UCL Ro16 2021/22 | PSG vs Real Madrid

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Post by El Gunner Wed Feb 16, 2022 7:47 am

danyjr wrote:@El Gunner What I'm trying to say is that he may have been declining since 2016 but you can't compare 2022 Messi to 2017 Messi. 2017 Messi was thrice the player he is now.

i understand, and i agree with you. All I'm saying is then you should adjust your expectations relative to that. Because you seem to be taking it to the extreme by saying he is so shit he should be benched. Laughing

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Post by Casciavit Wed Feb 16, 2022 8:18 am

True he was way better than Di Maria last night
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Post by Mamad Wed Feb 16, 2022 9:24 am

What bothers me the most is that PSG is a level below likes of Bayern, City and Liverpool. and still dominated us.

Just like Barca did in supercopa or Villareal at first Half this week. or Bilbao did in san mames last week. we get dominated by such teams and expect to win CL Laughing  Laughing . Ancelotti has lost it. just like Mourinho.

No matter how good a player is, when he reaches 37 he can't function at elite level. specially in midfield. Modric was a ghost. Valverde could have been a way better option.

Also how can you play Asensio when you have Isco, Hazard and Bale on the bench is beyond me. them at 25% are still better than Asensio.

Anyway i hope we win in Bernabeu but honestly that would be a shock considering how bad we are and the old fart sitting on our bench as coach.
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Post by Harmonica Wed Feb 16, 2022 9:39 am

Haven't seen Refdrid this dominated since 5-0 tbh, they couldn't do anything.

Mamad wrote:What bothers me the most is that PSG is a level below likes of Bayern, City and Liverpool. and still dominated us.
We beat City on aggregate this season already.
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Post by M99 Wed Feb 16, 2022 9:45 am

danyjr wrote:If I were Madrid I would think twice about signing Mbappé and Haaland. Midfield additions should be the absolutely top priority even ahead of Mbappé. The current midfield work in the slower tempo settings of La Liga but you can't play both old men Modrić and Kroos vs teams like PSG. While they defended well, they had problems #1 driving the ball forward and #2 getting into pockets of space to help their team mates build up counter attacks. All down to their age IMHO.

This was a very good PSG line up. Verratti is the best CM in the game today IMHO. Him and Leandrito are great partners, not so much complementing each other as they both are the profile of midfielders that are complete on their own and don't need another guy carrying them.

Mbappé is king. Best player in the world by far?


I can't believe Bernardo Silva was available last summer and Madrid didn't do anything to get him.
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Post by BarcaLearning Wed Feb 16, 2022 10:25 am

Who is Found anyway, isnt he jibers or someone similar with insanely biased views' new username? Very Happy

Real's midfield we all know been aging for a long time, its still amazing the level Modric plays consistently this season, but this game showed his limited, together with Kroos whos the worst of the 3 energy wise. Casemiro is younger so he still can do it often, but not every game. Pretty clear they got Mbappe so the forward n defense looks set. Camivingo was signed for this already though. I do hope Flo dont do anything about it anymore or sign big money flops there Very Happy So that other teams might still have a chance to challenge in the coming yrs Razz

Messi I guess have decline a lot, no pace or energetic enough to dribble past a couple of players, so we cant expect that kinda thing much going forward... he will prolly become a no.10 sort of if not already. We only got a few months left of MNM so will just enjoy it. Next season after Mbappe leaves who knows who PSG will get to replace him? Why isnt ppl talking about Haaland going to PSG actually? They got all the money n surely will aim for top tier goal scorer no. 9 n there are only so few.
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Post by Mamad Wed Feb 16, 2022 10:43 am

For next game Casemiro and Mendy are out due to yellow cards. Case is a worry but Mendy was a joke last night. pathetic performance. he was scared of the ball somehow.

If i was Ancelotti i would give Hazard, Isco, Valverde, Camavinga and Bale as much minutes as possible from now on so they get ready for PSG and play them in front of guys like Modric, Asensio, rodrygo and Vazquez.

So my preferred line up would be like this :

Vini Benz Hazard/Bale
Kroos Camavinga Valverde
Alaba Nacho Militao Carvajal
Court

Bring on Isco, Modric, Ceballos and Hazard/Bale in second Half.
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Post by Mamad Wed Feb 16, 2022 10:45 am

And i know PSG are extremely dangerous on counters but i rather play attacking football and lose 4-2 than parking the bus at our own stadium and getting a 0-0 and go out.
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Post by Myesyats Wed Feb 16, 2022 11:57 am

Casciavit wrote:This match is a passing of the torch moment

True. It's quite scary how decisive Mbappe is in light of him being on the brink of a transfer to RM

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Post by Myesyats Wed Feb 16, 2022 12:30 pm

El Gunner wrote:
Harmonica wrote:
El Gunner wrote:
this is a standard post-2016 Messi match, what else do you expect? If he pings in one into the top corner out of nowhere like he is capable of, you don't make this post.

I would like for @Harmonica to explain the mental block at the penalty spot when it comes to this stage of the CL though.
There's no mental block, nobody scores them all. Messi is one of the best ever pressure penalty takers. Always takes the hardest one in SO's too. The one thing I noticed that ref suddenly started moving after Messi started moving, and I even thought it would get taken back. He was practically saying stuff to somebody when Messi was taking it. Could've been a distraction.

Laughing

isn't this like 3 big CL KO-stage penalty misses now?

Listen, Jiopsi cracked the case. The ref was talking on his iphone which is why Messi took the shot at the most comfortable height for the keeper to save it

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Post by Harmonica Wed Feb 16, 2022 1:29 pm

El Gunner wrote:
Harmonica wrote:
El Gunner wrote:
this is a standard post-2016 Messi match, what else do you expect? If he pings in one into the top corner out of nowhere like he is capable of, you don't make this post.

I would like for @Harmonica to explain the mental block at the penalty spot when it comes to this stage of the CL though.
There's no mental block, nobody scores them all. Messi is one of the best ever pressure penalty takers. Always takes the hardest one in SO's too. The one thing I noticed that ref suddenly started moving after Messi started moving, and I even thought it would get taken back. He was practically saying stuff to somebody when Messi was taking it. Could've been a distraction.

Laughing

isn't this like 3 big CL KO-stage penalty misses now?
Missed twice in R16 out of 8, other one being at 1-2 ManC away. Scored both in QF and the biggest miss is the Chelsea one in semis. That's 8/11 when his average should've been 9/11. There's no mental block just media humbug, or what's Penaldo's mental block of missing twice in semis and once in the final?
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Post by Thimmy Wed Feb 16, 2022 2:09 pm

Found wrote:He was poor until the last minute. Almost as bad as Messi, but with more energy. If he didn’t flop the big chance in the first half all we’d be hearing about is Messi’s genius, instead the narrative changes to Messi being finished. Thanks Kylian  Very Happy  I’ll tell ya if it wasn’t for the last minute Mbappe would be getting a lot of stick Laughing


I missed this match because of Valentine's day, but not having watched the match probably makes the routine knee-jerking on here even more apparent than it would've been if I had watched it. That said, I don't mind agreeing with whoever said Mbappe is the best player in the world now. Fuck it, let's say he's the greatest of all time Very Happy


Last edited by Thimmy on Wed Feb 16, 2022 2:10 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Post by Arquitecto Wed Feb 16, 2022 2:10 pm

Surprised no one mentioned the GOAT performance from Verratti coming off a brilliant Euros as Mbappe showed his clutch gene but Marco in that advanced role was a beauty to watch.

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Post by Arquitecto Wed Feb 16, 2022 2:10 pm

https://football-italia.net/neymar-compares-verratti-to-xavi-and-iniesta/
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Post by Thimmy Wed Feb 16, 2022 2:11 pm

I was reading through this thread, and people make it sound as if PSG were dominating. How did they only score a single goal in stoppage time?
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Post by El Gunner Wed Feb 16, 2022 3:04 pm

Harmonica wrote:
El Gunner wrote:
Harmonica wrote:There's no mental block, nobody scores them all. Messi is one of the best ever pressure penalty takers. Always takes the hardest one in SO's too. The one thing I noticed that ref suddenly started moving after Messi started moving, and I even thought it would get taken back. He was practically saying stuff to somebody when Messi was taking it. Could've been a distraction.

Laughing

isn't this like 3 big CL KO-stage penalty misses now?
Missed twice in R16 out of 8, other one being at 1-2 ManC away. Scored both in QF and the biggest miss is the Chelsea one in semis. That's 8/11 when his average should've been 9/11. There's no mental block just media humbug, or what's Penaldo's mental block of missing twice in semis and once in the final?

Penaldo has missed big CL penalties too? I don't even remember lol, can you remind me which games those were, i guess they only make a big deal out of Messi's misses. thank you for the info... I was just waiting for you to enlighten me so that i can defend Messi against the Penaldo stanboys on Twitter and IG Thumbs up
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Post by farfan Wed Feb 16, 2022 3:11 pm

Thimmy wrote:
Found wrote:He was poor until the last minute. Almost as bad as Messi, but with more energy. If he didn’t flop the big chance in the first half all we’d be hearing about is Messi’s genius, instead the narrative changes to Messi being finished. Thanks Kylian  Very Happy  I’ll tell ya if it wasn’t for the last minute Mbappe would be getting a lot of stick Laughing



I missed this match because of Valentine's day, but not having watched the match probably makes the routine knee-jerking on here even more apparent than it would've been if I had watched it. That said, I don't mind agreeing with whoever said Mbappe is the best player in the world now. Fuck it, let's say he's the greatest of all time Very Happy

Of all the posts, that's the one you decided to quote Laughing

He tore Madrid's defense a new one. Made mincemeat of Carvajal in every 1-on-1 situation, got on the end of long passes that he had no business getting to, forced Courtois to make the save of the game, got the penalty that Messi squandered, and scored the winner. A 9/10 performance by any reasonable standard.  
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Post by Myesyats Wed Feb 16, 2022 3:54 pm

Arquitecto wrote:Surprised no one mentioned the GOAT performance from Verratti coming off a brilliant Euros as Mbappe showed his clutch gene but Marco in that advanced role was a beauty to watch.


I think it has been mentioned hmm Barca been trying to sign Verratti since I dont even remember when. Every summer since 8 years at least

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Post by Found Wed Feb 16, 2022 5:24 pm

Myesyats wrote:
El Gunner wrote:
Harmonica wrote:
There's no mental block, nobody scores them all. Messi is one of the best ever pressure penalty takers. Always takes the hardest one in SO's too. The one thing I noticed that ref suddenly started moving after Messi started moving, and I even thought it would get taken back. He was practically saying stuff to somebody when Messi was taking it. Could've been a distraction.

Laughing

isn't this like 3 big CL KO-stage penalty misses now?

Listen, Jiopsi cracked the case. The ref was talking on his  iphone which is why Messi took the shot at the most comfortable height for the keeper to save it


That’s obviously a red herring designed to make Messi stans look foolish. CEO of Messi FC Graham Hunter already cracked this case a long time ago: Messi simply knows that his team is going to win anyway and that causes him to relax on the penalty. Yet again it has been proven, Messi misses PK and his team goes on to win (he never loses after missing penalties just trust me bro). We can add clairvoyance to Messi’s skill set. https://twelveyards.substack.com/p/the-messi-paradox
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Post by Found Wed Feb 16, 2022 5:37 pm

farfan wrote:
Thimmy wrote:
Found wrote:He was poor until the last minute. Almost as bad as Messi, but with more energy. If he didn’t flop the big chance in the first half all we’d be hearing about is Messi’s genius, instead the narrative changes to Messi being finished. Thanks Kylian  Very Happy  I’ll tell ya if it wasn’t for the last minute Mbappe would be getting a lot of stick Laughing



I missed this match because of Valentine's day, but not having watched the match probably makes the routine knee-jerking on here even more apparent than it would've been if I had watched it. That said, I don't mind agreeing with whoever said Mbappe is the best player in the world now. Fuck it, let's say he's the greatest of all time Very Happy

Of all the posts, that's the one you decided to quote Laughing

He tore Madrid's defense a new one. Made mincemeat of Carvajal in every 1-on-1 situation, got on the end of long passes that he had no business getting to, forced Courtois to make the save of the game, got the penalty that Messi squandered, and scored the winner. A 9/10 performance by any reasonable standard.  


Whoscored gives his performance 8.9. Close, but no donut.
https://www.whoscored.com/Matches/1604560/Live/Europe-Champions-League-2021-2022-Paris-Saint-Germain-Real-Madrid


Anyway when I watched this game yesterday I thought the match sucked and the only thing that stuck in my mind by the end of it were all the chances that PSG didn’t take, which all seemed to fall to Mbappe, and Caravan’s disgusting defending, which includes the penalty and probably the goal too tbh. But whatever, if we want to do it paint by numbers style then I guess: goal + PK won + some other chance created = 9/10 performance.
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Post by Thimmy Wed Feb 16, 2022 7:06 pm

farfan wrote:
Thimmy wrote:
Found wrote:He was poor until the last minute. Almost as bad as Messi, but with more energy. If he didn’t flop the big chance in the first half all we’d be hearing about is Messi’s genius, instead the narrative changes to Messi being finished. Thanks Kylian  Very Happy  I’ll tell ya if it wasn’t for the last minute Mbappe would be getting a lot of stick Laughing



I missed this match because of Valentine's day, but not having watched the match probably makes the routine knee-jerking on here even more apparent than it would've been if I had watched it. That said, I don't mind agreeing with whoever said Mbappe is the best player in the world now. Fuck it, let's say he's the greatest of all time Very Happy

Of all the posts, that's the one you decided to quote Laughing

He tore Madrid's defense a new one. Made mincemeat of Carvajal in every 1-on-1 situation, got on the end of long passes that he had no business getting to, forced Courtois to make the save of the game, got the penalty that Messi squandered, and scored the winner. A 9/10 performance by any reasonable standard.  


That's great, man. I hope he plays just as well for us. I rest my case regarding the kneejerking, though.
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Post by Casciavit Wed Feb 16, 2022 7:37 pm

Thimmy wrote:I was reading through this thread, and people make it sound as if PSG were dominating. How did they only score a single goal in stoppage time?


They camped Madrid in their own half. Madrid lost a lot of balls trying to counter because of PSG’s pressing. When they did have possession they soon lost it. They also should have scored more than a goal but their finishing was lacking.

It was a dominant performance. The final shot total was 22-2 and I think possession was around 60-40. Now I’m pretty sure Carlo instructed them to sit back and play for a draw or low scoring tie. But they really weren’t able to do anything when they did get the ball. It was an embarrassing performance.
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Post by FennecFox7 Wed Feb 16, 2022 8:45 pm

Messi can’t beat players like he used to. Dribbling for him is extremely important. I actually did like Messi on the left, he didn’t disrupt the team shape and he got on the ball often, playing nice passes and dragging madrid out of shape so hakimi could stretch the defense. When Messi went central and started walking is when he played bad. He needs to understand that he’s older and he doesn’t have the athleticism. On the left, he’s able to whip in dangerous crosses and passes (one which should’ve been a goal) while always being available to get on the ball and be an outlet. He just won’t get as many goals.. but who gives a shit? And when I say on the left, he can interchange with mbappe/Neymar. Its not a set in stone formation


As for Madrid.. this is what happens when you overplay a team and you don’t adapt to certain teams. Valverde should’ve played from minute one. Benzema should not have started, his fitness was risked big time. If we were gonna play for the 0-0 why not just play mariano who will at least run 90 minutes? Why overplay Vini and other players when we need speed on the counter? Terrible tactics and selection recently. Big questions for Ancelotti who I like a lot.
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Post by The Demon of Carthage Wed Feb 16, 2022 8:50 pm

Yes, it was a well-deserved victory for PSG and an embarrassing one for Madrid.

The bright side is, we're only one goal down and there's still the return leg left to play.

So in theory, we still have a chance, but in reality we could still lose at home, especially if we play like we did yesterday.

Problem we have right now is that we lack goalscorers. So when Benzema has an off day like yesterday, we're fucked. This is why we desperately need Haaland.

Anyway, I really don't want to leave the competition in the round of 16. But if we deserve to, then so be it.
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Post by Mamad Wed Feb 16, 2022 9:14 pm

Right now The problem is not players. it's the coach. yes we lack quality at RW or RB or midfield but we have enough players to do better against Paris.

The distance between 3 midfielders and attackers on transition was laughable. the tactic was to counter and put long balls for Vini or Asensio but how can you do that when they are facing a RB and LB that are faster than them lol.

you see your team playing like s*it, you make changes at half time. Carlo didn't do anything. PSG wasn't even pressing that hard yet we couldn't get out of our own half.

there was enough space in midfield for someone to carry the ball forward but the players who are best at it ( Valverde, Isco or even Ceballos ) wasn't there. Militao did it one time. Kroos, case and Modric can't do that.

PSG is very beatable. we can win against them at Bernabeu if Carlo stops being a coward and acts like a coach. if not i see something like 3-0 to PSG with fans booing us from 25th minute.
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Post by futbol_bill Thu Feb 17, 2022 12:59 am

I agree completely with Thimmy’s last post.

Such knee jerk reactions here.

1. PSG did not dominate game, they had possession advantage by a large margin.

2. Messi and rest of dream team, bar Mbappe was average, no where close to outstanding as they have so often have been predicted here nor as viewed in the alternative world of Harmonica.

3. Difference was clearly Mbappe in his outstanding performance and even then, it took an absolute dazzling play in extra time to get that one goal difference.

4. Calling Madrid’s play and Ancelotti embarrassing is ridiculous. It has been stated many times here as well as other places that this Madrid team is not capable of going further in this CL. It also has been overly stated that Madrid does not have scoring capabilities. Ancelotti knew all of this and played the only strategy that could possibility work and he played his best possibly lineup. And it almost worked! A important point that isn’t mention at all!

5. It is not an automatic assumption that this tie is over with just a one goal difference and game at Bernabeu.

6. Madrid has gone into this season trying for best they can with current lineup and it sure looks like they are solid favorites to win liga and are still in CL. That’s as well as one could have been expected. Meanwhile Flo has put together a financial war chest as well as freeing up a large portion of current salary load to improve the lineup for next season. Mbappe is confirmed, and the money is there for Haaland, plus there are more funds for other needs. So to put this perspective, imagine yesterday’s game with Mbappe on opposite team! and yeah I know Harmonica’s alternative view won’t be able to visualize that.
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