Preseason discussion

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Post by vanDEEZ on Mon Jul 25, 2016 10:57 pm

I was going off the post- testing out the Benzema/Morata partnership, so Bale and Ronaldo would both be on the wings.

I personally wouldn't test the Benzema/Morata partnership as they should rarely be on the pitch at the same time if everyone is fit.

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Post by Mr Nick09 on Mon Jul 25, 2016 11:06 pm

the 442 is because Ronaldo wont be back for the supercup. Most likely it will very much look like a 433 with Morata playing on the left.

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Post by FennecFox7 on Tue Jul 26, 2016 4:35 am

@vanDEEZ wrote:I was going off the post- testing out the Benzema/Morata partnership, so Bale and Ronaldo would both be on the wings.

I personally wouldn't test the Benzema/Morata partnership as they should rarely be on the pitch at the same time if everyone is fit.


I disagree. Under zidane, bale and Ronaldo are putting defensive shifts every game. Ronaldo has turned into an engine player at times. And I'm shocked but that's how it is now.

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Post by vanDEEZ on Tue Jul 26, 2016 6:24 am

@FennecFox7 wrote:
@vanDEEZ wrote:I was going off the post- testing out the Benzema/Morata partnership, so Bale and Ronaldo would both be on the wings.

I personally wouldn't test the Benzema/Morata partnership as they should rarely be on the pitch at the same time if everyone is fit.


I disagree. Under zidane, bale and Ronaldo are putting defensive shifts every game. Ronaldo has turned into an engine player at times. And I'm shocked but that's how it is now.



Looool my sides
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Post by halamadrid2 on Tue Jul 26, 2016 7:02 am

Ronaldo only tracks back in big games Atleti, Barca, CL knockouts. Other than that he doesn't. Bale on the other hand tracks back every game and that's one thing we can thank ZZ for

Also deez, 442 is just for the supercup where Ronaldo and perhaps Kroos and/or Bale won't be entirely matchfit so may not start. It's probably going to be Isco on one wing and Lucas on the other. It will be tested against PSG who are more matchfit than us so it'll be interesting to see how that turns out. Benz/Morata is a proper striker partnership one is a SS and the other CF. I am confident they'll look good together

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Post by FennecFox7 on Tue Jul 26, 2016 8:38 am

@vanDEEZ wrote:
@FennecFox7 wrote:
@vanDEEZ wrote:I was going off the post- testing out the Benzema/Morata partnership, so Bale and Ronaldo would both be on the wings.

I personally wouldn't test the Benzema/Morata partnership as they should rarely be on the pitch at the same time if everyone is fit.


I disagree. Under zidane, bale and Ronaldo are putting defensive shifts every game. Ronaldo has turned into an engine player at times. And I'm shocked but that's how it is now.



Looool my sides


Let's give credit to where it's due. They have done a decent job at it. It remains to be seen if they can keep it up into next season however
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Post by titosantill on Tue Jul 26, 2016 4:09 pm

@vandeez, when the whole squad returns, you cannot have morata and benzema up front with bale and cristiano on the flanks for multiple reasons; you'll end up restricting the midfield trio to a double pivot, probably modric and kroos, thus taking out the defensive spine in casemiro. even if you want one of modric/kroos with casemiro, its not defensive enough. two, if you're playing 2 CFs, then you need another cf on the bench, in the even one or even both get injured.

three, one of them may have issues with the position, considering cr hasn't been a typical winger in years, so one of them could end up  drifting to parts of the pitch they aren't comfortable with. four, morata has done little to nothing to be benching  guys like kroos, modrid or casemiro- who may not be a star, but as the only dm on our team (exclude benzema, i set myself up for that one), is very valuable
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Post by futbol_bill on Tue Jul 26, 2016 5:41 pm

Morata is there to be a sub. Zidane has said he essentially replaces Jese in being able to replace any of BBC. It will be primarily Benz, but he has shown he can play the wing as well (that's coming from Zidane). He is playing along side Benz for the supercup, but that's because Ronaldo isn't there. They did say they would be playing a 4-4-2 for that game (and perhaps in the couple of US games they have before that). But saying Benz and Morata won't play together literally says you think there won't be injuries to either Bale or Ronaldo nor that they won't be spelled off occasionally. Also keep in mind that James and Lucas will see action up front as well.
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Post by titosantill on Tue Jul 26, 2016 6:20 pm

that's not what i'm saying, hence i started my comment with "when the whole squad returns"; meaning this is a temporary move cos cron's not present and if the whole squad is available and fit to play, unless its some meaningless game like ucl games where we've qualified or top the group, or some kings cup game against a scrub, playing both up front is not realistic. when i make these points, i make them in the context of everyone being available and fit, and in games where we need max points.....in the event of injuries, suspensions, or things of that nature, we can play any formation based on the available players we have. but in must-win games with everybody fit and ready to go, NO, its unrealistic
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Post by sportsczy on Tue Jul 26, 2016 6:59 pm

I think BBC is the preferred and #1 setup.  No question.  I also feel that Vasquez should be given a shot at first sub if either Ronaldo or Bale go down given what he showed last year.  He earned it.  So Morata is really there to give Benz a blow.  But he will get opportunities imo because two of BBC get injured fairly regularly unfortunately.

As far as the midfield... still a lot of problems.  We have Casemiro-Kroos-Modric, which is fine.  But we don't have single other CM to back them up Laughing.  Kova, Isco and James are all AMs to me.  That needs to be addressed.

Defense is fine.  Keeping is fine.

Just need to figure out that midfield.

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Post by halamadrid2 on Tue Jul 26, 2016 7:43 pm

Probable starting XI according to COPE

Kiko
Carvajal-Varane-Nacho-Marcelo
Vasquez-Casemiro-Kova-Isco
Morata-Benz

Cant wait Proud

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Post by Valkyrja on Tue Jul 26, 2016 8:16 pm

Isco and Kovacic are CMs . Isco played his best football with us in that LCM role. Even against city he gave that WC performance at LCM with Kroos behind him and Modric.

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Post by titosantill on Tue Jul 26, 2016 8:54 pm

isco's an attacking midfielder. he made a name for himself playing am at malaga. and even in his first season here, the first couple of games where he was good, he played am. originally he's an am, t'was ancelotti who tried to turn him into seedorf by placing him in the cm role. and i'd hardly call the performance against city world class. i never saw kova play at inter, so i don't know his original position. But isco and james are definitely attacking midfielders forced to play the cm role
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Post by sportsczy on Tue Jul 26, 2016 9:14 pm

At Inter, the tried him everywhere. Played holding mid and looked about as good there as Kroos did... he was ok at CM... but he really shined when he was allowed to attack. He's got superior technique and speed (i thought it was Serie A; but he's genuinely fast).

So I don't know. Maybe he can become a better CM. But his best position at Inter was more of a attacking mid, although not to the extent that James and Isco were.

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Post by chad4401 on Wed Jul 27, 2016 2:28 am

@Valkyrja wrote:Isco and Kovacic are CMs . Isco played his best football with us in that LCM role. Even against city he gave that WC performance at LCM with Kroos behind him and Modric.


Laughing

You know saying that doesn't make it true, every match plays he is motm yet continues to get bench after getting chances, he sucks at lcm, dribbling and leaving the mid behind after turning over the ball, is not decisive but reason to ride the bench for weeks under 3 different managers.

If isco wasn't so hyped in spain as the next iniesta, RM would have sold him like illarra fact.

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Post by halamadrid2 on Thu Jul 28, 2016 2:24 am

Really impressed with Llorente and Odegaard this game. For those who dont think Llorente is first team quality i hope you're watching because he is awesome

Mariano is too haphazard. He needs to calm down

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Post by halamadrid2 on Thu Jul 28, 2016 2:43 am

Also Kova isn't doing enough to convince ZZ he can stay. Like he is trying but just like against Las Palmas he makes a stupid pass without looking which results in a goal. That's the kind of thing he needs to root out from his game

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Post by shadexticos on Thu Jul 28, 2016 2:47 am

@hala, I posted somethings about llorente and how I have always rated him high even when he debuted about 3 seasons ago. I still rate him high and I'm glad someone noticed him today. he is capable of playing the kroos role effectively if he is allowed to grow. he passes well, has a good view of d entire field, can maneuver is way out of trouble and he is confident.

as for odegaard, I tot he was too average, too light weight, just too average..I will loan him out for 2 seasons and then another 2 again.
Asensio was like a bully, he was way ahead of all of them...

enzo was fair. mariano was haphazard like you said. The left back was awfulll.

judging from the first match, I will keep llorente and asensio

to the match, the goals were just annoying and avoidable except the 3rd, it was a good piece of play.

we played 10 times better with the youths in second half. I particularly laud the speed with which they were passing and their movement out of tight spaces.

lastly, 442 should be disbanded worldwide. there should be a law against it. lacks width, defensive cover and creativity.

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Post by Mr Nick09 on Thu Jul 28, 2016 2:48 am

I cant make any conclusions out of that game. Llorente played well, but if you tell me he is first team ready based of that thwn we need to get rid of Nacho asap

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Post by halamadrid2 on Thu Jul 28, 2016 2:56 am

@ shade, agree with all points besides Odegaard. Thought he was really good just a little lightweight so should go out on loan in order to bulk up alittle bit. The 2nd goal was just wtf, someone should have just taken him when he started running past all those players. I think the 442 can work but Kova is abit immature for that disciplined CM role, also our defenders were atrocious in the first half, now I expect that from Marcelo in a friendly but Danilo and Nacho were just horrendous

Want to see Llorente and Asensio from start next game with the starters. Want to see how they play with them. I know these are just friendlies but please no Danilo ffs
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Post by shadexticos on Thu Jul 28, 2016 2:59 am

@mrnick
nah. I noticed the old heads were kind of sluggish..more like "lets warm up boys, its just a preseason". but we all know the youths play like its a final and put their all. The assessment only stands for the youth and not the entire team....

but I hate 442. I hope we can cook something up..

I really wish jese goes on loan or a morata sale and buy back, the potential is there. I strongly believe if he can catch up on lost time, he would be good enough to attract interest of all top clubs and become a permanent fixture in the national team.....

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Post by shadexticos on Thu Jul 28, 2016 3:03 am

danilo will never make it in madrid...who scouted him...of all d transfer battles with barca, we won the wrong one.
they were all below average in the first half..
I'm loving psgs passing game

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Post by FalcaoPunch on Thu Jul 28, 2016 6:22 am

Missed the game I swear I read online that the game was tomorrow (Thursday)

But oh well I'll give it a watch despite the result
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Post by Valkyrja on Thu Jul 28, 2016 6:53 am

@sportsczy wrote:At Inter, the tried him everywhere. Played holding mid and looked about as good there as Kroos did... he was ok at CM... but he really shined when he was allowed to attack. He's got superior technique and speed (i thought it was Serie A; but he's genuinely fast).

So I don't know. Maybe he can become a better CM. But his best position at Inter was more of a attacking mid, although not to the extent that James and Isco were.


That's not true sports. Even Robes said that he played his best football for inter in that regista role. He's really good at carrying the ball from deep.

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Post by sportsczy on Thu Jul 28, 2016 7:38 am

I actually remember Robes saying that Kova was horrible playing low... pretty clearly actually.

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Post by Turok_TTZ on Thu Jul 28, 2016 11:35 am

There will be times where we must suffer defeat now in order to triumph later on. PSG did well to take their chances.

Well in the any case we still have plenty of time before the season starts.

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