at CB.

I said it a bunch of times now I'll begrudgingly accept politics but only if you play well to compensate. Ramos didn't but he stopped his stunts, put the team first and justified his starting place. Iker didn't, sure he got unlucky with his injury but Iker inspire much before the injury. It'll be interesting to see if Lopez keeps his place next season (imo he should) somehow I get the feeling it'll be get handed to Iker again.

by Zealous Mon May 06, 2013 4:43 pm

Mamad wrote:Me too sports. i can't believe Madrid fans are actually buying Mou's lies.

I trust Iker as a good person and a legend. he has earned it. but Mou? he is a liar, hypocrite and selfish person.

He benched Iker because Iker wasn't acting like his bitch and he got mad.

actually my respect for Iker has grown even more after what happened this season.

Iker got benched because he was playing badly, D.Lopez has made him look like Adan this season. Iker's a club icon but he hasn't played like one this season.

by sportsczy Mon May 06, 2013 4:45 pm

If Iker was benched for Lopez... no problem. Fair game as there's a a good argument that Lopez could be better (and has been). When Ramos was benched for Varane... again, not a problem. There's was a sporting reason to it.

But there's absolutely zero sporting reason for Iker to get benched in favor of Adan. Not one. You guys do realize that Iker was benched for Adan and not Lopez initially, right?

All politically driven for the exact reason that Mamad mentioned.

AGAIN, IKER WAS BENCHED FOR ADAN, NOT LOPEZ!

by izzy Mon May 06, 2013 4:49 pm

sportsczy wrote:If Iker was benched for Lopez... no problem. Fair game as there's a a good argument that Lopez could be better (and has been). When Ramos was benched for Varane... again, not a problem. There's was a sporting reason to it.

But there's absolutely zero sporting reason for Iker to get benched in favor of Adan. Not one. You guys do realize that Iker was benched for Adan and not Lopez initially, right?

All politically driven for the exact reason that Mamad mentioned.

AGAIN, IKER WAS BENCHED FOR ADAN, NOT LOPEZ!

So what you're saying is, because a footballer and coach got involved with the politics of the club and instead of focusing on what they're paid to do, it led to this nonsense?

Benching Iker for Adan was a disgrace, no doubt about it, but why was Iker in a position to get benched?

2 reasons:
Politics
Performance
Both in which he was not performing great in to say the least.

by Zealous Mon May 06, 2013 4:51 pm

I'll just leave you with this, sleazy team politics is 100% expected from Mou so for him he's just confirming what people already knew and expected. Iker is supposed to be the hero/Icon of Madrid/Spain and it's his image who suffers in the end.

by sportsczy Mon May 06, 2013 4:53 pm

What did Iker say before being benched or after... point to one newspaper article quoting Iker as saying anything negative towards Mou. I dare you.

In fact, after the benching, iker specifically came out saying that he's not bigger than the club, that everyone should support the manager and that he need to fight to get his job back.

The only dirty politics here are from Mou and he got a nice dose of it back. It's so bad that he gets booed at every home game and rarely walk out of the protected area because people yell insults at him. He's hated and deservedly so.

My only point is that Mou played hard politics and, thus, should not whine or complain when he's being challenged with hard politics. He wants to be unquestioned and unopposed.... wrong club for that. You earn respect and love. You don't get it automatically. You can also lose it very quickly if you misbehave.

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