Juventus 2017/2018 Champions League Winners Thread

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Post by rincon Tue Apr 03, 2018 10:05 pm

Errors in all the wrong times. Costa, De Sciglio, Bentancur, Barzagli, Dybala!

Amazing that Khedira finally showed up and then we lose.

Wrecked by Ronaldo once again.

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Post by juvealbanian Tue Apr 03, 2018 11:23 pm

Calm down guys. Yeah I was hungry for revenge too but honestly we did better than I expected, we had far more chances and possesion than I even thought we would.
I mean if you see a midfield of Khedira and Bentancur...

First of all Real and Cristiano got lucky that our defense f up twice.Yes they were the better team but most of the credit goes to Cristiano.He was so clinical and scored 2 out of 3 shots he had and he didn't enjoyed any possesion on his own at all.

Even though we reacted after the first quick goal,which I really appreciate and see it as a form of maturity for our team that goal was devastating.
Clearly Bentancur and mostly Barzagli at fault.

Second goal again our defense made a amateur mistake.And at third goal Bentancur as well at fault.

I liked Bentancur's grinta but he made lots of wrong passes and wrong moves, quite expected from a non-experienced 20 year old.

Our left wing with Asamoah and Sandro was almost inexistent going forward while I always get the feeling Costa performrms better when he's played on the left not as he played tonight.
Khedira did his best given his limitations.
So did Dybala who unfortunately got upset and booked.After he was sent off our attacking game from the middle was zero.


Anyway. To me it's pretty clear we need fresh legs.Our old defense and the fact we could only field Bentancur and Khedira in central midfield tells a lot.
Even though I appreciate our veterans I think it's pointless continue this way.We must bring a young generation even in defense.
Caldara & Spinazzola are a must from next season as well as Rugani finally stepping up.
Next we must invest heavily on midfield.If Marchisio couldn't even get minutes this match that means we only have Pjanic as a worthy midfielder for this type of matches,this level of football.

Not saying we should kick everyone out but we need to start a new generation and not even think about prolonging anymore with this one.

More young talents instead of 36+ year olds.More attacking,technical and unpredictable when it comes to UCL.

Barzagli,Mandzukic,Khedira,Sturaro need to go.
Marchisio,Asamoah may go as well if they cannot be fit physically.
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Post by rincon Tue Apr 03, 2018 11:43 pm

Agree with all of that except with Costa. We always play him on the right.

CR killed us. Otherwise we played very well until the red card.

Bentancur always makes so many errors. So talented but far from ready. He is only 20 after all.
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Post by Luca Tue Apr 03, 2018 11:58 pm

We did play well, just made unforced errors that ended the tie. We showed a lack of maturity from some of our most tenured players. It was quite shocking. To let in a goal inside 3 minutes was already one thing, then we calmed down, worked our way into the game and were doing well enough until the second goal- one of the worst goals from start to finish I have ever seen conceded by our team. From the moment the ball went in, you knew we lost, Dybala sealed it 90 seconds after with his sending off.

It's a very tough loss to accept for numerous reasons but for me the bottom line is you cannot play like this at home. This was in front of our fans, in Torino, our last CL loss was 5 years ago with Bayern in this stadium. We are not meant to lose at the fortress, and today we made it too easy for Real, who's quality is much greater than ours to begin with

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Post by S Thu Apr 05, 2018 1:13 pm




This is why I dislike Napoli. Such a tinpot mentality.

and @rincon got mad when i rooted for Madrid to smash them last year
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Post by rincon Thu Apr 05, 2018 1:23 pm

Of course. Who cares that they make jokes like this and hate Juve. I said back then and I say it now, they look up, we don't look down. Napoli is not our rival. Madrid is. We just got knocked out twice in a row by Madrid, not by Neapolitan tailors. My dislike of Madrid certainly hasn't lessened this week Laughing

Napoli is maybe 5-6th in the rivalry for Juve in Italy. After Inter, Fiore, Torino, Milan, Roma...

Maybe if Napoli beat us to the league and stay relevant for many more years it can become a real rivalry. In the mean time our history with Madrid is something else. After the 98 final and the countless clashes it can't even be compared. Last year's final and the match on Tuesday cement it even more.
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Post by S Thu Apr 05, 2018 1:30 pm

I dont see Madrid as a rival. I respect them as an institution. Both clubs have great camaraderie and have mutual respect off the pitch. Thats what i care about. We should not confuse fan rivalry with sporting rivalry. There's no bad blood between the two clubs. Same is the case between Bayern and Madrid.

Napoli meanwhile are a cancerous club whose sole existence is based on hating Juve and i'd rather Milan or even Inter as a domestic rival than a tinpot team such as Napoli.
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Post by rincon Thu Apr 05, 2018 1:46 pm

I don't think you know much about Napoli or Naples. If anything you are confusing what their club is with Fiorentina.

Now you don't see them as rival. That's fair, its your opinion. I do. They have been our main european rival for a long time. I don't have the stats but I wouldn't be surprised if the are the big team we have played the most in CL/EC.

Milan and Inter too. Preferring Inter over anything is rare for a Juve fan, whenever they do a poll, Inter is there, #1 most hated and viceversa. Far too much history and too things have happened with Inter, Milan or Madrid for me to care about Napoli's 3 year crusade to compete with us. I don't care about Napoli, I don't care about Lazio.

You say Bayern and Madrid, maybe @Hapless_Hans can chip in for their case, if he or other Bayern fans would root for Madrid in CL against X small German club.

For me there can be no doubt, its always a no with Madrid unless Inter is on the other side, then its a situational matter. That someone irrelevant to the competition dislikes my club (Napoli, etc.) isn't gonna make my wish our biggest competitors to win.
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Post by S Thu Apr 05, 2018 2:03 pm

rincon wrote:I don't think you know much about Napoli or Naples. If anything you are confusing what their club is with Fiorentina.

Well yes, they are worse than Fiorentina. Not sure why you're defending them so much. Its pretty obvious Napoli are among the clubs that despises us the most. We are pretty much hated by entire Italy so there's that too. Its either you are pro-Juventus or you're against Juventus.

Now you don't see them as rival. That's fair, its your opinion. I do. They have been our main european rival for a long time. I don't have the stats but I wouldn't be surprised if the are the big team we have played the most in CL/EC.

I'll rephrase it. I dont see them in the same view i see Milan or Inter as a rivalry. Now these are heated rivalries spanning decades and nobody likes each other. Madrid being a non-Italian club is more of a rivalry on the pitch, off it , it always has been gentlemanly and respectful like Juve-United. Now you're not gonna sit and hate United  because we lost some games against them would you ?

Milan and Inter too. Preferring Inter over anything is rare for a Juve fan, whenever they do a poll, Inter is there, #1 most hated and viceversa. Far too much history and too things have happened with Inter, Milan or Madrid for me to care about Napoli's 3 year crusade to compete with us. I don't care about Napoli, I don't care about Lazio.

All of them are equally despicable. I hate Inter more but as i said, i'd rather have the Milan clubs as  a domestic rival because they're big teams and atleast you'd get a better competition and better viewing overall. If you didnt care about Napoli, you shouldnt have cared about me wanting them to get smashed against Madrid. Sorry rincon, you just have a pro-Italian bias and making up all kinds of theories to suit your arguments. Napoli have hated Juve for their entire existance  yet you're making this as some new thing that only surfaced recently. I dont appreciate Napoli and never will. Even our boy Marchisio hates Napoli ffs.

You say Bayern and Madrid, maybe @Hapless_Hans can chip in for their case, if he or other Bayern fans would root for Madrid in CL against X small German club.

For me there can be no doubt, its always a no with Madrid. That someone irrelevant to the competition dislikes my club (Napoli, etc.) isn't gonna make my wish our biggest competitors to win.
Thats because Germans support every Bundesliga club in Europe Laughing Kinda like you :coffee:

Anyway each to their own. I just got my thoughts across and i am not forcing down my opinions on anybody. Lets leave it at that.
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Post by S Thu Apr 05, 2018 2:23 pm

Btw Bayern have played Madrid the most in Europe.

Next comes us and Madrid
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Post by rincon Thu Apr 05, 2018 2:38 pm

S wrote:
Milan and Inter too. Preferring Inter over anything is rare for a Juve fan, whenever they do a poll, Inter is there, #1 most hated and viceversa. Far too much history and too things have happened with Inter, Milan or Madrid for me to care about Napoli's 3 year crusade to compete with us. I don't care about Napoli, I don't care about Lazio.

All of them are equally despicable. I hate Inter more but as i said, i'd rather have the Milan clubs as  a domestic rival because they're big teams and atleast you'd get a better competition and better viewing overall. If you didnt care about Napoli, you shouldnt have cared about me wanting them to get smashed against Madrid. Sorry rincon, you just have a pro-Italian bias and making up all kinds of theories to suit your arguments. Napoli have hated Juve for their entire existance  yet you're making this as some new thing that only surfaced recently. I dont appreciate Napoli and never will. Even our boy Marchisio hates Napoli ffs.


I'm sorry what kind of non sequitur is this? Where in this conversation have I defended Napoli? by being dismissive towards them, calling them small or irrelevant? How does an italian bias apply when comparing them against other Italian clubs? You are mixing up too many arguments.

When did I write that Napoli hating Juve is something new? I'm curious to where you get these things from.

You don't understand, its not about caring about Napoli. Its about caring about Madrid. I would also support Shaktar against Madrid, or City. I guess I do have a Ukranian or English bias. Its a team we've lost two finals against.

Please, quote and point out any made up theories I've written in this conversation.


Last edited by rincon on Thu Apr 05, 2018 4:07 pm; edited 2 times in total
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Post by rincon Thu Apr 05, 2018 2:59 pm

Have a look at what some of our fans think on the topic.

http://www.calciomercato.com/news/e-la-juve-la-squadra-piu-odiata-d-italia-rivalita-con-l-inter-il-448021

A poll about love and hate in football fanbases in Italy.

Juve fans #1 team they hate, obviously Inter, with 56% putting it at number 1. Number 2, a full 40% lower, is Roma with 17%. Then Milan, then others.

Juventus 2017/2018 Champions League Winners Thread - Page 9 Tifosi-in-italia-2015-2

Other polls, different times, Inter 57%, Milan 22%, then Roma, then others.

Juventus 2017/2018 Champions League Winners Thread - Page 9 3157cs44_20140919tifo_4
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Post by Luca Thu Apr 05, 2018 4:19 pm

Everyone in Italy that's not of Juve wants Juve to fail as much as they want their own team to succeed. It's because of how dominant of a period were on. Napoli, is small potatoes.

Even away to Milan, they put up a banner of our CL losses, such is life.



If we did win the CL, I'm sure a small segment of the Italian non-Juve fans would applaud such a feat but a bigger portion would need special therapy for the burns on their butts

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Post by rincon Thu Apr 05, 2018 4:31 pm

Yep. We are the most loved and most hated.
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Post by S Thu Apr 05, 2018 4:36 pm

rincon wrote:
S wrote:
Milan and Inter too. Preferring Inter over anything is rare for a Juve fan, whenever they do a poll, Inter is there, #1 most hated and viceversa. Far too much history and too things have happened with Inter, Milan or Madrid for me to care about Napoli's 3 year crusade to compete with us. I don't care about Napoli, I don't care about Lazio.

All of them are equally despicable. I hate Inter more but as i said, i'd rather have the Milan clubs as  a domestic rival because they're big teams and atleast you'd get a better competition and better viewing overall. If you didnt care about Napoli, you shouldnt have cared about me wanting them to get smashed against Madrid. Sorry rincon, you just have a pro-Italian bias and making up all kinds of theories to suit your arguments. Napoli have hated Juve for their entire existance  yet you're making this as some new thing that only surfaced recently. I dont appreciate Napoli and never will. Even our boy Marchisio hates Napoli ffs.


I'm sorry what kind of non sequitur is this? Where in this conversation have I defended Napoli? by being dismissive towards them, calling them small or irrelevant? How does an italian bias apply when comparing them against other Italian clubs? You are mixing up too many arguments.

When did I write that Napoli hating Juve is something new? I'm curious to where you get these things from.

You don't understand, its not about caring about Napoli. Its about caring about Madrid. I would also support Shaktar against Madrid, or City. I guess I do have a Ukranian or English bias. Its a team we've lost two finals against.

Please, quote and point out any made up theories I've written in this conversation.


Yes I actually mixed it up because of the argument I had with you a year ago. You said Napoli are Juve's rivals since the last 4 years but in reality Juve-Napoli rivalry transcends beyond the pitch. It's also a political rivalry , the North vs the South divide. I'm surprised you as an Italian are downplaying it because every other Italian I have spoken to regards this as a legit rivalry perhaps only second to Inter . Let's put it this way, I would cheer for any club that plays Inter, Milan or Napoli. Be it Real Madrid or any EPL club.
Napoli are the Spurs of Italy as in pretty every big club fanbase have a degree of hate towards them. They're a sc-ummy club and I don't like them.

I have seen that graphic a million times but I don't know what's your point. Everyone hates Juve we agree ? We hate Inter the most. So do I but I hate Napoli as much. Is that a wrong thing ? What are you trying to suggest ?

See you as a fan have your set of dislikes and so do I and neither you or I can enforce that upon each other. We are not ultras here. We all love and support Juventus and that should matter more.
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Post by Luca Thu Apr 05, 2018 4:45 pm

I think the Napoli-Juve rivalry means much more to Napoli than it does to us- I think this was @rincon's point.

As for the North-South divide, this is true but you also have to remember that a LARGE portion of Southern Italy supports Juventus, Inter or Milan respectively. My family is from Calabria, it's how I come to support Juventus.

So I think if you're from Southern Italy and support Juventus,, you definitely hate Napoli a bit more. My dad, for example, absolutely hates Napoli second only to Inter and that's because he grew up close enough that this rivalry was more felt but if you're from Torino through and through, I doubt you would care a whole lot about a bunch of Napoli fans

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Post by rincon Thu Apr 05, 2018 7:06 pm

S wrote:
I have seen that graphic a million times but I don't know what's your point. Everyone hates Juve we agree ? We hate Inter the most. So do I but I hate Napoli as much.  Is that a wrong thing ? What are you trying to suggest ?

See you as a fan have your set of dislikes and so do I and neither you or I can enforce that upon each other. We are not ultras here. We all love and support Juventus and that should matter more.


Yes man but this was long forgotten. Its not me saying that you can't like whatever. You are the one that brought it up and started it today.

Luca wrote:I think the Napoli-Juve rivalry means much more to Napoli than it does to us- I think this was @rincon's point.

As for the North-South divide, this is true but you also have to remember that a LARGE portion of Southern Italy supports Juventus, Inter or Milan respectively. My family is from Calabria, it's how I come to support Juventus.

So I think if you're from Southern Italy and support Juventus,, you definitely hate Napoli a bit more. My dad, for example, absolutely hates Napoli second only to Inter and that's because he grew up close enough that this rivalry was more felt but if you're from Torino through and through, I doubt you would care a whole lot about a bunch of Napoli fans


Yep^

This whole Juve-Napoli thing exists in Naples and in the media. @S this is not a thing for most Juve fans in Italy. Napoli have always been irrelevant except for Maradona's time. No comparison about the "one-sidedness" of this rivalry. Its only become relevant recently because Napoli are our current scudetto rivals. Even then its still nothing compared to our actual rivalries. Laughing at Napoli is more what is done.

Like Luca says, Juve is hugely followed in the south. I also have family from the north, south and centre and most of the southern ones from Avellino are the diehard Juve fans. They are the ones dealing with the whole "south" thing.

My family in Genoa who supports Juve couldn't give less of a *bleep* about Napoli Laughing The whole thing about the north and south divide projected on Juve and Napoli is overplayed. After the north west, Juve is followed the most in the south.
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Post by sportsczy Thu Apr 05, 2018 8:24 pm

madrid and bayern, as clubs, do not get along at all. in fact, I'm not sure who gets along with bayern.

too many loud mouthed executives spewing nonsense in munich.
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Post by S Thu Apr 05, 2018 8:26 pm

sportsczy wrote:in fact, I'm not sure who gets along with bayern.


Juventus do.
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Post by Luca Sun Apr 08, 2018 6:33 pm

I hope Szczesny starts in goal on Wednesday and if Bernardeschi is fit then I hope he goes for it too. We might as well play as many players who didn’t participate in the first leg’s performance as possible and focus on players that actually want to compete, should be with us next season and that aren’t there just for the spectacle of playing in Madrid

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Post by salmano9 Tue Apr 10, 2018 5:30 am

Luca wrote:I hope Szczesny starts in goal on Wednesday and if Bernardeschi is fit then I hope he goes for it too. We might as well play as many players who didn’t participate in the first leg’s performance as possible and focus on players that actually want to compete, should be with us next season and that aren’t there just for the spectacle of playing in Madrid

I highly doubt Bernardeschi is even going to be on the bench against Real. He has to get Serie A matches before coming in and starting in such tough match. I think it will be a 433 with PMatK in midfield, Mandzu-Higuain-Costa upfront, and cuadrado coming in as a sub.
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Post by salmano9 Wed Apr 11, 2018 12:37 am

We have to press high tomorrow like Roma did today if we want to qualify. A huge advantage for us is that Ramos is suspended.
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Post by juvealbanian Wed Apr 11, 2018 12:42 am

We just have to make sure we don't embarass ourselves with a 2+ goal defeat again.Forget about Roma situation.We have like 0.1% chance to go through tomorrow let's be honest.
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Post by Warrior Wed Apr 11, 2018 3:41 am

I'm calling a good ol draw, 1-1
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Post by juvealbanian Wed Apr 11, 2018 9:43 am

If Allegri has the balls we should bench Buffon and start with 3 at the back or put Lichtsteiner instead of De Sciglio at least.

4-2-2-2
..................Szczesny
Licht...Benatia...Chiellini...Sandro
.............Matuidi....Pjanic
Cuadrado.......................Costa
.......Higuain.....Mandzukic


Or : 3-4-3

.................Szczesny
......Benatia...Rugani...Chiellini
Cuadrado...Matuidi...Pjanic...Sandro
......Costa...Higuain...Mandzukic

Too bad we don't have Bernardeschi available.We could have tried Berna-Higgy-Costa upfront.

Losing again would be embarassing so we should put a fight.Who knows? It's nearly impossible for Real not to score but we should not go down without a fight at least.
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Post by rincon Wed Apr 11, 2018 9:52 am

Buffon; Sandro, Chiellini, Benatia, De Sciglio; Matuidi, Pjanic, Khedira; Mandzukic, Higuain, Costa
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