GAME OF THRONES - PART 9 - *NO BOOK TALK - READ THE RULES*

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Post by rincon Mon May 06, 2019 2:56 pm

Don't see any chance of Cersei going north to help Starks. She has said so often that she gives 0 fucks about everyone but her immediate family. It's not even that speculative, she was actually happy that the wall fell. Sansa called everyone an idiot for even thinking it.

If Dany is not around then the dead destroy Westeros.

Cersei is willing to kill everyone in the country as long as she remains on the throne. She attacked Highgarden to steal their gold to pay the iron bank for their war debts, just so she could borrow more money to spend on war. It's not sustainable. They've made it as clear as possible that she makes the people's lives in kings landing miserable, and that's the place she most looks after.

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Post by RealGunner Mon May 06, 2019 3:53 pm

D&D's explanation for how Dany's dragon could get ambushed:

"Dany kind of forgot about the Iron fleet and Euron's forces, they certainly didn't forget about her".

if anyone was wondering.

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Post by zigra Mon May 06, 2019 4:06 pm

RealGunner wrote:D&D's explanation for how Dany's dragon could get ambushed:

"Dany kind of forgot about the Iron fleet and Euron's forces, they certainly didn't forget about her".

if anyone was wondering.



Proud

D&D turned it into a lazy comedy ages ago tbf
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Post by Myesyats Mon May 06, 2019 4:39 pm

How can you employ so many people and pump millions into a show just to make such a rookie mistake? She didnt see a fleet of ships while flying on a dragon, yeah sure.

The iron fleet is badass and the scene was amazing but this plothole kind of ruined it.

Also bummed that Jons lineage revelation scene was cut. Awful decision.
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Post by M99 Mon May 06, 2019 4:45 pm

GAME OF THRONES - PART 9 - *NO BOOK TALK - READ THE RULES* - Page 13 Wsr4801q3iw21
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Post by elitedam Mon May 06, 2019 4:48 pm

Did Tyrion turn into a fucking idiot in the book too or is that just a show special?
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Post by RealGunner Mon May 06, 2019 4:49 pm

elitedam wrote:Did Tyrion turn into a fucking idiot in the book too or is that just a show special?


In the books he is on a journey to find out "where the whores go"

so can't really say.
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Post by rincon Mon May 06, 2019 4:54 pm

elitedam wrote:Did Tyrion turn into a fucking idiot in the book too or is that just a show special?

He became a cynical, depressed, suicidal alcoholic. Mostly insulting those around him and randomly asking everyone "where the whores go".
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Post by Kaladin Mon May 06, 2019 4:56 pm

Done with this show, you fucking kidding me?

WHo the fuck writes this shit, boyzis?

Every episode is worse than the last, but yerda Freeza gonna come here vehemently defending it. Blocked.

Cba, just gonna wait 'til the show ends. All the characters are suddenly idiots, decisions don't make sense anymore, its as if directors think "Yeah that'll make a cool shot" instead of, this makes sense.

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Post by rincon Mon May 06, 2019 4:57 pm

Tyrion is trying to have it not both ways, but every way. He is trying to have Dany conquer Westeros without killing anyone, trying to beat Cersei while not murdering more of their family.

Incompetent hand in this state of things. Varys, Jorah (rip) or Jon are/were much better
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Post by M99 Mon May 06, 2019 4:57 pm

elitedam wrote:Did Tyrion turn into a fucking idiot in the book too or is that just a show special?


He goes cynical and suicidal, but at the end of the fifth book he decides to continue living and poisons his captors (the slavers) with the poison he takes in case he want to kill himself. By the sixth book preview chapters, he is back to being witty and scheming.
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Post by Freeza Mon May 06, 2019 5:27 pm

Kaladin wrote:Done with this show, you fucking kidding me?

WHo the fuck writes this shit, boyzis?

Every episode is worse than the last, but yerda Freeza gonna come here vehemently defending it. Blocked.

Cba, just gonna wait 'til the show ends. All the characters are suddenly idiots, decisions don't make sense anymore, its as if directors think "Yeah that'll make a cool shot" instead of, this makes sense.



Blocked rofl I guess I’ll just stop even entertaining discussions from now. Guess we’ll all just have to agree on everything and have a total echo chamber. I just didn’t call everything shit. I was critical on a lot of things, but because I don’t use exclusively hyperbole you guys get hella defensive and mad.

I’m just saying. You don’t this kind of nitpicking about other fucking shows.

And I honestly think it always was on this level.

At some point it catches up to you when you kill all the interesting side characters.

Tywin, Robb, Oberyn, Ygritte. Those were all the most charismatic characters and actors really.

Also I’m not quite sure how Dany hasn’t always been an idiot?
___


Just a general question here. Do people regard it as bad writings if there’s idiotic characters in a work of fiction. Despite it lining up with how the characters have always acted.

Not saying it’s necessarily directed at anyone in this thread. I’ve had problems with it myself. Mostly a show like The Flash and Barry Allen being written as a dumb idiot because they needed him to have a bigger team to make a tv show.
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Post by Kaladin Mon May 06, 2019 5:35 pm

I HAVE always been vocal about other shows, in facts i went on record saying literally the vast majority of TV shows are garbage because they are at the behest of their networks. There are only a minor few that i like these days. And i've stopped watching for the most part and pursued other more superior mediums, yes, superior, and no, it doesn't involve Mads Mikkelson.

You always like to be the contrarian, especially on here for some reason. Even when it doesn't make any sense.
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Post by Freeza Mon May 06, 2019 5:40 pm

Like to be a contrarian? I posted my fucking opinion before anyone else Laughing

I don’t know how I’m supposed to gauge the general opinion before I watch something.
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Post by Freeza Mon May 06, 2019 5:43 pm

“The vast majority of television is garbage”

And I’m the contrarian for liking the most popular television show of all time
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Post by Myesyats Mon May 06, 2019 5:45 pm

Looks like ES has made up his mind and no matter what happens he'll shit on every outcome lol

Some decisions are shocking but imagine carrying a 8 season show and pleasing everyone from start to finish lol
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Post by BarrileteCosmico Mon May 06, 2019 5:53 pm

Freeza wrote:
Just a general question here. Do people regard it as bad writings if there’s idiotic characters in a work of fiction. Despite it lining up with how the characters have always acted..

But that's not really what people are complaining about, is it? No one is complaining about Jon telling his sisters about his true parentage because that's consistent with his character in spite of being a stupid decision (as sansa proved one scene later).

What they're complaining is stuff like:

- an entire navy sneaking up on a flying dragon. When pressed the showrunners say its because Dani "forgot" something they were discussing one scene before
- a boat being able to shoot perfectly aimed bolts every second when just last season these were hard to aim and took significant time recharging
- the writers not showing the reactions of 2 protagonists to the reveal of a secret 8 years in the making
-Jon being rewarded for being a blundering dull good guy when he would have been punished for it in the beginning of the series
- bronn walking in to winter fell and finding the lannisters with a loaded crossbow without being stopped once
- Varys performing treason in front of the hand of the queen and not getting detained
- no one thinks to send Arya on to assassinate Cersei

These are not dumb character decisions. They are lazy writing. It's like they have a list of items they have to check (for instance "euron kills a dragon") and they decide to write it in the most showy and shocking way rather than on a way that makes sense. And this is a direct cause of them losing the source material, because it didn't use to be this way.
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Post by RealGunner Mon May 06, 2019 5:56 pm

Freeza wrote:

Just a general question here. Do people regard it as bad writings if there’s idiotic characters in a work of fiction. Despite it lining up with how the characters have always acted.

Not saying it’s necessarily directed at anyone in this thread. I’ve had problems with it myself. Mostly a show like The Flash and Barry Allen being written as a dumb idiot because they needed him to have a bigger team to make a tv show.


Hmm interesting question.

I don't think i would class that as bad writing if a character has always shown to make poor decisions. It can be good writing but for a bad character since it's consistent. However it is bad writing if a piece of fiction is being inconsistent with the character.

For example take Arya. She has always shown to be a warrior rather than a lady. She started training since season 1. In the house of black and white she started training to be a faceless assassin. But she was never shown to be a competent assassin. She in fact barely survived death when she shouldn't have due to deus ex machina. So we know she is nowhere near as good. So how did she become the greatest assassin in Westeros an episode later? How did she become so good that she can kill the greatest threat to human kind with no issues while surviving everything that comes her way. That to me is poor writing.

Just take this latest episode. Let's ignore my previous point for a second. She has now established herself as the best assassin and a perfect faceless man who can sneak past anyone and take on anyone's face. They are discussing tactics about taking down king's landing. Why is everyone ignoring Arya's skills? I mean it would be far far easier for her to kill Cersei than NK. As BC mentioned earlier. All you need is Varys/Davos and Arya and the entire battle is won without harming the civilians. That to me is bad writing.

Focus on Bran next. He is shown to be omnipotent. He can warg into anyone. He can see anything beyond reality. You are showing in one episode how he was able to foreshadow NK coming for him and Arya killing him. And then everyone suddenly forgets what he can do? why not ask him to warg into someone at KL? scout the defences. Tell them that Cersei have these insane scorpions. Tell them about the iron fleet. That to me is bad writing.

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Post by rincon Mon May 06, 2019 5:59 pm

On the Bran part. He isn't Bran anymore and as he said he no longer "wants". I don't think he has any interest at all in what happens with the scorpions, the iron fleet, or whatever "human" squabble.
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Post by RealGunner Mon May 06, 2019 6:01 pm

BarrileteCosmico wrote:

These are not dumb character decisions. They are lazy writing. It's like they have a list of items they have to check (for instance "euron kills a dragon") and they decide to write it in the most showy and shocking way rather than on a way that makes sense. And this is a direct cause of them losing the source material, because it didn't use to be this way.


I think that's most likely what it really is.

I think Euron's dragon binding horn is legit in the books and he will either bind the dragon to his will or kill one using that. In the show they had to come up with a way to get rid of it as well and that's what they came up with.

I also think the horn to bring the wall down is legit and the others actually won't use Viserion to break it. Won't be surprised if we see another dance of the dragons with Rhaegal fighting Viserion at some point.
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Post by RealGunner Mon May 06, 2019 6:03 pm

rincon wrote:On the Bran part. He isn't Bran anymore and as he said he no longer "wants". I don't think he has any interest at all in what happens with the scorpions, the iron fleet, or whatever "human" squabble.


He wasn't bran before either but he took interest to tell Jon about his parentage. He won't refuse them if they ask.

It's even worse if he had the fate of the world in mind while dealing with the NK but stops caring about what happens to the people after that.
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Post by rincon Mon May 06, 2019 6:07 pm

Yes but this to me sounds like a Daenerys point of view. Bran has seen some things that we don't know, and he saw it fit to tell Jon about his parentage for example, or give Arya the dagger, sit in the godswood, talk to Jaime and Tyrion, etc.

How do we know that the outcome of what's to come doesn't play into what Bran sees/needs?

Rhaegal doesn't need to be involved in the future. Maybe Danerys doesn't either. Could be that Bran knew that telling Jon about his parentage would trigger shit leading to Dany's death for example (or Jon's). Whatever that path is, we don't know that Bran should be saying more than he is already saying.
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Post by M99 Mon May 06, 2019 6:08 pm

RealGunner wrote:
BarrileteCosmico wrote:

These are not dumb character decisions. They are lazy writing. It's like they have a list of items they have to check (for instance "euron kills a dragon") and they decide to write it in the most showy and shocking way rather than on a way that makes sense. And this is a direct cause of them losing the source material, because it didn't use to be this way.


I think that's most likely what it really is.

I think Euron's dragon binding horn is legit in the books and he will either bind the dragon to his will or kill one using that. In the show they had to come up with a way to get rid of it as well and that's what they came up with.

I also think the horn to bring the wall down is legit and the others actually won't use Viserion to break it. Won't be surprised if we see another dance of the dragons with Rhaegal fighting Viserion at some point.


Like I said Fire And Blood revealed that Queen Alysanne's dragon could not cross the Wall. Also D&D said on the wight hunt "we had a vision of all the characters meeting on the Dragonpit and this is how we decided to do it" so undead Viserion is most likely a D&D original.

And also there is this

In the North, Queen Alysanne grew restless with waiting, and decided to take her leave of Winterfell for a time and visit the men of the Night’s Watch at Castle Black. The distance was not negligible, even flying; Her Grace landed at the Last Hearth and several smaller keeps and holdfasts on her way, to the surprise and delight of their lords, whilst a portion of her tail scrambled after her (the rest remained at Winterfell).

GRRM makes it a point to mention she could not fly from Winterfell to the Wall at one go yet Dany did it from fkin Dragonstone Laughing A lot of fans speculated this was him saying its gonna be different in the books.
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Post by Glory Mon May 06, 2019 6:12 pm

Absolutely piss poor. Worst episode of the season for me and one of the worst ever. At least episode 3 had some popcorn moments. This on the other hand. Never mind the audience, I actually feel sorry for the actors. lol They might be thinking hey this wasnt the shit I signed up for! Some of that writing. Wheres the fking logic man. :facepalm:

I was holding back until now, was prepared to give them some leeway. Thought it was early to criticize. But now seeing we will be getting absolutely nothing from them. No going back about NK, no mentioning of Bran's little warging in the last episode, enough is enough. Fk them.

Terribly disappointed. They seriously thought it was a better to cut that Godswoood scene like that. Could have just made this like a 40 minute episode and spared us of the misery. And told ya Euron was about to destroy some major player like its nothing. Fking Euron, aaargh.

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Post by BarrileteCosmico Mon May 06, 2019 6:13 pm

Frankly I feel like you have to take the same approach than with other high fantasy shows like superhero movies when watching Got. You have to suspend belief for the entirety of it and accept it as it is. If you start nitpicking it you will ruin your enjoyment completely, as so little of it makes sense these days.

Then the next morning I get "wait that didn't make sense at all" hangover, but at least I enjoyed it the night before
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Post by rincon Mon May 06, 2019 6:14 pm

I honestly have no interest in comparing anything from the books or from GRRM's comments to current events on the show since GRRM has taken 8 years (and counting) to release 1 book. They are different stories from different mediums and would be more similar if he hadn't been this unproductive.
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