Re: The Official WWE Thread - Part 33 - WM 33 Edition

[RealGunner]

back to waking up at 5pm


It was depressing to see undertaker in this state man

At one point it looked like Reigns didnt want to win

I am sure there were many botch moves because taker couldn't do most of them right. And Reigns is a shit wrestler himself.

[Onyx]

[Great Leader Sprucenuce]

Pretty obvious sign Taker is retiring IMO.

[S]

This whole feud was woeful. Crappy build from the outset. To have this as main event was simply retarded.

Actually I would've preferred Cena's match to be the main event and I wouldn't have minded him having another Mania moment. That's how crappy most of the matches and feuds were.

[Onyx]

Wtf, Taker just broke kayfabe.

[Great Leader Sprucenuce]

This whole feud was woeful. Crappy build from the outset. To have this as main event was simply retarded.

Actually I would've preferred Cena's match to be the main event and I wouldn't have minded him having another Mania moment. That's how crappy most of the matches and feuds were.

Yeah but what else was there lol? Goldberg and Lesnar was like 5 minutes long.

They weren't gonna have Bray and Randy main event, no choice really and considering Taker is blatantly retiring it was the only choice.

[Onyx]

Thank you Taker.

[Onyx]

Best moment of the night.

[Jay29]

Just skimmed through the show. My feelings:

Hardys are back

Undertaker

I was legit getting emotional watching him after that match. That has to be it for him. It'd just be sad if they got him back for yet another Mania match he can't do.

Now the debates about where Taker is on the all times great list can begin in earnest.

All of you are fools for watching this live btw.

[Great Leader Sprucenuce]

Only reason I did is because I woke up half way through the first match lol.

But yeah I have been saying that watching it live is a terrible idea, you cannot simply create a good show for 5 hours.

I was personally enjoying it up until the end of Cena/Nikki vs Miz/Maryse but it all went downhill after that.

Some aspects of Rollins vs HHH and Bray vs Orton I enjoyed but for the most part I never really recovered my enjoyment after that.

[footyfan01]

5 Hours was never a problem. As a matter of fact, you could put a good show for even 6 hours. Look at the pre-show stuff, the Cruiserweight match was fantastic.

Problem was HHH is a horrible wrestler in today's fast paced world & his match with Rollins went for 30 minutes & sucked the place dry. Then there was bad booking, what could you do with Cena/Nikki vs Miz/Maryse, would be an average match - Cena vs Taker should have been the Main-event.

Likewise Wyatt is an average wrestler & his match with Bryan was the only classic he had, maybe Styles can get a good match. So the show went downhill.

The SD Women's Title match, Bray-Randy etc all had very short time & was rushed & couldn't tell the story fully.

HHH-Rollins was pathetic, HHH is a washedup guy & should stop hogging the limelight. Elated about the Hardys.

And who would have thought Shane vs AJ would be this good. Shane was amazing with ground submissions, holds from armbars to armdrags & his reversals of the Phenomenal Foreman/450 to Triangle Choke or DDT was cool. I think everyone expected him to do a Coast to Coast or crash & burn through the table.

But a Shooting Star Press at 48 odd, that was the moment of the night. I was vehemently against him wrestling. Hardys coming back was cool too !

[Great Leader Sprucenuce]

I mean it's pretty obvious the length of the show is a problem, no live show in any entertainment medium is this long.

It's really *bleep* difficult to maintain quality for that long, even if you had a time machine and got the best entertainers ever you'd struggle to make a good 5 hour plus show.

You'd have to be pretty deluded if you think it's not impacting the overall quality of the show. There's a reason why Royal Rumble and Survivor Series were better shows than WM and Summerslam last year.

It's because they are condensed 3 hour shows and not trying to fill the whole *bleep* roster on one show just because.

I mean they struggle to make quality programming with the 3 hour Raw's compared to the 2 hour Smackdown's and this is extreme end of the spectrum.

NXT Takeovers are consistently good because they are condensed 2 and half hour shows with little to no filler, the sooner they realise that bigger doesn't equal better the better these shows will be.

They won't though sadly.

[Jay29]

You could have the most stacked card and best entertainment possible and five hours would still be far too much. Viewers just get burned out by the time the main event comes along.

It still baffles me that a five hour shows needs a two kick-off show as well.

[Kaladin]

The night started out on a high, Aire v Neville, Shane v AJ and the RAW tagteam matches were great. Everything after Pitbull was downhill

5 hours of wrestling is fine if they can keep it interesting all the way through every match, at least for me, however thats almost impossible for WWE, especially with how they restrict their talents in ring. Im pretty sure most of the roster can put up insane matches going all out, using every move. But, the short WWE lasso style is what Vince wants

Anyone staying up for RAW tonight?

[Tomwin Lannister]

Having flicked through it, Wrestlemania was shit, that's about as much detail as I need to go in.


Product is even more dead to me after that.

[footyfan01]

Mania is always 5 hours with other segments. Now they do a Pre-show & do all the non-sensical stuff infront to squeeze everything. WWE has 2 rosters & need to fit everything - It is not like 1 wrestler is wrestling twice which is why it is suffering. It is delusional to think 5 or 4 or 3 hours would change it.

If anything 3 Hours would be much worse because Taker-Reigns, Orton-Wyatt, HHH-Rollins, Goldberg-Lesnar, Cena/Nikki etc will still take close to 2 hours & then those were the bad matches. They will probably have to cut all of (or keep maximum 1 of ) Aj/Shane, Jericho/Owens & the Tag & SD Women's match & will fit in 1 Women's Title match.

Why on earth do you blame the duration when you have Goldberg vs Lesnar, HHH vs Rollins, Taker vs Reigns, Cena/Nikki, etc booked. This is what you expect when you have these matches. And when you get 10 minutes instead of 20, you can't have a good match.

Both Survivor Series & Rumble were mediocre shows & worse than Wrestlemania. AJ vs Cena was the only good match because those 2 are top performers. The 1st half of Mania actually pretty good.

Look at NXT Takeover, they have 5 matches in 3 Hours. They have a huge time to tell a story & top in-ring performers.

[Onyx]

5 hours is fine for WM imo. It's the biggest event of the year. Wouldn't be able to fit everything in otherwise. They even had 3 matches worthy of the main show on the pre show, one of which involved Ambrose and the IC title.

[Great Leader Sprucenuce]

Bigger isn't better they managed to fit everything in fine with a 3 hour show before the network.

Trying to fit everything in is a crux of the issue, focus on quality not quantity. Not everything has to be on the show.

I blame duration because it's obvious to everyone with sense that it's the problem.

Also no Wrestlemania was not better than Survivor Series or the Royal Rumble lol. Not even close.

WM 17 is considered a goat show and it was less than 3 hours long, the length of the show should not be what makes the show standout.

The fact people are defending this greatly worries me.

[Onyx]

I think the only thing they could have taken off the card was the SD womens title match. It was definitely the weakest out of all of them. The other matches were fine imo.

WM usually has around 10 matches anyway and lasts 4 hours on average. Just checked and yeh 17 had 10-12 matches and was on for basically 4 hours.

[Onyx]

And even if they did get rid of the SD womens match the IC title match most likely would have replaced it. Should have been that way in the first place imo, no need for 2 womens matches on the main card.

[Great Leader Sprucenuce]

I just feel like the bigger the show, the more likely hood of filler and the more difficult it is to have a condensed and quality show with stuff that matters.

It's just really, really hard to have long shows actually fly by. Raw's being 3 hours instead of 2 is a massive example of this Wrestlemania's being 5 hours plus are also an example of it.

5 hours of wrestling is just ridiculous, i don't care how good/bad the talent is. Writing a show to cater for that long is an incredibly tough ask.

Also i just checked WM17 was 3 hours and 45 mins. Longer than i thought but that's still fine i suppose.

It doesn't help they are insistent on having a 2 hour pre show too! which i haven't actually watched.

Not saying it would be a good regardless, but the length of this show hurts it so much.

I much preferred NXT's show, there was only 5 matches but everyone one of them was at least good. There was no filler and i didn't feel like i didn't want to shoot myself by the time Brock and Goldberg happened. ( which in fairness to them was probably one of the better matches tbh )

Could you imagine if they did like 3 hour show of the Walking Dead or something like that? you'd likely tune out half way through. That's what happened here to me, the first half of the show was solid but the 2nd half just died a death.

[RealGunner]

We deserve a Taker speech tonight on RAW. He can't just retire without saying anything. Hopefully Kane is there too and few other legends.


Really excited for Nakamura's debut. Hopefully it's on SD.

[Great Leader Sprucenuce]

I wouldn't be surprised if he just leaves RG, it's the type of guy he is.

I would like that though, some big appreciation thing like they did with Flair.

BTW Meltzer said there's multiple NXT callups this week, i won't say who they are though. ( one of which greatly concerns me)

[Kaladin]

Is it even official that he retired lol? He just left his gear there, a sentimental act but thats it

Its up to Vince if he retires or not

[Great Leader Sprucenuce]

Nah if he wants to retire Vince will respect his wishes.

He broke kayfabe ! he's definitely retiring. A sad moment but i thought it was a great moment none the less.

I feel like i was too angry with the Reigns shit at the time to fully appreciate it though.

[Firenze]

Reigns has had an unreal run the last few years. Retired Taker, no sold his entire moveset

I think Reigns might legit, kayfabe, be the 'strongest' wrestler of all time and it's obviously hurting him with fans, hge's not a bad wrestler at all or particularly bad on the mic and has 'the look'

can't wait for Lesnar vs Reigns title feud

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