The boom in Chinese football

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Post by S Wed Feb 03, 2016 7:25 am

http://www.theguardian.com/football/blog/2016/feb/01/why-china-not-mls-is-luring-stars-away-from-europe

Good read on how China want to improve the game and make it a big sport in the country with investments backed by the government as well.

Considering they're a massive country,i could see them developing a sustainable model in the long run.TV deal has jumped from $9m a yr to $200m a yr so thats some massive progress right there.
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Post by Firenze Wed Feb 03, 2016 7:46 am

is FFP a thing there? if not it needs to be implemented otherwise chinese teams will dominate the ACL hmm
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Post by free_cat Wed Feb 03, 2016 7:48 am

The problem here is that it will be very difficult for them to create a league that attracts more interest for the chinese than the foreign leagues. However, China is so massive that they can have a 20 teams league all based in cities of more than 3 milion, which even with mild interest can pack 50.000 stadiums easily and in the long run become economically potent.
We'll see.
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Post by Art Morte Wed Feb 03, 2016 7:49 am

Even at $200m a season divided by 16 clubs that's just $12.5m per club. This boom will either sustain or fall depending on whether the wealthy individuals who've gotten into football in China are in it for the long term.
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Post by Firenze Wed Feb 03, 2016 7:55 am

I think it will definitely be able to attract more and more notable names going forward (and not just stars in the twilight of their career looking for one last payday) maybe not truly elite players but the wages and the fact that from what i've seen, most of the players that end up moving out there have a far, far lower amount of games per season to play make it attractive to players that are in the middle stages of their career IMO

I'd say I can't see them garnering much interest from the global market but with the population of china + the rest of asia that doesn't matter all that much.

Though, from past experiences of players that have moved out there they tend not to last very long due to the culture shock, will be interesting to see if the likes of gervinho and martinez last more than 15 months
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Post by S Wed Feb 03, 2016 8:02 am

Art Morte wrote:Even at $200m a season divided by 16 clubs that's just $12.5m per club. This boom will either sustain or fall depending on whether the wealthy individuals who've gotten into football in China are in it for the long term.

You forget the clubs backed by rich sponsors are in support of the Government as well.
It seems to me there is a dedicated plan to improve the sport in the long run.

Why i think this could work in the long run is because of the success of the Super League in India.It runs only for 3 months but it has attracted massive viewership(on par with Cricket) and has had packed crowds for most games.Its quickly turning into a profitable venture for sponsorers.
So if India could do it,why not China who are way ahead of India both in money and footballing infrastructure.

The fact that their TV deal has gone 20x from their previous deal shows there are good signs.
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Post by Art Morte Wed Feb 03, 2016 8:14 am

S wrote:
Art Morte wrote:Even at $200m a season divided by 16 clubs that's just $12.5m per club. This boom will either sustain or fall depending on whether the wealthy individuals who've gotten into football in China are in it for the long term.

You forget the clubs backed by rich sponsors are in support of the Government as well.
It seems to me there is a dedicated plan to improve the sport in the long run.

Why i think this could work in the long run is because of the success of the Super League in India.It runs only for 3 months but it has attracted massive viewership(on par with Cricket) and has had packed crowds for most games.Its quickly turning into a profitable venture for sponsorers.
So if India could do it,why not China who are way ahead of India both in money and footballing infrastructure.

The fact that their TV deal has gone 20x from their previous deal shows there are good signs.
The government support is such a vague thing that I don't know what to make of it. Surely the government isn't directly funding all these big money moves? I have no idea where the line goes in China when it comes to government spending, but surely they're not bank rolling football clubs?

Maybe they "encourage" wealthy individuals or companies to spend on football clubs. Turn a blind eye to taxes or something or give them favorable commercial deals. I don't know. What exactly does it mean that "government supports investment in Chinese football"?
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Post by S Wed Feb 03, 2016 8:37 am

Art Morte wrote: What exactly does it mean that "government supports investment in Chinese football"?


Yes i mean to say they're encouraging them to invest in the sport in the larger interests of Chinese football.Maybe this means seeking political favors from the govt. or like you said, a tax exemption on certain things.Some tycoons maybe doing it purely for the love of the sport.
But i am just saying rich businessmen may feel incentivised when they have the support of the government.Their President is a big football fan afterall.
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Post by zenmaster Wed Feb 03, 2016 10:42 am

S wrote:
Art Morte wrote:Even at $200m a season divided by 16 clubs that's just $12.5m per club. This boom will either sustain or fall depending on whether the wealthy individuals who've gotten into football in China are in it for the long term.

You forget the clubs backed by rich sponsors are in support of the Government as well.
It seems to me there is a dedicated plan to improve the sport in the long run.

Why i think this could work in the long run is because of the success of the Super League in India.It runs only for 3 months but it has attracted massive viewership(on par with Cricket) and has had packed crowds for most games.Its quickly turning into a profitable venture for sponsorers.
So if India could do it,why not China who are way ahead of India both in money and footballing infrastructure.

The fact that their TV deal has gone 20x from their previous deal shows there are good signs.


The ISL was Super Hit in India.

Average home attendances for Kerela Blasters FC :
Max 62,013 Min 32,313 Average 52,008

This one day the attendence was more then Arsenal - Liverpool  match at Emirates. But the ticket pricing is very less. 2-16$ price range for a game.

Last season they managed to pull Robarto Carlos as a Manager and Anelka as a player/manager.
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Post by Guest Wed Feb 03, 2016 10:46 am

zenmaster wrote:
S wrote:
Art Morte wrote:Even at $200m a season divided by 16 clubs that's just $12.5m per club. This boom will either sustain or fall depending on whether the wealthy individuals who've gotten into football in China are in it for the long term.

You forget the clubs backed by rich sponsors are in support of the Government as well.
It seems to me there is a dedicated plan to improve the sport in the long run.

Why i think this could work in the long run is because of the success of the Super League in India.It runs only for 3 months but it has attracted massive viewership(on par with Cricket) and has had packed crowds for most games.Its quickly turning into a profitable venture for sponsorers.
So if India could do it,why not China who are way ahead of India both in money and footballing infrastructure.

The fact that their TV deal has gone 20x from their previous deal shows there are good signs.


The ISL was Super Hit in India.

Average home attendances for Kerela Blasters FC :
Max 62,013 Min 32,313 Average 52,008

This one day the attendence was more then Arsenal - Liverpool match at Emirates.


To be fair though as a city Kerala has 30+ million people. That is nearly the 4x the size of London. Everything attendance-wise there is inflated due to the large population.


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Post by zenmaster Wed Feb 03, 2016 10:52 am

Betty La Fea wrote:
zenmaster wrote:
S wrote:

You forget the clubs backed by rich sponsors are in support of the Government as well.
It seems to me there is a dedicated plan to improve the sport in the long run.

Why i think this could work in the long run is because of the success of the Super League in India.It runs only for 3 months but it has attracted massive viewership(on par with Cricket) and has had packed crowds for most games.Its quickly turning into a profitable venture for sponsorers.
So if India could do it,why not China who are way ahead of India both in money and footballing infrastructure.

The fact that their TV deal has gone 20x from their previous deal shows there are good signs.


The ISL was Super Hit in India.

Average home attendances for Kerela Blasters FC :
Max 62,013 Min 32,313 Average 52,008

This one day the attendence was more then Arsenal - Liverpool match at Emirates.


To be fair though as a city Kerala has 30+ million people. That is nearly the 4x the size of London. Everything attendance-wise there is inflated due to the large population.



^ Agree.

Also the point being that people are willing to come to stadium and pay if there is a quality football to offer.
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Post by Nivash Wed Feb 03, 2016 12:40 pm

Betty La Fea wrote:
zenmaster wrote:
S wrote:

You forget the clubs backed by rich sponsors are in support of the Government as well.
It seems to me there is a dedicated plan to improve the sport in the long run.

Why i think this could work in the long run is because of the success of the Super League in India.It runs only for 3 months but it has attracted massive viewership(on par with Cricket) and has had packed crowds for most games.Its quickly turning into a profitable venture for sponsorers.
So if India could do it,why not China who are way ahead of India both in money and footballing infrastructure.

The fact that their TV deal has gone 20x from their previous deal shows there are good signs.


The ISL was Super Hit in India.

Average home attendances for Kerela Blasters FC :
Max 62,013 Min 32,313 Average 52,008

This one day the attendence was more then Arsenal - Liverpool match at Emirates.


To be fair though as a city Kerala has 30+ million people. That is nearly the 4x the size of London. Everything attendance-wise there is inflated due to the large population.



Isn't that the point though? Given their huge populations, attendance and support at the games will be inflated, and accordingly, so too will revenues be, until they're at a point where their league can't be ignored.


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Post by Socur Toxanarosa Wed Feb 03, 2016 1:39 pm

Lots working in subhuman conditions, earning peanuts and the government spend on football rofl
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Post by Art Morte Wed Feb 03, 2016 4:20 pm

I wonder what's a) the difference in quality between these big money signings and the Chinese players in the league and b) the difference in wages? I'm sure it's great for team spirit when a few guys make 10 times as much as the rest of the squad combined x)
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Post by Great Leader Sprucenuce Wed Feb 03, 2016 4:21 pm

How is this any different to the Russian/Ukraine stuff which has gone on for years though?

Seems like it's same overrated, money hungry players as well. Until genuine quality players go there it's of total irrelevance.
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Post by Art Morte Wed Feb 03, 2016 5:06 pm

The disparity is bigger. Ukraine and Russia especially are in different class as football nations to China. I reckon both have produced dozens of better players than China's all-time best - whoever that might be.
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Post by S Thu Feb 04, 2016 2:07 pm

Texeira to Jiangsu for €50m

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-3430862/Liverpool-target-Alex-Teixeira-closing-stunning-35m-Jiangsu-Suning.html

China :bow:
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Post by Twoism Thu Feb 04, 2016 2:33 pm

Will be the same as LPL for LOL, billionaire owning teams rarely work in China, it's hobby 1st business 2nd for them. Infrastructure is key, if u talk long term then collaborated academy with big clubs is a good start, not creating super league and buy super stars. China has proven in the past that they could do it long term with table tennis or badminton, every freaking child in China play those since 1st grade.
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Post by ExtremistEnigma Thu Feb 04, 2016 5:34 pm

Betty La Fea wrote:
To be fair though as a city Kerala has 30+ million people. That is nearly the 4x the size of London. Everything attendance-wise there is inflated due to the large population.
Kerala is a state though.

If Teixeira goes to China, I am going to stop trusting RedOranje 'cause apparently there was no concrete evidence that we were going to sign Lovren and Teixeira wants to break into the Brazil national team. Laughing
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Post by sportsczy Thu Feb 04, 2016 5:58 pm

There's no FFP...  clubs are owned by billionaires and can spend as much as they want.  Given the massive audience in China, it's very feasible.  There are also huge markets adjoining China that can feed the league.

These guys have so much money that taking massive losses for a while until the league builds up is just a piss in the bucket for them.
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Post by farfan Thu Feb 04, 2016 6:16 pm

I wish they went the Japan / Korea way by building up young talent instead of the gulf model of over spending on washed up players.
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Post by Art Morte Thu Feb 04, 2016 6:34 pm

About building young talent in China, I'm curious to see how it goes. I understand they've made football compulsory in schools or something like that. But kids only become great players if they really want to play it themselves. It's difficult to force. Why a tiny place like Uruguay produces so many great players is because kids play a lot of football in their spare time. That's what it takes. I don't know if there's this kind of culture among kids in China.
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Post by S Fri Feb 05, 2016 6:28 am

farfan wrote:I wish they went the Japan / Korea way by building up young talent instead of the gulf model of  over spending on washed up players.


I guess they want to do both ? I would say getting quality players/coaches from abroad is equally important if you want to groom homegrown talent.

And China unlike Gulf countries can actually sustain this big spending in the longer run.So no harm in what kind of strategy they're adopting atm.
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Post by Art Morte Fri Feb 05, 2016 6:50 am

Right, so Alex Teixeira has moved to China, too. This is probably a historic moment? This guy looked good enough to play for some of the biggest teams in Europe, but opted for China instead. Has there ever been a player of Teixeira's perceived quality that spent his prime playing only at level such as Ukraine and China? The other players who have made these big money moves to China have all played in top European leagues, I think. It feels weird, but also sort of intriguing to see where this boom goes.
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Post by S Fri Feb 05, 2016 9:09 am

And btw,you guys should do more research on the Chinese Super league.
They are only allowed to buy 5 foreign players for each team and allowed to field only 4 foreigners in the starting XI.
So its not like they're just focusing on stacking up as many foreign players they can.
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