so we all agree godin is the best cb in the world right?

?

why?

No. Wes Morgan is.

Excuse me?

I moved the thread, this has RB section written all over it.

As for the question, he is one of the best, but I am not sure he is the best.

I hope people don't still think Silva is the best CB. Godin has a better case than him.

Jérôme Boateng says hi ^^

CBs are so hard to judge that debating who's the best is a bit pointless.

RealGunner wrote:why?

his atheltism, tackling aerial ability, and leadership.

Doc wrote:Excuse me?

sorry.

rwo power wrote:Jérôme Boateng says hi ^^

Hi.

Art Morte wrote:CBs are so hard to judge that debating who's the best is a bit pointless.

OK.

halamadrid2 wrote:I have to judge him outside of Atleti. They even make Juanfran and Luis look decent who are both poor

I like Jimenez though. If i had to choose one i would choose him

How bout...his country? The man is the leader of one of the best defenses in club football and one of the best in international football ffs.

Since when did Rebs become Uruguayan

Rebs wrote:

rwo power wrote:Jérôme Boateng says hi ^^

Hi.

Art Morte wrote:CBs are so hard to judge that debating who's the best is a bit pointless.

OK.

Ffs Rebs

rwo power wrote:Jérôme Boateng says hi ^^

Messi winks.

the problem with people and judging defenders is exactly what is happening in these posts.
one or two incidents dictates what happens to those players.. it's like saying ronaldo is the worst forward because he shoots 30 shots per goal.

if he were a defender he'd be rated like david luiz.

when you see who people vote as greatest defenders in modern game you recognize that the people saying godin or thiago silva are typically the people who never watch those players play other than the odd quarter/semi final games in big games..

or then you have the idiots saying sanchez can play better in defense because he tackled messi that one time but that other defender couldn't do that..
but thats another story.

Some dumb people dont even get the point of an argument

On topic i think pepe is when he is on form

nazimali12 wrote:Some dumb people dont even get the point of an argument

On topic i think pepe is when he is on form

You mean, when the ref allows him to do whatever he pleases without getting booked? Pepe has gotten wiser with age. He's still reckless and he'll never be an intelligent player, nor will he ever have the composure of someone like Varane, but he's definitely improved his decision-making to a certain degree.

His speed has declined significantly over the years. He used to be the second fastest Real Madrid player after Arjen Robben, but nowadays he just fouls whoever manages to run past him. His physicality and aggressiveness have always been his main strengths, but they've also been his main weaknesses.

In a sense, I've always admired Pepe for his talents and devotion as an athlete. Obviously, I've never been a fan of his antics and occasional savagery, and he's made me pull my hair out on several occasions, but he's is the type of player who puts his heart and soul into his performances when it matters most.. for better or worse.

I definitely think Pepe would've been among the best defenders in the world if he had more intelligence and composure, but since he doesn't, it's hard to predict whether he'll be someone you can rely on to dominate with his physicality, or someone who burdens his team with poor judgement. Guti and Pepe are two completely different types of players, but I think they have in common that they both look absolutely world class when the circumstances allow it.

Thimmy wrote:

nazimali12 wrote:Some dumb people dont even get the point of an argument

On topic i think pepe is when he is on form

You mean, when the ref allows him to do whatever he pleases without getting booked? Pepe has gotten wiser with age. He's still reckless and he'll never be an intelligent player, nor will he ever have the composure of someone like Varane, but he's definitely improved his decision-making to a certain degree.

His speed has declined significantly over the years. He used to be the second fastest Real Madrid player after Arjen Robben, but nowadays he just fouls whoever manages to run past him. His physicality and aggressiveness have always been his main strengths, but they've also been his main weaknesses.

In a sense, I've always admired Pepe for his talents and devotion as an athlete. Obviously, I've never been a fan of his antics and occasional savagery, and he's made me pull my hair out on several occasions, but he's is the type of player who puts his heart and soul into his performances when it matters most.. for better or worse.

I definitely think Pepe would've been among the best defenders in the world if he had more intelligence and composure, but since he doesn't, it's hard to predict whether he'll be someone you can rely on to dominate with his physicality, or someone who burdens his team with poor judgement. Guti and Pepe are two completely different types of players, but I think they have in common that they both look absolutely world class when the circumstances allow it.

yeah you described Pepe well. If circumstances allow he is the best.but theres no complete defender.if one is physical and agressive he will be dumb.if one is intelligent he will be less agressive and physical

nazimali12 wrote:

Thimmy wrote:

nazimali12 wrote:Some dumb people dont even get the point of an argument

On topic i think pepe is when he is on form

You mean, when the ref allows him to do whatever he pleases without getting booked? Pepe has gotten wiser with age. He's still reckless and he'll never be an intelligent player, nor will he ever have the composure of someone like Varane, but he's definitely improved his decision-making to a certain degree.

His speed has declined significantly over the years. He used to be the second fastest Real Madrid player after Arjen Robben, but nowadays he just fouls whoever manages to run past him. His physicality and aggressiveness have always been his main strengths, but they've also been his main weaknesses.

In a sense, I've always admired Pepe for his talents and devotion as an athlete. Obviously, I've never been a fan of his antics and occasional savagery, and he's made me pull my hair out on several occasions, but he's is the type of player who puts his heart and soul into his performances when it matters most.. for better or worse.

I definitely think Pepe would've been among the best defenders in the world if he had more intelligence and composure, but since he doesn't, it's hard to predict whether he'll be someone you can rely on to dominate with his physicality, or someone who burdens his team with poor judgement. Guti and Pepe are two completely different types of players, but I think they have in common that they both look absolutely world class when the circumstances allow it.

yeah you described Pepe well. If circumstances allow he is the best.but theres no complete defender.if one is physical and agressive he will be dumb.if one is intelligent he will be less agressive and physical

Well, I think the best defenders in the history of the game, mostly all had a relatively intelligent approach to using their physicality to their advantage in defensive situations. Even Milan's Nesta, who was already in his mid to late 30s during the clash between AC Milan and Barcelona back in 2010, managed to contain Messi relatively well by reading the game, timing his tackles and keeping his composure. Class act, that guy.

Thimmy wrote:

nazimali12 wrote:

Thimmy wrote:

You mean, when the ref allows him to do whatever he pleases without getting booked? Pepe has gotten wiser with age. He's still reckless and he'll never be an intelligent player, nor will he ever have the composure of someone like Varane, but he's definitely improved his decision-making to a certain degree.

His speed has declined significantly over the years. He used to be the second fastest Real Madrid player after Arjen Robben, but nowadays he just fouls whoever manages to run past him. His physicality and aggressiveness have always been his main strengths, but they've also been his main weaknesses.

In a sense, I've always admired Pepe for his talents and devotion as an athlete. Obviously, I've never been a fan of his antics and occasional savagery, and he's made me pull my hair out on several occasions, but he's is the type of player who puts his heart and soul into his performances when it matters most.. for better or worse.

I definitely think Pepe would've been among the best defenders in the world if he had more intelligence and composure, but since he doesn't, it's hard to predict whether he'll be someone you can rely on to dominate with his physicality, or someone who burdens his team with poor judgement. Guti and Pepe are two completely different types of players, but I think they have in common that they both look absolutely world class when the circumstances allow it.

yeah you described Pepe well. If circumstances allow he is the best.but theres no complete defender.if one is physical and agressive he will be dumb.if one is intelligent he will be less agressive and physical

Well, I think the best defenders in the history of the game, mostly all had a relatively intelligent approach to using their physicality to their advantage in defensive situations. Even Milan's Nesta, who was already in his mid to late 30s during the clash between AC Milan and Barcelona back in 2010, managed to contain Messi relatively well by reading the game, timing his tackles and keeping his composure. Class act, that guy.

Well Nesta was too old and slow to stop messi. His magical tackle was amazing to watch but messi beat him many times in that leg and he even got yellow for shirt pulling. Pepe is the one who is most successful against messi, he uses aggressive and dirty humiliating tactics to stop him. In the last clasico he was against neymar many times and neymar who is the most on form runner/dribbler currently could not get past him. when he hates he stops anyone

nazimali12 wrote:

Thimmy wrote:

nazimali12 wrote: yeah you described Pepe well. If circumstances allow he is the best.but theres no complete defender.if one is physical and agressive he will be dumb.if one is intelligent he will be less agressive and physical

Well, I think the best defenders in the history of the game, mostly all had a relatively intelligent approach to using their physicality to their advantage in defensive situations. Even Milan's Nesta, who was already in his mid to late 30s during the clash between AC Milan and Barcelona back in 2010, managed to contain Messi relatively well by reading the game, timing his tackles and keeping his composure. Class act, that guy.

Well Nesta was too old and slow to stop messi. His magical tackle was amazing to watch but messi beat him many times in that leg and he even got yellow for shirt pulling. Pepe is the one who is most successful against messi, he uses aggressive and dirty humiliating tactics to stop him. In the last clasico he was against neymar many times and neymar who is the most on form runner/dribbler currently could not get past him. when he hates he stops anyone

Well, I'd argue that he kept Messi very quiet over two legs. It ended in a penalty shoot-out, after all.

I'm not sure that Godin is the best CB in the world, but he sure is much better than Pepe. Different level altogether.

Thimmy wrote:

nazimali12 wrote:

Thimmy wrote:

Well, I think the best defenders in the history of the game, mostly all had a relatively intelligent approach to using their physicality to their advantage in defensive situations. Even Milan's Nesta, who was already in his mid to late 30s during the clash between AC Milan and Barcelona back in 2010, managed to contain Messi relatively well by reading the game, timing his tackles and keeping his composure. Class act, that guy.

Well Nesta was too old and slow to stop messi. His magical tackle was amazing to watch but messi beat him many times in that leg and he even got yellow for shirt pulling. Pepe is the one who is most successful against messi, he uses aggressive and dirty humiliating tactics to stop him. In the last clasico he was against neymar many times and neymar who is the most on form runner/dribbler currently could not get past him. when he hates he stops anyone

Well, I'd argue that he kept Messi very quiet over two legs. It ended in a penalty shoot-out, after all.

nesta stopping messi was a nostalgia. here you can see messi dribbled him like 10 times, and when he stopped him he made fouls

nazimali12 wrote:

Thimmy wrote:

nazimali12 wrote: Well Nesta was too old and slow to stop messi. His magical tackle was amazing to watch but messi beat him many times in that leg and he even got yellow for shirt pulling. Pepe is the one who is most successful against messi, he uses aggressive and dirty humiliating tactics to stop him. In the last clasico he was against neymar many times and neymar who is the most on form runner/dribbler currently could not get past him. when he hates he stops anyone

Well, I'd argue that he kept Messi very quiet over two legs. It ended in a penalty shoot-out, after all.

nesta stopping messi was a nostalgia. here you can see messi dribbled him like 10 times, and when he stopped him he made fouls

It's not really nostalgia It occured only 5-6 years ago, and I'm not an AC Milan supporter. I had expected Barcelona to steamroll Milan, but they didn't really do that. Messi, who was 22 at the time, should've been able to run in circles around a much taller, aging player like Nesta, and at times that's exactly what he did.

However, Nesta managed to the minimize the potential damage that Messi could've caused, and he did so without resorting to unnecessary fouling and overly aggressive challenges - and he did so, despite the massive difference in mobility between himself and Messi. Nesta kept his cool for the most part, and he dealt with Messi far better than what you'd expect from a player who would go on to retire 3 years later, at the age of 39.

I figured it was relevant to refer to him, since Pepe who's also no longer a young player, in contrast, doesn't seem to understand that he no longer has the pace to keep up with faster players, and his attempts to compensate for it through demonstration of sheer strength and desperate fouling won't get him through a full match without punishment. Like I've stated before, Pepe's devotion is admirable, but unlike other great defenders he doesn't know how to use his talent efficiently. All players make mistakes every now and then, but Pepe doesn't seem aware of what kind of mistakes he makes. And that makes him so unreliable that I just can't rate him among the best defenders, despite his physical talent.

Thimmy wrote:

nazimali12 wrote:

Thimmy wrote:


Well, I'd argue that he kept Messi very quiet over two legs. It ended in a penalty shoot-out, after all.

nesta stopping messi was a nostalgia. here you can see messi dribbled him like 10 times, and when he stopped him he made fouls

It's not really nostalgia It occured only 5-6 years ago, and I'm not an AC Milan supporter. I had expected Barcelona to steamroll Milan, but they didn't really do that. Messi, who was 22 at the time, should've been able to run in circles around a much taller, aging player like Nesta, and at times that's exactly what he did.

However, Nesta managed to the minimize the potential damage that Messi could've caused, and he did so without resorting to unnecessary fouling and overly aggressive challenges - and he did so, despite the massive difference in mobility between himself and Messi. Nesta kept his cool for the most part, and he dealt with Messi far better than what you'd expect from a player who would go on to retire 3 years later, at the age of 39.

I figured it was relevant to refer to him, since Pepe who's also no longer a young player, in contrast, doesn't seem to understand that he no longer has the pace to keep up with faster players, and his attempts to compensate for it through demonstration of sheer strength and desperate fouling won't get him through a full match without punishment.

its ture that messi had bigger standarts at that time.at least at dribbling. People wanted him to run circles around nesta.but many years later we can see that he actually did good against nesta. Today messi is a bit older and slower we dont expect him show magics.just score his tapin and make one assist its enough. Its possible that nesta did better than most defenders at that time but it was not complete shut down or keeping quiet

But we can all agree that 39 years old nesta was not better than pepe. Otherwise perez would sign him

Pepe is 33 according to wikipedia. I know I would've preferred 33 year old Nesta over Pepe any day But then again, I just don't like to rely on players like Pepe, whose erratic performances make them unreliable in the long term.