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Post by iftikhar Mon Oct 05, 2015 11:25 am

So Rodgers has been sacked. But where does that place FSG/John W Henry & Co.??? While I believe they have the best interest for Liverpool in their heart, their strategies certainly leaves a lot to be desired. Hopefully they would be doing some soul searching over their own misdeeds as well. After all, just as Suarez alone didn't carry us to second place finish; Rodgers alone isn't cause for the slide that followed.

#1. This has already been mentioned by commentators, why didn't they sack Rodgers at the end of last season??? That would have given the new manager more time and money for the rebuilding :facepalm: scheme.

#2. Their 'buying young talented players' model is severely flawed. You can't compete for Champions League spots with unproven (no matter how talented) players. Without CL, a club simply don't have the financial and brand power to sustain itself.

#3. Many/most clubs are operating successfully with DoF/S. However, the Transfer Committee is the most cumbersome and bureaucratic version of DoF/S. Either they should have installed a proper (and competent) DoF/S or should have allowed manager's discretion.
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Post by Sri Mon Oct 05, 2015 12:11 pm

#1 is a blunder imho.

#2 We struggled with that model for years. Tottenham are taking a similar approach now with the stadium project - however, they are a much smaller club; they might manage even without a Wenger at their helm.

#3 Never been convinced of a DoF/S model - more so at Arsenal though. The person deciding on transfers should be the manager responsible for the squad. DoF/S works if there is a trainer/coach and not a manager per se. Managing and training a squad are two different things.

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Post by mr-r34 Mon Oct 05, 2015 12:14 pm

It's been a failed 3.5 year experiment by FSG, they can't afford to fail again, really baffling how dumb they could be, why give him another season if your only going to give him 8 games or so. I don't mind the Rodgers sack, but it's so silly that this didn't happen before, it'll be a year wasted.

Anyways they really need to adapt themselves, seems they still don't know how to run a football club, unfortunately they have the last say in all matters so we are stuck with them for now, they invested in LFC, this isn't about bringing success to LFC for them it's about making the club profitable, if that includes tittles that's a bonus.
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Post by Art Morte Mon Oct 05, 2015 1:53 pm

1. Yes, backing Rodgers big in the market and then sacking him 8 games into the season isn't very smart.

2. We paid peanuts for Sterling and sold him for £50m, I'd say that's pretty successful buying-young-talent policy. Coutinho comes to mind, too.

3. I do hope the new manager can decide 100% on his own how he wants to spend the available cash.


Overall I'm 9/10 happy with FSG. They've been pouring money into the club, improving the stadium, keeping our commercial business up to date and seem more secure to me than some single rich owner who might wake up one day and realize he doesn't fancy the club any longer. My only criticism on FSG so far is their inexperience in football, which, I think, showed in how long they believed Rodgers was actually doing the right things. They didn't have the experience to see he was bang average. That has cost us, but I find it hard to blame FSG too much, because I believe they had good intentions all along.
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Post by Sri Mon Oct 05, 2015 1:58 pm

They are far from being the worst owners.

However, there is clearly a room for improvement in their approach.

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Post by iftikhar Mon Oct 05, 2015 2:50 pm

srigooner wrote:#3 Never been convinced of a DoF/S model - more so at Arsenal though. The person deciding on transfers should be the manager responsible for the squad. DoF/S works if there is a trainer/coach and not a manager per se. Managing and training a squad are two different things.
I'm actually undecided on this issue, mostly due to my (very) limited knowledge about how other major clubs operate. But don't the likes of Bayern, Dortmund, Juentus, Atletico etc. operate with DoS/F???

@Art Morte wrote:2. We paid peanuts for Sterling and sold him for £50m, I'd say that's pretty successful buying-young-talent policy. Coutinho comes to mind, too.
Agreed. But to what end??? This would have been a good approach for a mid-level club that don't have high target and which requires decent revenue. Without CL (and title) we will have shrinking revenue.

FSG has done decently, considering what our previous owners were like. They have pumped in funds. But their vision/strategy has to change to make Liverpool successful.
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Post by Sri Mon Oct 05, 2015 2:53 pm

@iftikhar wrote:
srigooner wrote:#3 Never been convinced of a DoF/S model - more so at Arsenal though. The person deciding on transfers should be the manager responsible for the squad. DoF/S works if there is a trainer/coach and not a manager per se. Managing and training a squad are two different things.
I'm actually undecided on this issue, mostly due to my (very) limited knowledge about how other major clubs operate. But don't the likes of Bayern, Dortmund, Juentus, Atletico etc. operate with DoS/F???


Not an expert either, but at least German clubs seem to operate more on the trainer model. That said, Pep does have a strong influence on transfers at Buyern, I think. hmm
The only thing I know about Serie A is the names of a few bigger clubs. So I'll nto comment on that Very Happy

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Post by McAgger Mon Oct 05, 2015 4:30 pm

Re: sacking Rodgers 8 games into the season and not in the summer

Could it be that FSG wanted Rodgers gone in the summer however their main 2 guys Klopp and Ancelotti wanted to take a sabbatical and not start working right away. So they kept contact with the two replacement coaches and let Rodgers have one final shot until Klopp/Ancelotti were ready to take over.

It was a win win situation for them. If Rodgers proceeds to turn Liverpool into a winning machine then no need to sack him and they look like very patient owners. If he fails well they are just waiting for Klopp/Ancelotti to give a green light.

Regarding the money spent in the summer. Maybe all the signings were committee signings that were going to happen regardless. hmm
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Post by Sri Mon Oct 05, 2015 4:35 pm

Is that insider info or your speculation?

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Post by McAgger Mon Oct 05, 2015 4:59 pm

srigooner wrote:Is that insider info or your speculation?


Just spitballing.

I find it hard to believe multi-million dollar businessmen would be so stupid so something has to make logical sense.
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Post by Unique Mon Oct 05, 2015 7:01 pm

imo fsg wanted to give Rodgers till Christmas. but seeing as Chelsea will be after a new manager soon and the 2 managers we are looking at would also be on the Chelsea list they thought go for one of them now.
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Post by Sri Mon Oct 05, 2015 7:19 pm

@Unique wrote:imo fsg wanted to give Rodgers till Christmas. but seeing as Chelsea will be after a new manager soon and the 2 managers we are looking at would also be on the Chelsea list they thought go for one of them now.


That's a much better explanation ffs! Proud

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Post by Red Alert Tue Oct 06, 2015 8:08 am

Don't call me James wrote:Re: sacking Rodgers 8 games into the season and not in the summer

Could it be that FSG wanted Rodgers gone in the summer however their main 2 guys Klopp and Ancelotti wanted to take a sabbatical and not start working right away. So they kept contact with the two replacement coaches and let Rodgers have one final shot until Klopp/Ancelotti were ready to take over.

It was a win win situation for them. If Rodgers proceeds to turn Liverpool into a winning machine then no need to sack him and they look like very patient owners. If he fails well they are just waiting for Klopp/Ancelotti to give a green light.

Regarding the money spent in the summer. Maybe all the signings were committee signings that were going to happen regardless. hmm


Not going to lie, I won't be surprised if Firminho isn't a Rodgers signing. Maybe he was bought as a gift for Klopp instead. The amount of times he was played out of position / just looked awkward on the field was far too much.
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Post by iftikhar Tue Oct 06, 2015 9:35 am

@Red Alert wrote:
Don't call me James wrote:Re: sacking Rodgers 8 games into the season and not in the summer

Could it be that FSG wanted Rodgers gone in the summer however their main 2 guys Klopp and Ancelotti wanted to take a sabbatical and not start working right away. So they kept contact with the two replacement coaches and let Rodgers have one final shot until Klopp/Ancelotti were ready to take over.

It was a win win situation for them. If Rodgers proceeds to turn Liverpool into a winning machine then no need to sack him and they look like very patient owners. If he fails well they are just waiting for Klopp/Ancelotti to give a green light.

Regarding the money spent in the summer. Maybe all the signings were committee signings that were going to happen regardless. hmm


Not going to lie, I won't be surprised if Firminho isn't a Rodgers signing. Maybe he was bought as a gift for Klopp instead. The amount of times he was played out of position / just looked awkward on the field was far too much.
Very few players played in proper positions. But let's not churn-out old bitterness.
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Post by Red Alert Mon Feb 08, 2016 6:10 am

Tony BarrettVerified account
‏@TonyBarretTimes
Liverpool considering a review of elements of their new ticket price structure in light of Saturday's protests at Anfield.

:bow: :bow: :bow:

Can't wait for these guys to leave Liverpool too.
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Post by Art Morte Mon Feb 08, 2016 10:03 am

lol they've been great owners so far, only slightly let down by their inexperience.
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Post by Red Alert Wed Feb 10, 2016 5:07 am

"Great owners".

Meh. Let's agree to disagree.
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Post by Art Morte Wed Feb 10, 2016 8:19 am

There's been money available for transfers, we're commercially pretty well placed and there's an expansion going on at Anfield. That's as good ownership as it gets. Their inexperience on actual football matters has been their only weakness, giving Rodgers too much time and money when they should have seen it's not working out, but I'm willing to forgive that because the good stuff they've been doing is more important in the long term.
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Post by Red Alert Wed Feb 10, 2016 10:39 am

An expansion (which is long overdue) was always going to be on the agenda to any "owner" of the club. It shouldn't overshadow their faults.

There's only been "money available for transfers" when FSG know a big player is getting sold for silly money. Our net spend is actually quite "low" if you want to look at it since they've been at the club. Dalglish's net spend in a year and a half was 40m, Brendan Rodgers over 3-4 years was 90m. That's not that HIGH. That's roughly 15-20m a year. Keep in mind the new TV right deal that's essentially giving every club roughly 100m pounds just for being in the PL. Now I really can't be bothered comparing that to City's, Chelsea's, Arsenal's etc but keep mind we actually need to REBUILD the squad. They have more quality, better players, better everything. And they CONTINUE to improve, we don't. (Chelsea's year is an outlier.) Look at our squad 6 years later. There's a lot of "mediocrity in it. Regardless of what majority of this forum believes with the whole "we have better squads than Leicester why do we lose to them" etc our current squad is no better than what Roy Hodgson inherited in 2010.  

Which brings me to my next point. Since FSG have been at Liverpool we've hardly improved on the pitch. We've actually been in 4 different rebuilds since they've been here:
-First post Roy Hodgson era/Dalglish.
-Second Rodgers.
-Third post Suarez.
-Fourth, well now Klopp which has hardly begun.

What exactly is their goal ON the pitch? That's FOUR rebuilds in SIX years. How are you supposed to be successful like that? Are we going forward?

Liverpool is always going to be great commercially. They're a world wide brand. Everybody that follows football knows about Liverpool. It's not hard to sell Liverpool's image. Hell I'm sure the only reason they bought Liverpool was to promote FSG and FSG's company. There's not really much to suggest they care about Liverpool on the pitch.

At the end of the day, just because G+H *bleep* us over in the passed does not mean FSG is doing a "good" job. They may be keeping us "sustainable" off the pitch, but they're keeping us sustainable as a mid table club. And honestly, I, for one, cannot wait to see the back of them.
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Post by Unique Wed Feb 10, 2016 10:49 am

@Red Alert wrote:An expansion (which is long overdue) was always going to be on the agenda to any "owner" of the club. It shouldn't overshadow their faults.

There's only been "money available for transfers" when FSG know a big player is getting sold for silly money. Our net spend is actually quite "low" if you want to look at it since they've been at the club. Dalglish's net spend in a year and a half was 40m, Brendan Rodgers over 3-4 years was 90m. That's not that HIGH. That's roughly 15-20m a year. Keep in mind the new TV right deal that's essentially giving every club roughly 100m pounds just for being in the PL. Now I really can't be bothered comparing that to City's, Chelsea's, Arsenal's etc but keep mind we actually need to REBUILD the squad. They have more quality, better players, better everything. And they CONTINUE to improve, we don't. (Chelsea's year is an outlier.) Look at our squad 6 years later. There's a lot of "mediocrity in it. Regardless of what majority of this forum believes with the whole "we have better squads than Leicester why do we lose to them" etc our current squad is no better than what Roy Hodgson inherited in 2010.  

Which brings me to my next point. Since FSG have been at Liverpool we've hardly improved on the pitch. We've actually been in 4 different rebuilds since they've been here:
-First post Roy Hodgson era/Dalglish.
-Second Rodgers.
-Third post Suarez.
-Fourth, well now Klopp which has hardly begun.

What exactly is their goal ON the pitch? That's FOUR rebuilds in SIX years. How are you supposed to be successful like that? Are we going forward?

Liverpool is always going to be great commercially. They're a world wide brand. Everybody that follows football knows about Liverpool. It's not hard to sell Liverpool's image. Hell I'm sure the only reason they bought Liverpool was to promote FSG and FSG's company. There's not really much to suggest they care about Liverpool on the pitch.

At the end of the day, just because G+H *bleep* us over in the passed does not mean FSG is doing a "good" job. They may be keeping us "sustainable" off the pitch, but they're keeping us sustainable as a mid table club. And honestly, I, for one, cannot wait to see the back of them.
we should have just got claudio ranieri and gave him £20 to spend. cheers
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Post by Red Alert Thu Jun 08, 2017 12:37 pm

"HEY GUYS VAN DIJK CHOSE LIVERPOOL OVER CITY, CHELSEA AND ARSENAL WOOOOO"

Seriously. *bleep* them.

I can't deal with anyone that thinks they're good for us. The amount of PR bullshit they spread / leak is crazy. They should be considered lucky if they don't get hit by a transfer ban.

This isn't even about Van Dijk.

How many times have we thrown OUR OWN PLAYERS under the bus to pressurize them into signing a new contract?

How many times have we scapegoated player after player for these owners? Torres... Sterling... Suarez to a lesser extent?

They're whole ordeal with Rodgers was laughable and set us back a few years. Was literally no better than Dalglish. And spent 3 times more.

They haven't done much since coming in 2010. They've been here for 7 years, what have they got to show for it? One Carling Cup is it? I can't deal with this shit anymoreeeeeeeeeeeeeee. Just *bleep* go.
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Post by iftikhar Sun Oct 08, 2017 4:11 pm

http://www.liverpoolecho.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/who-amanda-staveley-liverpool-supporting-13732612

Thoughts hmm
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Post by iftikhar Wed Oct 16, 2019 7:24 pm

It's been nine years.

How do you evaluate them at this point. Things seems to be on an upward trajectory since Klopp came in, but I can't Klopp signing under such owners like H&G and they have created an environment for Klopp to flourish.

So, have they passed the test or will the Holy Grail decide that.
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Post by Helmer Fri Oct 25, 2019 9:03 pm

Don't call me James wrote:Re: sacking Rodgers 8 games into the season and not in the summer

Could it be that FSG wanted Rodgers gone in the summer however their main 2 guys Klopp and Ancelotti wanted to take a sabbatical and not start working right away. So they kept contact with the two replacement coaches and let Rodgers have one final shot until Klopp/Ancelotti were ready to take over.

It was a win win situation for them. If Rodgers proceeds to turn Liverpool into a winning machine then no need to sack him and they look like very patient owners. If he fails well they are just waiting for Klopp/Ancelotti to give a green light.

Regarding the money spent in the summer. Maybe all the signings were committee signings that were going to happen regardless. hmm

After listening to many interviews , it seems like many of these things are true. I miss Hames in our section.
@Art Morte wrote:There's been money available for transfers, we're commercially pretty well placed and there's an expansion going on at Anfield. That's as good ownership as it gets. Their inexperience on actual football matters has been their only weakness, giving Rodgers too much time and money when they should have seen it's not working out, but I'm willing to forgive that because the good stuff they've been doing is more important in the long term.

It was clear as day even that time that they were inexperienced in terms of football and their intention looked very much right. I still cant believe RA posted all those stupid posts. Dont know what was wrong in his personal life.

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Post by Helmer Fri Oct 25, 2019 9:12 pm

@iftikhar wrote:It's been nine years.

How do you evaluate them at this point. Things seems to be on an upward trajectory since Klopp came in, but I can't Klopp signing under such owners like H&G and they have created an environment for Klopp to flourish.

So, have they passed the test or will the Holy Grail decide that.

Considering they had so much inexperience at that time, they were extremely lucky or we are extremely lucky that they managed to get Klopp somehow.

We needed a personality like Klopp at the club after Stevie left and this turned out to be even better, a match made in heaven. Some of the changes in the background, including the transfer committee and Edwards, suggest that the club culture has changed from within. Klopp is obviously the foundation of all that for now, illustrated by his pre match interview before Spurs game. But I feel like it has definitely created enough deep roots to hold it altogether in the long term.

Now only thing missing is the EPL title but if Klopp remains at the club for next 2-3 seasons, I am sure we will win it sooner or later cheers

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