Re: Match Day Thread 21-22

[BarcaLearning]

Haahahahahhahaha so Alex yea u r replying to me directly finally? When u hadnt for so long? Finally have the balls to eh? After we get an easy result vs a bad Levante, man ur pathetic Loooool. Man I was gonna stop, but ur just asking for it XD

[alexjanosik]

Pathetic is fans like you who love a player more than the game or the club. Plastic fans of the game who want the club to fail just to make themselves feel good about Messi.
Learn to love and appreciate the game and the club instead of this unhealthy obsession with a player.

[Myesyats]

BarcaLearning is quite level headed. He's in no way a Messi fanboy. All that he really said is that "Messi's pros far outweigh his cons" which is simply objectively true.

Of course we can build a great team without Messi, we have many promising youngsters. But without him even an average team was in contention for all trophies. He's a generational difference maker.

Lets not get excited about beating bottom half teams, that should be just another day in the office for Barca.

[The Franchise]

I don't think it's the result, or even the performance on its own (because Levante are a poor side) but the way we played in term of the young guys being the protagonists of the game.

The best players on the pitch was Gavi, Nico, Dest and Fati when he came on in my opinion. With Memphis obviously being crucial to everything. There was alot of encouraging signs from those young guys.

I also think, Koeman may aswell just accept the truth. He wants to play 4231 and we have the players for it. 352 isn't going to work with him and there's too many holes for 433 without high level positional play.

Gavi playing off the right was good, Coutinho down the middle wasn't so bad and Fati on the left with Memphis in the center is a very interesting balance.

Puig came on and I simply don't understand the fascination the fans have with him. He's not terrible, he even played a top level pass to Memphis but overall there's alot of immaturity in his game. Had Dest wide open for a sure fire goal, continues to dribble because he beat one man, loses the ball in deep midfield under no pressure and played passes into marked players when he should have turned and gone in another direction.

Benfica away will be very tough, I believe they are yet to lose a single game this season, in fact they are 7 in 7 in the league and Jorge Jesus is a far better tactician than Koeman.

I hope at some point in this game to see Dest, Pique, Araujo, Mingueza - Nico, De Jong - Fati, Coutinho, Gavi - Memphis.

[BarcaLearning]

Thx Myesyats Yea, its good to have good posters like u n Dani here now.. I mean some time back it was very quite here for a while except a lot of nonsense from Alex non stop about Messi n I almost just gave up this section. Anyway think Im just gonna try n ignore n get used to them posts

Yep looking to see how we do in the Benfica game. Should be more of a realistic test for us. Bayern is too much and Levante was too poor for us.

[alexjanosik]

BarcaLearning is quite level headed. He's in no way a Messi fanboy. All that he really said is that "Messi's pros far outweigh his cons" which is simply objectively true.

Of course we can build a great team without Messi, we have many promising youngsters. But without him even an average team was in contention for all trophies. He's a generational difference maker.

Lets not get excited about beating bottom half teams, that should be just another day in the office for Barca.

We were never in contention for all trophies with Messi. Come on man. You are more sensible and not like the Messi lovers on here. When were we ever in contention for the CL over the last few years? The domestic double yes but CL never. Even domestically, last 2 years we came up short with Messi. Last year, after being in pole position, he couldnt get the job done. For a supposed GOAT, that's a failure.
We are not going to win the league this year and will be content competing. We didnt win last 2 years. What's the difference?

On not being excited about beating bottom half teams, I beg to differ. I dont know about you but I thoroughly enjoyed yesterday's game. Enjoyed it like I have enjoyed very few Barca games over the last few years. Yes, Levante is a bottom team but lest you forget, we have struggled and put in garbage teams against scrubs over the last few years. When was the last time we played as well against a bottom team over the past couple of years? I cant think of many performances like yesterday even against scrub teams. That's the reason I am excited. Now, we are playing a bunch of teenagers so its tough to expect consistency. You wont get the same level of performance every week but I enjoyed yesterday's game. Most of us have grown up loving Barcelona because of the way we play and the style of football. The football served in the last few years was an eyesore and not why I started supporting the club. So, yes I am excited about beating Levante.

[The Franchise]

I definitely agree with that. This game was a pleasant surprise in terms of how I enjoyed the game. It was the same as opening day of the season, we had a good energy and spirit and I think the crowd had a big part to play in that. I also genuinely celebrated the goals. Whereas even with Araujo's equaliser against Granada, I couldn't celebrate because I felt so annoyed by how we played.

After the game yesterday I was genuinely happy. I realise it won't lead to anything tangible, this team isn't capable of winning anything, but it's very rare in the last years I actually enjoyed the game.

[neuro11]

A timely needed win against a very poor team. We needed this before the Benfica game to gain confidence. But we probably won't get acres of space like we had today and that much poor defending. Memphis is not clinical enough. The guy does everything and then kicks it to the keeper. Also, i thought he dived there for the penalty, no? Anyway, hope he improves on his finishing. Good that Coutinho was trying to hit from outside the box. Hope he gets back some of his forms.
Our position on the table also does not look that bad yet, 5 points gap from the top with a game in hand.

[Cruijf]

We were never in contention for all trophies with Messi. Come on man. You are more sensible and not like the Messi lovers on here. When were we ever in contention for the CL over the last few years?

Is your memory so short that 2019 is "never"? Just 2 years ago, you were on the cusp of a 3rd treble in the Messi era despite having a thoroughly average squad. No one can deny that Messi's performances in 2018-19 were decisive and that without him, Barca would have done much worse in the CL.

[Myesyats]

BarcaLearning is quite level headed. He's in no way a Messi fanboy. All that he really said is that "Messi's pros far outweigh his cons" which is simply objectively true.

Of course we can build a great team without Messi, we have many promising youngsters. But without him even an average team was in contention for all trophies. He's a generational difference maker.

Lets not get excited about beating bottom half teams, that should be just another day in the office for Barca.

We were never in contention for all trophies with Messi. Come on man. You are more sensible and not like the Messi lovers on here. When were we ever in contention for the CL over the last few years? The domestic double yes but CL never. Even domestically, last 2 years we came up short with Messi. Last year, after being in pole position, he couldnt get the job done. For a supposed GOAT, that's a failure.
We are not going to win the league this year and will be content competing. We didnt win last 2 years. What's the difference?

18/19 season we were definitely in contention. Beat liverpool 3-0 before the disaster comeback happened. And that team was shit, with Lenglet, Arturo Vidal starting etc. Coutinho at LW.

But Messi+Suarez was enough to be considered favorites. When Suarez left, no, Messi alone won't do it. But give him a quality striker and he will always create danger over and over.

On not being excited about beating bottom half teams, I beg to differ. I dont know about you but I thoroughly enjoyed yesterday's game. Enjoyed it like I have enjoyed very few Barca games over the last few years. Yes, Levante is a bottom team but lest you forget, we have struggled and put in garbage teams against scrubs over the last few years. When was the last time we played as well against a bottom team over the past couple of years? I cant think of many performances like yesterday even against scrub teams. That's the reason I am excited. Now, we are playing a bunch of teenagers so its tough to expect consistency. You wont get the same level of performance every week but I enjoyed yesterday's game. Most of us have grown up loving Barcelona because of the way we play and the style of football. The football served in the last few years was an eyesore and not why I started supporting the club. So, yes I am excited about beating Levante.

I didnt say i'm not excited about us winning, just be realistic.  I loved Messi, but I like the team without him as well.

But its really a generational change if you take away a Messi or a Ronaldo from your team. Not only are they the best EVER, their consistency is legendary. Week in, week out they produce so much end-product.

Beating this Levante team at home is easy. They're not aggressive, they dont press etc. See with Messi it was just another day in the office and now its an achievement. That alone says something

[Myesyats]

A more accurate picture will be painted tomorrow. Its still early, I will give this team more time since not everyone is fit and I dont really rate Koeman but Benfica will be a decent showcase of what we can do.

And again, with Ansu's genius and Dembele's speed we will be infinitely better that I'm convinced of

Aguero as a super sub could also be deadly, he's world class when in form.

[The Franchise]

2019 as in, the Liverpool embarrassment?

We was never winning the champions league that season, we was poor and the first leg win against them was a totally false result. Only got that far because we got to play Man utd with Ole pre Bruno, with guys like Jones and Young at the back.

We won the league simply because someone had to win, all 3 teams were poor. Real lost more than 10 league games.

But that was not a good team at all.

[Myesyats]

Of course it wasnt a good team. Thats what I'm saying. It was a bad team with a shit coach and we beat Pool, Man Utd twice(without conceding), Atleti, Lyon easily

we won vs R.Madrid in march, we also beat RM in february. Can you imagine us beating RM now?

[The Franchise]

I could be wrong, but I thought the argument was that because of Messi we was in contention to win everything.

But with or without Messi, we wasn't going to win.

[Myesyats]

Why not? If not for the fluke comeback, sure Pool were better in the return leg but the goals were quite lucky, we would've been in the FINAL and anything could have happened. One game away from CL final.

[Myesyats]

I hope at some point in this game to see Dest, Pique, Araujo, Mingueza - Nico, De Jong - Fati, Coutinho, Gavi - Memphis.

I like this lineup.

Nico/Frenkie/Gavi/Pedri is a very young midfield, but it has potential.

Mingueza over Dest at RB imo. If Alba and Mingueza are fit, I'd rather Dest be on the bench.

[Cruijf]

I could be wrong, but I thought the argument was that because of Messi we was in contention to win everything.

But with or without Messi, we wasn't going to win.

No one can say what would have happened for sure, but there is very little doubt in my mind that if you take out 2 of the crazy defending errors at Anfield (or even if Suarez just scored one of the chances Messi created, or Dembele scored the sitter in the first leg Messi gave him) Barca would have won the treble. The margins were very thin. You would have played an average Spurs side who you had already dominated in the group stage.

On the flip side, I’m also quite confident you would have went out against Lyon in the R16 without Messi. I was in the Camp Nou that night and Barca was very, very close to wilting at 2-1 (2-2 would have sent Lyon through) until Messi scored to decide the game.

[The Franchise]

Pool we're better in the 1st leg, let alone 2nd. The fluke wasn't the comeback, we had already crumbled in the same way against Roma. The fluke was us winning 3 nil, we had no business getting that result.

Didn't you feel, despite having a 3 nil lead, we would bottle it?

I knew we would if they scored first and in the first half.

[Myesyats]

Point being? We would have lost both games 0-3 without Messi. Instead we managed to win the first leg 3-0 after his heroics, free-kicks etc. and 1 goal in the return leg would have sufficed to reach the final. Then we'd have beaten spurs most likely.

[neuro11]

Its funny how you agree that in 18-19 we had a poor team, we were not supposed to win the first leg, pool was the better side but lost 3-0 (4-0  if not what happened in the dying min) .... yet the summary is with or without Messi there was no effect!!! Also, if a team going in the second leg of semi with 3 goal lead is not in contention for CL than who else is.
As far as I remember Pep, the best tactician lost to the same pool at their home for 3-0 in the previous season at the same stage. Winning at Anfield is a daunting task for a team that heavily relies on one man.

[The Franchise]

No, I think the summary is that when we had Messi we were not in contention to win the champions league. It simply was not going to happen.

Now we don't have him, our chances obviously haven't increased, but with him in the side, or without him, we aren't at the level needed to win the champions league.

Yes you can maybe get lucky and fluke a result here and there, this is more likely with him in the team due to his individual quality, but surely we aren't trying to fluke a title.. We are trying to be one of the best in teams in Europe and we are not that now, but we wasn't that with Messi (in the time period we are talking about) either.

[alexjanosik]

BarcaLearning is quite level headed. He's in no way a Messi fanboy. All that he really said is that "Messi's pros far outweigh his cons" which is simply objectively true.

Of course we can build a great team without Messi, we have many promising youngsters. But without him even an average team was in contention for all trophies. He's a generational difference maker.

Lets not get excited about beating bottom half teams, that should be just another day in the office for Barca.

We were never in contention for all trophies with Messi. Come on man. You are more sensible and not like the Messi lovers on here. When were we ever in contention for the CL over the last few years? The domestic double yes but CL never. Even domestically, last 2 years we came up short with Messi. Last year, after being in pole position, he couldnt get the job done. For a supposed GOAT, that's a failure.
We are not going to win the league this year and will be content competing. We didnt win last 2 years. What's the difference?

18/19 season we were definitely in contention. Beat liverpool 3-0 before the disaster comeback happened. And that team was shit, with Lenglet, Arturo Vidal starting etc. Coutinho at LW.

But Messi+Suarez was enough to be considered favorites. When Suarez left, no, Messi alone won't do it. But give him a quality striker and he will always create danger over and over.

On not being excited about beating bottom half teams, I beg to differ. I dont know about you but I thoroughly enjoyed yesterday's game. Enjoyed it like I have enjoyed very few Barca games over the last few years. Yes, Levante is a bottom team but lest you forget, we have struggled and put in garbage teams against scrubs over the last few years. When was the last time we played as well against a bottom team over the past couple of years? I cant think of many performances like yesterday even against scrub teams. That's the reason I am excited. Now, we are playing a bunch of teenagers so its tough to expect consistency. You wont get the same level of performance every week but I enjoyed yesterday's game. Most of us have grown up loving Barcelona because of the way we play and the style of football. The football served in the last few years was an eyesore and not why I started supporting the club. So, yes I am excited about beating Levante.

I didnt say i'm not excited about us winning, just be realistic.  I loved Messi, but I like the team without him as well.

But its really a generational change if you take away a Messi or a Ronaldo from your team. Not only are they the best EVER, their consistency is legendary. Week in, week out they produce so much end-product.

Beating this Levante team at home is easy. They're not aggressive, they dont press etc. See with Messi it was just another day in the office and now its an achievement. That alone says something

I think I disagree on the last bit. We have struggled to put in good performances (performance not result) even against scrubs over the last few years. Levante is a Paco team. They press well. It was ineffective because we moved the ball way too fast. They tried pressing even more in the second half but again the ball movement was fast and good. Compare to previous years. The game used to be mostly played in our own half with us struggling to get the ball in their half. So, I think I am more excited about the performance (not the result) as I see a marked difference even against a scrub team.

[alexjanosik]

About 18/19. One SF run in 6 years. And we got pummeled by Liverpool at Anfield. They would have won even if we went in 4-0 to Anfield. The first leg result itself was highly misleading. Hardly counts as competing for all titles every season imo.

[Found]

They would have won even if we went in 4-0 to Anfield.

Theoretically couldn’t you have defended a 4 goal lead if you slung La-Z-boy10 to the bench?

[alexjanosik]

Roberto starting with Eric Garcia at RB. Why?
Mingueza should have been RB instead of Garcia and Gavi should have played instead of Roberto

[alexjanosik]

Fairly easy prediction. Garcia is going to get taken to the cleaners at RB.

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