Should standing areas be reintroduced into the PL's stadiums?

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Should standing areas be reintroduced into the PL's stadiums? Empty Should standing areas be reintroduced into the PL's stadiums?

Post by Hapless_Hans Sun Oct 09, 2016 12:37 pm

Interesting and comprehensive article by Daniel Taylor about the debate whether to reintroduce standing into PL stadiums

https://www.theguardian.com/football/2016/oct/09/safe-standing-hillsborough-rail-seating-bundesliga-celtic

Quote:

It isn’t an easy subject. It is, however, an important one, and perhaps the best place to start when it comes to the issue of safe standing is to look at the number of countries who have already had the debate and concluded that if it can change football for the better then there is nothing to be afraid of.

It is the creation of a safe-standing section that helps to explain why watching football at Celtic Park can have the same effect as standing next to the speakers at an Iron Maiden concert. Germany has led the way and, one by one, the other leagues are following behind. Austria, Switzerland, Hungary, Belgium, Norway, Sweden, Denmark and the Netherlands all now operate safe standing. Australia is bringing it in. Various grounds in the United States have put it in place. Even Russia, a football environment that sometimes feels like stepping back into the 1980s, has gone for the modern option. CSKA Moscow have safe-standing areas, featuring rail seats, behind both goals in their new stadium, the Arena CSKA.

It is also apparent that the majority of Premier League clubs like the idea. Tottenham Hotspur, Crystal Palace, Sunderland, Swansea City, Burnley, Hull City and Watford are all actively pushing for safe standing, and it is commonly known that many others think it is time the league’s chief executive, Richard Scudamore, began exploratory talks with the government. Indeed, one of the people involved in the process estimates that if it went to a vote in the coming week all 20 clubs, bar Liverpool, would support a consultation process.

[...]

It does, however, feel like more and more people are acknowledging it is time to have the debate and are coming round to the idea that safe standing means exactly what it says, and is arguably safer than the common practice of supporters standing in seated areas.

What it does not mean – and it is important to be clear on this – is a return to the vast terraces where crushes were once commonplace, injuries taken for granted and a sense of danger was never too far away. A safety barrier would be on each row, eradicating the threat of overcrowding or those old terrace-tumbles when in one sudden sway you could suddenly find yourself transported 20ft in any given direction. The rail seats are bolted upright. They can be turned down for European games, when Uefa insists on all-seated stadiums, but otherwise each spectator would be given a place to stand where their seat would usually be.

[..]

The surprising thing, perhaps, is that the Premier League has never formally raised the issue when, behind the scenes, the relevant people are fully aware about the strength of support and the sports minister, Tracey Crouch, has stated the standing ban will be reassessed “once evidence from the Scottish experience is available”, the first time any government has committed to a review of the legislation.

[..]
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Post by Hapless_Hans Sun Oct 09, 2016 12:45 pm

A report about the position of post-Hillsborough groups, apparently the core of resistance against the reintroduction, towards the issue

The Liverpool supporters’ union Spirit of Shankly is to consult the club’s fans and Hillsborough families over the possible introduction of standing sections at Premier League grounds.

LSU members were asked at last month’s AGM whether the organisation should adopt a position on rail seating, following discussions with fellow supporters, and 93% voted in favour, it was announced on Wednesday, while 4.7% were against and 2.3% abstained. The proposal was in response to growing debate, including at government level, over the introduction of safe standing areas in the top two tiers of English football, and Celtic’s decision to open a 2,975-capacity standing section this season.
Liverpool and Tottenham are setting a thrilling Premier League pace | Barney Ronay
Read more

Scottish clubs are not bound by the all-seat regulations that were introduced into English football by Lord Justice Taylor’s report into the Hillsborough disaster, when 96 Liverpool fans were unlawfully killed at an FA Cup semi-final in 1989. The prospect of standing returning to Premier League and Championship grounds in any form – it is allowed at League One and Two levels – remains a contentious and understandably emotive issue for those affected by Hillsborough, and opinion is divided.

The Hillsborough Family Support Group is strongly opposed while the Hillsborough Justice Campaign, in a statement on its Facebook page, said: “There has always been a variety of views amongst HJC members. We do however, support a full and objective debate on the issue with safety being paramount.”

[...]

https://www.theguardian.com/football/2016/oct/05/liverpool-supporters-consult-hillsborough-safe-standing-anfield
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Post by Jay29 Sun Oct 09, 2016 4:29 pm

If it means ticket prices for the standing areas are cheaper, and that more young fans can attend games, them I'm all for it.

Fans stand in the lower terraces and away fans almost never sit down. Despite that, the atmosphere at grounds is still poor because of the type of fan that goes to games now. More standing won't necessarily improve the atmosphere at grounds - enabling the type of fan who likes to generate atmosphere to go to more games will.

On top of that, fans that stand in all-seater stadiums are seen as disruptive because they block views of seated fans and that creates arguments and tension with stewards. Having an area for them to actually stand is both safer and logical.

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Post by futbol_bill Sun Oct 09, 2016 5:37 pm

Standing stadiums are a thing of the past, but if they model after other sports were they have standing room at the back of each level, then there shouldn't be problems.

A couple of stories of those standing only stadiums. I recall that with the continual movement, you quite often ended up one section over at half from where you had started.

Another, a rather short friend of mine recalled he was so squashed in that he realized his feet were no longer touching the ground.
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Post by VivaStPauli Mon Oct 10, 2016 4:02 pm

Stands should be back, but they should plan for people being idiots, and panicking.
The article touches on this, if you have dividers between the rows of seats, standing isn't any less safe than being seated, and watching a football match sitting down just feels wrong, TBH.

We haven't had serious injuries in any way caused by people standing at a football match in years in Germany, I really think this is a quasi-political issue still fueled in England by the lies of the police and the Thatcher administration after the Hillsborough disaster, where they effectively laid the blame on the fans, and the way the stands were designed.

Either competent police, or safe stands, could've prevented that tragedy. No reason to not have stands, if they're safeguarded by dividers. Also, police could've prevented overcrowding.
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Post by Nishankly Mon Oct 10, 2016 5:21 pm

No they shouldn't, No police can control a crowd that has movement due to panic. Plus the height issues you can't have ascending/descending order everywhere lol


Last edited by Nishankly on Mon Oct 10, 2016 5:24 pm; edited 2 times in total
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Post by RealGunner Mon Oct 10, 2016 5:23 pm

Why would you want to stand for 90 minutes ffs
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Post by Kaladin Mon Oct 10, 2016 6:16 pm

^Amen, can't believe people near the stood for 4 f*cking hours in that RAW that i went to
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Post by zigra Mon Oct 10, 2016 7:46 pm

I guess there would still be enough seated places to buy for people who consider standing for less than 2 hours a challenge hmm
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