Ronaldo Phenomeno Vs Lionel Messi

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Ronaldo Vs Messi

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Post by The BoyWonder Fri 10 Jun 2011 - 17:42

Beautiful Football wrote:
Yuri Yukuv wrote:Ronaldo was kicked around in two serie A games more than in messis life.

Now messi is far smarter than ronaldo in this category hence he is injury free for last three years.

BEST POST EVER... :lol!:

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Post by The Madrid One Fri 10 Jun 2011 - 17:54

hm this conversation got interesting.. doesnt the fact that ronaldo did what he did at the wc hold a special factor in this bout?

@ age 21 or so he was ripping wc in side out
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Post by Albiceleste Fri 10 Jun 2011 - 18:46

Yuri you're arguments are quite sad really
"Ronaldo does everything like a god and [insert downplay of Messi here]"

"Pepe stopped Messi! Ronaldo just danced through every serie a defense and was unstoppable"

"Ronaldo took more kicks in one millisecond of playing in the serie a then Messi's entire career!"

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Post by Albiceleste Fri 10 Jun 2011 - 18:47

The Madrid One wrote:hm this conversation got interesting.. doesnt the fact that ronaldo did what he did at the wc hold a special factor in this bout?

@ age 21 or so he was ripping wc in side out
Does the fact that he never won a champions league hold a special factor in this bout? Also I believe with the help of Dinho, Cafu, Rivaldo, Kaka, Roberto Carlos and Juninho they won the world cup

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Post by Yuri Yukuv Fri 10 Jun 2011 - 18:58

I actually dont understand why you guys are being so sensitive, barcafandani and buitre echo my sentiments exactly. Why are you not jumping on their backs? Ronnie's career was a tale of two halves. I never said unstoppable, his work ethic and his injuries certainly stopped him. When he was on the pitch though he was unmarkable, which is one of the best traits you can ever have, its god sent.

The Franchise wrote: The pre inury Ronado was the best player I have ever seen.

Could be getting the dates wrong, but his first season at Inter (99?) and backwards, there was noone I ever seen as devastating and as uncontrollable as him.

There was no answer for him.

I brought up the kicks because billion discounted the defenders that did it to messi, when in fact it happened loads more to ronnie.

I have a feeling this is more of a personal vendetta against me, ive received 20+ negative reps on this thread alone.


Last edited by Yuri Yukuv on Fri 10 Jun 2011 - 19:06; edited 1 time in total
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Post by Doc Fri 10 Jun 2011 - 19:04

Ronaldo 1st season was in 1997 and not 99 Yuri.
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Post by Yuri Yukuv Fri 10 Jun 2011 - 19:05

Doc wrote:Ronaldo 1st season was in 1997 and not 99 Yuri.

Thats barcafandani's quote not mine.

Ill edit in, seems to be unclear.
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Post by The Franchise Fri 10 Jun 2011 - 19:12

Yes, got the dates wrong. Not Ronaldo's first season, but from 1999 backwards, basically pre-injury was my point.

But yeah, on this Pepe-Messi thing.

First of all, if Messi was kept quite by Pepe, this cannot be the reason Ronaldo was better (bare in mind I did say Ronaldo was better) because we could easily go back and dig up a game in which Ronaldo was "stopped" by a player.

Second, Messi not scoring while Pepe was on the pitch does not equal him being stopped, you know this.

Pepe fouled more then he won clean tackles, that alone tells you something about what happened. That video clearly shows Messi going past Pepe and with Pepe being no threat to him whatsoever. I like Pepe, but lets not make him out to be something he isnt.
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Post by Doc Fri 10 Jun 2011 - 19:16

Yeah, one cannot really stop Messi but I still believe Pepe had an influence in frustrating Messi's natural game. It wasn't all that clean though but I've seen worse hatchet jobs.

Pre injury Ronaldo was still honestly unreal though. Nothing I could compare with any player today.
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Post by Yuri Yukuv Fri 10 Jun 2011 - 19:26

The Franchise wrote:Yes, got the dates wrong. Not Ronaldo's first season, but from 1999 backwards, basically pre-injury was my point.

But yeah, on this Pepe-Messi thing.

First of all, if Messi was kept quite by Pepe, this cannot be the reason Ronaldo was better (bare in mind I did say Ronaldo was better) because we could easily go back and dig up a game in which Ronaldo was "stopped" by a player.

Second, Messi not scoring while Pepe was on the pitch does not equal him being stopped, you know this.

Pepe fouled more then he won clean tackles, that alone tells you something about what happened. That video clearly shows Messi going past Pepe and with Pepe being no threat to him whatsoever. I like Pepe, but lets not make him out to be something he isnt.

But you did state following your claim that he is the best player you have ever seen that ronnie was uncontrollable, devastating and that there was no answer to him. That this was indeed what made him above others. Can you explain this further?

I hope you dont change your position just because this opinion has become suddenly unpopular with fellow barcelona fans.
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Post by The Madrid One Fri 10 Jun 2011 - 19:28

Lionel Messi wrote:
The Madrid One wrote:hm this conversation got interesting.. doesnt the fact that ronaldo did what he did at the wc hold a special factor in this bout?

@ age 21 or so he was ripping wc in side out
Does the fact that he never won a champions league hold a special factor in this bout? Also I believe with the help of Dinho, Cafu, Rivaldo, Kaka, Roberto Carlos and Juninho they won the world cup

not down to him that he didnt win the cl, but it is down to him that his team won the world cup.

15 goals more than anyone in history. shows it for it self.

2 goals in world cup final.

best player in world cup history, and cut short due to injury.

messi may have amazing dribbling skills, but ronaldo had better pace, strength, and shot skills
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Post by billionmillion Fri 10 Jun 2011 - 20:35

Messi is midfielder but has equal scoring abilities.
if you say ronaldo is the best player in wc history because of his 15 goals then messi is the best player in club history. 3 times CL top-scorer, equalled v.nistelroy's record, won 3 CL, scored in 2 cl finals, and other la liga titles.
You will admit it after messi retires. but for now r9 is better player because he was your favorite player when you were a kid or he played for your club. thats all
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Post by billionmillion Fri 10 Jun 2011 - 21:07

I dont downplay ronaldo. i think messi and ronaldo equal at talent and football abilities. only thing puts messi ahead is his midfield abilities and passes. messi can play everywhere in attack, left wing, right wing, midfielder, striker. Thats why messi is better

and this season messi scored more than pure strikers and assisted more than pure midfielders. only player that comparable to messi is maradona, they almost played in same position and did it successfully, only difference is messi is better scorer maradona is better midfielder
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Post by billionmillion Fri 10 Jun 2011 - 21:22

And Gagarin says Messi lost balls against pepe but ronaldo was unstoppable and never lost balls in his prime. this just an example how he played against r.madrid in 1996 (at his prime)


Show me a moment that r9 dribbled someone in that game..whenever he tried to dribble he lost the ball. (at least messi dribbled 3-4 times vs r.madrid) .yeah as gagarin said ronaldo was unstoppable, unmarkable, no defender could stop him. where is proove?

of course this is just example, r9 was great player with great style, i rate him better than zidane and i raised watching him. but saying that he was unstoppable is just ridiculous
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Post by cositomilan Fri 10 Jun 2011 - 21:30

well they are both fantastic but i would choose ronaldo because he proof himself in 4 different leagues and came out on top always......... even in the BRAZILIAN national team he was the star and won the world cup i think mess is one of a kind but it seems that he cannot prove himself with any other but BARCA so in that sense RONALDO TAKES MY VOTE :lol!: :lol!: :lol!:
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Post by Yuri Yukuv Fri 10 Jun 2011 - 21:45

Actually ronnie went past hierro 4 or 5 times that game. It was the game @ barca for the CDR no? Scored a gol too



It was incredible how he always received the ball almost at the half line and he would take it to the penalty box with 6 players infront of him, always direct to goal!

This is the other leg of that match



I really thought he would give up, the post prevented him from a hattrick. But the end guy used the opposition player as a post and had his revenge Suspect

Oh my did I hate him that moment, him and his cheeky smile.
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Post by billionmillion Fri 10 Jun 2011 - 21:57

i was going to post CDR match too, you posted it already. see how many times he loses the ball, but what you said before is ridiculous, he is unstoppable, unplayable, no defender can stop him but pepe can stop messi. yes ronaldo went past hierro 1 or 2 times in that game (but lost more). getting past hierro proves that he is better player? i think today's pepe is better defender than hierro

watch again when he gets past hierro, hierro even doesnt move or run, at least pepe would foul him

and in CDR match he wasted too many open chances, and interesting thing is that you gave him credit beacuse he hit the post (when he should have scored)

you will give him credit even he smiles and you will close your eyes when messi owns half of madrid players and passes it to pedro lol
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Post by Yuri Yukuv Fri 10 Jun 2011 - 22:15

How is pepe better than hierro? Iniesta is also better than zidane for you, I never understood your logic. Real Madrid was a vastly superior side to barcelona that year and ronaldo took barcelona to second with 2 points difference and the Copa final, the next year real madrid had some injuries and they concentrated on the CL (which they won). I never said that he never lost balls, I said he was unmarkable. he could always lose his marker through his runs and he would go straight towards goal and would accurately shoot from distance. Thats a great gift and I think thats what is not going through to you.

Messi was forced into making lateral runs, he would play deeper and then he would release the ball at the right moment. Which is by the way the same thing that happens to him when he is with argentina alot of the time, its like he mentally shifts. Thats very different than what ronaldo did when faced marking, ronaldo was like a rhino he just barged through, sometimes it worked sometimes it didnt but it always got him somewhere, he would pin back defenders and create a chasm like no other.

I dont get whatsup with this strategy of placing words in my mouth.

Mourinho himself said that the only player that would have broken his system with inter would be Ronaldo 9.
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Post by billionmillion Fri 10 Jun 2011 - 22:23

i cant find any logic in your post, some years ago when madrid was ripping barcelona messi saved them scoring a hat-trick.
Ronaldo's tricks sometimes worked sometimes not. In the videos that you posted it didnt work most of time. can you count how many times he failed when he tried to dribble?
Also when Messi was free like ronaldo? see the videos again ronaldo always was face to face with casillas, or with any other defenders, but r.madrid defended with 7 men against messi (when he get the ball at least 3 defenders surrounded him). of course playing against Mourinho's defending tactics is different than playing an attacking madrid of 1996. Still Messi did better vs parking bus team than Ronaldo did against attacking team

Messi is quicker, Ronaldo was faster. I think in football to be quick is more important than to be fast. Because during a match

Quickness needed - everytime you receive the ball
Fastness needed - whenever you find space to run

its clear to see that messi plays better under pressure and in difficult moments when he surrounded by 2-3 defenders. Ronaldo cant maybe because he was tall or his ass was bigger

and when i watch both players games vs other teams i feel that to get the ball from messi is harder than to get it from ronaldo. because of the reason that i mentioned above
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Post by Yuri Yukuv Fri 10 Jun 2011 - 22:37

As a possesion keeper? Messi def takes it.

The thing is as you said messis quickness enables him to go past defenders when receiving the ball from outside the box. The thing is if you push messi back through cutting supply and he has to become more direct and faster to go through space he didnt fare too well. He would begin going side to side, he begins attracting defenders to him and then releasing the ball, his style of play changes.

If you cut off the supply from ronaldo he would retreat back and he would rape you with his speed, he was the type of player who would create magic even when his team was being dominated and pushed back.

Anyways this is a subjective matter, I value his unpredictability, his speed and the way he broke the offside trap very highly if you dont thats up to you billion.

No hard feelings, nothing personal here.
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Post by The BoyWonder Fri 10 Jun 2011 - 22:40

So far it has been fun...here is my example:

''Ronaldo owned a young Maldini in his prime during his time in Serie A....Messi was made invincible by a 36 year old Zanetti.''

:lol!:

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Post by billionmillion Fri 10 Jun 2011 - 22:57

Yuri Yukuv wrote:As a possesion keeper? Messi def takes it.

The thing is as you said messis quickness enables him to go past defenders when receiving the ball from outside the box. The thing is if you push messi back through cutting supply and he has to become more direct and faster to go through space he didnt fare too well. He would begin going side to side, he begins attracting defenders to him and then releasing the ball, his style of play changes.

If you cut off the supply from ronaldo he would retreat back and he would rape you with his speed, he was the type of player who would create magic even when his team was being dominated and pushed back.

Anyways this is a subjective matter, I value his unpredictability, his speed and the way he broke the offside trap very highly if you dont thats up to you billion.

No hard feelings, nothing personal here.
its your and my opinion but the thing is that you forgot r9 bad moments and you remember only his magics and runs, you say he would rape defenders with his speed, he would score against every team and never fail and etc. discuss it after 14 years you will only remember messi's goal against getafe, his goal vs madrid, his long runs and assists, and someone will come and say messi was best ever, messi could dribble 10 players every game (though he didnt do it every game) or messi could score ridiculous goals he never lose balls, he always chip goalkeepers (though he failed several times)
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Post by SaintJoe Tue 14 Jun 2011 - 5:40

Ronaldo Phenomeno pre-injury was the best player the world has ever seen.



I'll make a shrine to him someday
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